can you say something nice about dragon age 2

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Sp3ratus

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Joccaren said:
Quite simple really. Walking out as the enemy preps it's attack animation, walking back in after to attack again for most, however there are rogue abilities dedicated to jumping away from enemies as well. You can play with tactics if you want to, but it's also not too difficult to just time your movements and solo most encounters in an action game way. I say most because there were those BS times where you were surrounded by 6+ lieutenants and a general in a small room that would perma stun your party unless you ran through the nearest door and kept them coming 1 at a time.
As far as I remember, you could walk away, while an enemy was in his/her attack animation in DA:O too, especially since some of them where way slower than they are in DA2.

Also, I'll say that just because someone chooses to cheese encounters in a game, doesn't make it more actiony. You could cheese the hell out of BG2(for an example) as well, yet I hardly hear any complaints about that.

A large part of it is because what I said is 100% true - the combat IS button spam. Every time you want to attack, you have I press a button. No designate target then issue special orders, you've got to spam that button like there's no tomorrow. It's the default game mode, and whilst there is an option for it, it either does nothing or I cancelled every time anything happens other than your character doing a normal attack, including enemies attacking you, which made it quite pointless.
If that's the case, then you have to play on a higher difficulty. DA2 is anything but a button spammer on nightmare. If you go ahead with that strategy, your party will be stains on the ground within seconds of combat.

As for less strategy, I'd say yeah - it takes a more action game approach to strategy. Unless you remember each level and encounter from a previous attempt or play through, you have no way to plan for the battle. You cant see the enemies before you get there and plan how I take them out, partially because you are attacked almost the moment you do sight them, and partially because they spawn in afterwords from god knows where. You can have a general set of tactics, but rarely need specialised tactics for encounters. The lack of enemy variety kinda adds to that too.
I don't understand how having to deal with additional enemies(waves) makes the game more actiony. The way I see it, you have a strategy for how to deal with the initial group of enemies, one which needs to be changed whenever the enemy setup changes. For an example, if an enemy assassin shows up, I go for him immediately, because I know how deadly they can be. Or if I see an Arcane Horror, I spread my party out, as to limit the AoE damage to one character. That's all part of the strategy of how to deal with specific encounters. After the initial enemies are dead/the next wave spawns, you can pause the game, which I found to be quite necessary and readjust your strategy, ie where your allies are standing, what target to focus on next, is it necessary to use CDs on this encounter and so on.

All of that is to me, how to set up a strategy and use different tactics to defeat the enemies at hand.
 

Another

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FelixG said:
Another said:
The concept of a single characters rise to fame spanning 10 years in a single city was actually a cool idea. Baaaaaad execution.
I am suddenly reminded that they seemed to time skip over some of the really interesting stuff. "Oh hey you want to be a bad ass merc to earn your way into the city? Righto!" Timeskip "Well good job, you sure were a badass, off into the city with you!"
Exactly what I meant. And like I said, It had the potential to be awesome! There are so many RPG's where you are "THE ONLY ONE WHO CAN SAVE US!!!" So the idea of a more personal, local story was really cool.

Also, besides the timeskips, I really wish the city had changed over time. That way even if we did go back to old locations, things would have changed, which could have solved the repetitious locations issue. :/

Ah well, I enjoyed it for what it was. Wasn't terrible honestly, just painfully mediocre.
 

Joccaren

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Sp3ratus said:
As far as I remember, you could walk away, while an enemy was in his/her attack animation in DA:O too, especially since some of them where way slower than they are in DA2.

Also, I'll say that just because someone chooses to cheese encounters in a game, doesn't make it more actiony. You could cheese the hell out of BG2(for an example) as well, yet I hardly hear any complaints about that.
In my experience you still got hit. If you were 5 metres away by the time the animation finished, you still got hit. Its why my characters often went flying in random directions on my first few playthroughs - I'd try to dodge a knockback move, but it would still register as a hit thanks to where I was when the animation started, and I would go flying backwards from my new position in a completely different direction to what I was hit from and logically should fly in. Maybe I just wasn't good enough at it, but it wasn't something you got away with all that often - also thanks to the fact that whilst the attack animations were slower, you walked far slower too.

And I'd hardly call it cheesing when you're doing it in a way that the game is telling you to - with Rogue abilities - or doing it to dodge something like one of the ogres ridiculously long recharge time attacks [I sweat they are slower than in Origins]. Its not really going against the game design when the game is designed to let you jump in and out of combat a lot easier. Its more following it IMO.

