Ditching someone who friend zones you (Edited)

[Treeinthewoods]

If you want to have sex with someone who thinks you're her friend, and you stop being friends with her because she won't have sex with you, doesn't that make you kind of a dick?

I'm honestly asking, I've never really understood social behavior.

Where you fail is in your assumption that the person placed in the friendzone was only pursuing sex and not a truly romantic and fulfilling relationship. Being around someone who you truly love who doesn't reciprocate can be quite painful so distance can be required to allow the romantic desire to fade away.

I find it odd how many people here simply assume that men are only after sex when they express romantic interest in someone, it's a pretty sad and cynical way to view social interaction.

 

[Phil the Nervous]

If you want to have sex with someone who thinks you're her friend, and you stop being friends with her because she won't have sex with you, doesn't that make you kind of a dick?

I'm honestly asking, I've never really understood social behavior.

Where you fail is in your assumption that the person placed in the friendzone was only pursuing sex and not a truly romantic and fulfilling relationship. Being around someone who you truly love who doesn't reciprocate can be quite painful so distance can be required to allow the romantic desire to fade away.

I find it odd how many people here simply assume that men are only after sex when they express romantic interest in someone, it's a pretty sad and cynical way to view social interaction.

You've meshed two disparate statements together and come out with the wrong point, My views were
A. A general confusion about relationships as a whole and
B. A mild depression that males who stay friends with girls who don't wish to date are in the minority, I simply used sex as a point because it falls in the base of the theoretical hierarchy of needs
Also, that was kind of rude, there's no need to say that someone 'fails' as your introduction.

 

[Lilani]

Ok knowing this will likely end up causing a shit storm but I really do want to hear others thoughts. Ok I?ve seen before some say that ditching someone after you find out they don?t want to have relationship with you is for the best since it will end up just making you bitter. Others say that you should stick it and let the feeling go away since you?ll still have a friend afterwards.
So how do you feel about this?

EDIT

Ok I want to clear some things up thanks for the advice but what brough it up was this. I just though it'd be an intresting point of conversation. So please stop mailing me I'm not even looking for a relationship. Thank you for the support tho.
Spoilers for watch dogs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5AP_tkSx84

Too as a said in a later post you can be friend with benfits and still. Devolpe feeling for someone with out it being returns. To quote Jeff Foxworthy. ?Getting married for sex is like buying a 747 for the free peanuts.?

Last I used friendzone becuase people know what that is the bigger words escaped me at 12 midnight.

That all thank you everyone back to the debate.

To answer your original question there, I think it depends on you and the person. I basically "friendzoned" a guy a while back--we were friends, he liked me romantically and began to flirt with me, and I quietly but respectfully declined. I basically left the ball in his court, he could break off contact from that point or keep being friends. He chose to stay friends, which for us was interacting on Facebook and going to the same school club. And now things are back the way they were, at least as far as I know. Could this really be bothering him, and could he still want me even though I have a boyfriend? Possibly, but he hasn't indicated this to me in any way, and if it does bother him it's completely in his power to break off contact with me. But I'm not going to make any assumptions about his feelings, one way or another.

So basically, if you find things awkward then break it off. But if you can easily though slip back into a friendship then do that, or perhaps just give it some time and wait and see. Just whatever works for you and them.

 

[Treeinthewoods]

You've meshed two disparate statements together and come out with the wrong point, My views were
A. A general confusion about relationships as a whole and
B. A mild depression that males who stay friends with girls who don't wish to date are in the minority, I simply used sex as a point because it falls in the base of the theoretical hierarchy of needs
Also, that was kind of rude, there's no need to say that someone 'fails' as your introduction.

Perhaps your confusion about relationships starts with an assumption that a person who desires someone else romantically is only pursuing sex. As for the number of guys who choose to remain friends I would ask you how many guys do that and if needing space to allow feelings of romantic interest to pass truly makes someone a dick as opposed to a normal person dealing with rejection in a healthy way.

 

[Lucem712]

[II|:{

I'm just curious who is rounding up all the girls and telling them to seek power and not love...I want in on the business, is what I'm saying.