If that's the case, then you have to play on a higher difficulty. DA2 is anything but a button spammer on nightmare. If you go ahead with that strategy, your party will be stains on the ground within seconds of combat.
If you weren't spamming buttons on the higher difficulties you were dead. If you weren't hitting a button, you weren't doing anything. If you weren't doing anything, you were going to get your ass kicked.

I don't understand how having to deal with additional enemies(waves) makes the game more actiony. The way I see it, you have a strategy for how to deal with the initial group of enemies, one which needs to be changed whenever the enemy setup changes. For an example, if an enemy assassin shows up, I go for him immediately, because I know how deadly they can be. Or if I see an Arcane Horror, I spread my party out, as to limit the AoE damage to one character. That's all part of the strategy of how to deal with specific encounters. After the initial enemies are dead/the next wave spawns, you can pause the game, which I found to be quite necessary and readjust your strategy, ie where your allies are standing, what target to focus on next, is it necessary to use CDs on this encounter and so on.

All of that is to me, how to set up a strategy and use different tactics to defeat the enemies at hand.
Its not a matter of having to deal with additional enemies, its how the enemies are introduced. You can't fore-plan for it. You can't sit back, scope out the situation, make your preparations, then attack - you're just thrust in there, and then things change. And they change again. Yes it requires a shift of tactics, but it also takes out much of the fore planning of battles, forcing you to react during the battle as opposed to strategising before hand.
Everything you said applies to many non MMS action games too. Strategy exists in both, its how its approached that makes DA2 feel more like an action game to most, even with the pause button.
 

Thespian

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Yeah, no... I mean Dragon Age II is like... It's totally not good. What with the watered down combat and lack of depth, not to mention the other things that are bad. Oh how bad those things are. I especially hated all the FUN I HAD PLAYING BECAUSE IT WAS THE BEST THING EVER

Yeah sorry I really liked this game. I loved so many things about it and I preferred it to Dragon Age: Origins (which I did play first). I thought the Qunari and the Arishok were both fascinating and engrossing. I loved all of the characters like the compassionate but misled Anders, the gentle but determined Merril, undeniably lovable Varric and how could I fail to mention the moral backbone of our group, the firm and lawful Aveline.
Not that I liked everyone, oh no. Isabella, the selfish pirate who let her problems engulf her at the cost of the team, and of course the surly, bigoted Fenris whose recurring clashes with Hawke over his mage sister and friends inevitably led towards their rivalry and eventual battle to the death.

I loved how the admittedly empty Kirkwall began to feel like such a home, how I developed a history there and truly felt the impact of the years I had spent within it's walls (regardless of the random bands of ninjas that would leap out at you in the middle of big courtyards and valleys).

Mostly I love the way the story isn't about a rising hero destined to save the whozit from lord whatsits evil army of mabobs like DA:O was. This was just the remarkable story of a refugee and his family trying to get by.

It's the sort of game that really stimulated growth in relationships between me/Hawke and the other characters and the environment.
I know I just gushed out everything I liked in a semi-coherent ramble, but... yeah.
 

Knight Captain Kerr

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Dragon Age 2 did a lot wrong. But at the same time it did a few things right. This video shows some of the good things Dragon Age 2 did.
 

Sp3ratus

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Joccaren said:
And I'd hardly call it cheesing when you're doing it in a way that the game is telling you to - with Rogue abilities - or doing it to dodge something like one of the ogres ridiculously long recharge time attacks [I sweat they are slower than in Origins]. Its not really going against the game design when the game is designed to let you jump in and out of combat a lot easier. Its more following it IMO.
I think I might've either mistunderstood or misworded it then. Using the in-game rogue abilites are, of course not, cheesing, it wasn't my intention to imply that. What I meant to say was that I find the process of getting aggro and then manually moving your character a few feet backwards and out of range, forcing the enemy to follow you, while the three other characters bash on that enemy, is cheesing, ie kiting mobs. To me, that's a cheesing strategy, because beating the encounter with provided abilites, you're abusing a less-than-stellar AI.

If you weren't spamming buttons on the higher difficulties you were dead. If you weren't hitting a button, you weren't doing anything. If you weren't doing anything, you were going to get your ass kicked.
I think we might be speaking about different versions of the game, then. I played on PC and that version didn't require constant button mashing, because of auto-attack. If that's the case, then it certainly makes sense as to why we have such a different view of the game.

Its not a matter of having to deal with additional enemies, its how the enemies are introduced. You can't fore-plan for it. You can't sit back, scope out the situation, make your preparations, then attack - you're just thrust in there, and then things change. And they change again. Yes it requires a shift of tactics, but it also takes out much of the fore planning of battles, forcing you to react during the battle as opposed to strategising before hand.
Everything you said applies to many non MMS action games too. Strategy exists in both, its how its approached that makes DA2 feel more like an action game to most, even with the pause button.
I can agree to that, it's true you can't plan ahead on how to deal with an encounter, because the waves system requires a different sort of tactical thinking. The point I think we disagree on is whether that is bad or not. I don't think having to adjust your tactics on-the-fly is a terrible thing. I like both approach, I enjoy DA:O as well as DA2. I do think that having to deal with the unexpected can provide a greater challenge though, because it requires you to really consider if using this or that cooldown is required to be used now or if you can save it for the next wave. As I've said, I also think the repositioning during combat adds another layer in tactical considerations, because you have to know where your allies are at all times and move them out of harm's way, if required. That wasn't really the case with DA:O, because you had fighters in the front, squishies in the back. Again, it might be because we're talking about different versions of the game(if that's not the case however, I apologize).
 

kannibus

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Actually I found it to be a fairly decent romp. The plot/story was fairly nice and of course I fell in love with all the snarky responses. Combat was much improved from DA:O and I didn't have as much inventory overload as I did in DA:O or Mass Effect. I also thought the characters were nifty and I really liked how their back stories worked to enhance the main plot. Overall I'd give it 3.5 out of 5. It wasn't a super spectacular piece of awesome, but it was a fun time.
 

Creator002

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Dragon Age 2 is my favourite out of the series, so I can't not say something nice about it. I prefer the combat and dialogue system to Origins, especially since the player is also voice acted and, while the story lacks in comparison to Origins, it holds up on its own as a good one. The characters are brilliant as well. Especially Varric (the dwarf).
The only real bad thing I can say about it is that you can't choose your race, which isn't THAT big of a deal and it plays better on PC than console. Considering it came out in 2011, buying it on PC requires an above average system, if memory serves me correctly.
 

00slash00

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gmaverick019 said:
while i'd give DA and awakening a 9/10
since you mentioned awakening, i have another question for you. how much would you say awakening is worth? i have a boxed copy of origins (which ive heard is not compatible with the steam version of awakening). DA:O and DA:A bundled together is currently on sale on steam for about $7.50. in your opinion, is that sale worth jumping on, just so i can play awakening, even though i already own origins?
 
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00slash00 said:
gmaverick019 said:
while i'd give DA and awakening a 9/10
since you mentioned awakening, i have another question for you. how much would you say awakening is worth? i have a boxed copy of origins (which ive heard is not compatible with the steam version of awakening). DA:O and DA:A bundled together is currently on sale on steam for about $7.50. in your opinion, is that sale worth jumping on, just so i can play awakening, even though i already own origins?
yeah it's worth it, awakening imo is the best out of the 3 dragon age things put out so far (although play through origins first them import your save, it is delightful)

it's not worth buying all the DLC seperately through bioware/EA, it's much more worth it to have the complete edition for 7.50

(in awakening the customization trees open up more and there is buttloads of mods for it too seperately of origin, or compatible with both)
 

Nothing Tra La La

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I loved DA2. The story and lore was nowhere near as in-depth or interesting as Origins, but I found it to be much more fun to play.
As with most of BioWare's games, I loved the companions. Isabela is one of my all time favorite game characters.
Sure the game has flaws (the repetitive use of maps was pretty awful), but overall it's really fun and has a lot of replayability.
 

00slash00

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gmaverick019 said:
00slash00 said:
gmaverick019 said:
while i'd give DA and awakening a 9/10
since you mentioned awakening, i have another question for you. how much would you say awakening is worth? i have a boxed copy of origins (which ive heard is not compatible with the steam version of awakening). DA:O and DA:A bundled together is currently on sale on steam for about $7.50. in your opinion, is that sale worth jumping on, just so i can play awakening, even though i already own origins?
yeah it's worth it, awakening imo is the best out of the 3 dragon age things put out so far (although play through origins first them import your save, it is delightful)

it's not worth buying all the DLC seperately through bioware/EA, it's much more worth it to have the complete edition for 7.50

(in awakening the customization trees open up more and there is buttloads of mods for it too seperately of origin, or compatible with both)
thank you, youve convinced me. now the agonizing process of waiting for a game to install on steam, in the middle of the holiday sale. ive been wanting to replay origins anyway, this gives me an excuse. maybe ill try dwarf noble this time. was not impressed with my first playthrough as wild elf or whatever they were called. felt like they could have done much more with that story
 

Joccaren

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Sp3ratus said:
I think we might be speaking about different versions of the game, then. I played on PC and that version didn't require constant button mashing, because of auto-attack. If that's the case, then it certainly makes sense as to why we have such a different view of the game.
I played on the PC, though as outlined in my first post the Auto-Attack function did a grand total of bugger all for me. Either it was broken in general or it cancelled any time anything but a normal attack by your character happened - if an enemy attacked you, it cancelled, if you activated an ability, it cancelled, if you checked your inventory - and didn't even use anything - it cancelled, and your character would just stand there. Maybe I ended up with a buggy and broken version somehow, but that function was not working for me, which got quite annoying by end game.

I can agree to that, it's true you can't plan ahead on how to deal with an encounter, because the waves system requires a different sort of tactical thinking. The point I think we disagree on is whether that is bad or not. I don't think having to adjust your tactics on-the-fly is a terrible thing. I like both approach, I enjoy DA:O as well as DA2. I do think that having to deal with the unexpected can provide a greater challenge though, because it requires you to really consider if using this or that cooldown is required to be used now or if you can save it for the next wave. As I've said, I also think the repositioning during combat adds another layer in tactical considerations, because you have to know where your allies are at all times and move them out of harm's way, if required. That wasn't really the case with DA:O, because you had fighters in the front, squishies in the back. Again, it might be because we're talking about different versions of the game(if that's not the case however, I apologize).
Eh, I never said that it was worse, just more action oriented. Its not for me, that style of gameplay, but that all depends on tastes as opposed to quality. I was somewhat disappointed with the lack of enemy variety, and how often they relied on cheese tactics like massive swarms or perma stunning to fight, but those were probably the only overall problems with the system I had, beyond not really liking its new direction.
 

lunavixen

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gmaverick019 said:
...wait, you LOVED IT? i know people have at least tolerated it, but you LOVED IT? I am so baffled I don't even know what to say. opinions,man...
i quite liked the ending to ME3 as well, the extended cut made it better thaan the original, more closure.

anyway, getting back on topic, DA:II did have a few flaws, dungeons being the big one. The combat has been more streamlined and feels more involded than DA:O. I thought it is a pretty good game, not the greatest, but not the worst, if you can pick it up fairly cheap, then I say go for it.
 

StBishop

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I enjoyed the pacing of the attack animations, the cross class synergy things seemed like a good idea (even if I never bothered with them), I liked most of the characters and loved some, I though the first half of the story was fucking awesome.

That enough for you?
 
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00slash00 said:
gmaverick019 said:
00slash00 said:
gmaverick019 said:
while i'd give DA and awakening a 9/10
since you mentioned awakening, i have another question for you. how much would you say awakening is worth? i have a boxed copy of origins (which ive heard is not compatible with the steam version of awakening). DA:O and DA:A bundled together is currently on sale on steam for about $7.50. in your opinion, is that sale worth jumping on, just so i can play awakening, even though i already own origins?
yeah it's worth it, awakening imo is the best out of the 3 dragon age things put out so far (although play through origins first them import your save, it is delightful)

it's not worth buying all the DLC seperately through bioware/EA, it's much more worth it to have the complete edition for 7.50

(in awakening the customization trees open up more and there is buttloads of mods for it too seperately of origin, or compatible with both)
thank you, youve convinced me. now the agonizing process of waiting for a game to install on steam, in the middle of the holiday sale. ive been wanting to replay origins anyway, this gives me an excuse. maybe ill try dwarf noble this time. was not impressed with my first playthrough as wild elf or whatever they were called. felt like they could have done much more with that story
yeah that was the least well done origins story of the bunch, i'm usually boring and go with human noble but dwarf is fun.

definitely would recommend you download these for origin/awakening:

http://dragonage.nexusmods.com/mods/topalltime/?adult=0

Seriously, the top page has some fantastic mods for it, especially the redesigned ones (the redesign of morrigan/leliana are amazing.) not to mention if you don't like the fade as much as everyone i know does, "skip the fade" is essential (as soon as you enter the fade, it drags you to the end boss of the fade, so it doesn't skip the whole circle bit.)

also on this page, there are some great "projects (a.k.a. mods)" for dragon age 1 and 2

http://social.bioware.com/browse_bw_projects.php

as great as the games are, the little tweaks/add ons here and there really make the games more enjoyable.
 

xxcloud417xx

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CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!

A good thing about Dragon Age 2 is that... ummm...

well shit... I bit off more than I could chew with this challenge...