I just think in regards to the 'Friend-Zone', if someone is worthy of your affection, they are also worthy of your friendship. It isn't a waste of time to be friends with someone and have enjoyable moments with them. Besides, who knows, maybe you would be been awful for each other. Especially if she gave you a pity-date or fuck after seeing you struggle so long to cross the gap. Friends do not always make good lovers & vice versa.[footnote]Also, surprising to some people, women also get "friendzoned" by friends/aspired lovers who are not interested in committed relationships or who only want to fuck them occasionally. Or, you know, aren't attracted to them because not all women can glance at a group of men and have them chasing for her skirt. Not a personal experience as an Aromantic, but one I've seen plenty of times. Not to say either women or men are bad, just an observation.[/footnote]

 

[game-lover]

As a female, I don't agree with those whose think this whole issue can be simply relegated to just wanting to have sex with someone. It's more than that.

Sure, friendship is a relationship but it's not exactly special. What you do with one friend, you're very likely to do with the other. In most cases. And while that's all fine and dandy, there's nothing especially significant in my mind. For one . there's the intimacy factor.

Tell me straight up if you're as intimate in an emotional way with your girlfriend/boyfriend as you are with your other friends.

Even though it was a comedy thing on American Dad, I heard a line that seems to sum stuff up.

"I have friends."

For me, that says all or nothing. I bet the average person wants all or nothing in their lives. Because anything else is settling.

 

[Phil the Nervous]

You've meshed two disparate statements together and come out with the wrong point, My views were
A. A general confusion about relationships as a whole and
B. A mild depression that males who stay friends with girls who don't wish to date are in the minority, I simply used sex as a point because it falls in the base of the theoretical hierarchy of needs
Also, that was kind of rude, there's no need to say that someone 'fails' as your introduction.

Perhaps your confusion about relationships starts with an assumption that a person who desires someone else romantically is only pursuing sex. As for the number of guys who choose to remain friends I would ask you how many guys do that and if needing space to allow feelings of romantic interest to pass truly makes someone a dick as opposed to a normal person dealing with rejection in a healthy way.

Possibly... Really likely actually, I've never been able to pick up on a difference between really good friends and couples
(and I wasn't trying to condemn the guys who wanted space, sorry that I came across as such)

 

[Spearmaster]

Hmm, and they say arranged marriages are crazy.

OT: There are to many factors coming into play to address the "friend zone" phenomena in one forum post all I can do is offer up some observations I have acquired over the years. All my opinion of course.

1) Most but not all guys that get "friend zoned" do it themselves to either a) test the waters to see how a person is as a friend to either confirm or deny their initial attractions to a person as worthwhile to avoid rejection or as b) a gateway to try and wiggle their way into their pants over time, or sadly c) a hormone driven messy mix of both. In both cases it involves a reveal that I'm positive most women perceive as a bait and switch attempt unless the woman also had some mutual attraction from the start, which is extremely rare. Both cases are just bad form altogether.

2) In cases where the friendship started out innocently and feelings developed over time you have to make those feelings known to the other party immediately no matter the circumstances otherwise you start investing yourself as if in a romantic relationship and they can only assume that you are just a good friend. A delayed reveal after you have been treating them this way because of your feelings changing can be a far bigger let down than it needed to be and lead to misdirected anger.

3) In some cases people will try and use your affections, even if they were related from the beginning, to take advantage of you. Its not always malign, sometimes its subconscious. In these cases you are being "friend zoned" and should a)sever all romantic interest and never treat them any different than you would any other friend and see if they still want to be friends or b) just cut and run.

How I handle the "friend zone"

Me: Hey, you want to go out?

Them: Like a date?

Me: Yeah.

Them: Well we could go out as friends.

Me: Naa, that's OK, I'm not really looking for more friends.

Them:...

Me: (walking away)

...its that easy.

 

[Colour Scientist]

Western society empowers women to step outside of their gender for the sake of power. Women have been taught to seek power, not respect and love.

I would absolutely love to hear you elaborate on this further.
Please, do tell me how all women have been taught to seek power rather than love and respect?

Something tells me it might just be because one woman didn't want your "love and respect."

 

[Vault101]

Take a look at what this man is doing: he's balancing. Relationships are a lot like that. When you meet a girl, you're walking that razor's edge between friend and boyfriend material. How you present yourself, how you speak, how you communicate without words, all of that and more factor into what side you fall into. How do you carry yourself? Do you walk with your head held high? Where do you keep your drink at a party: is it in front of your chest, acting as a barrier, or is it down at your side? How do you sit? Do you sit hunched up and timid or stretched out and relaxed?

I find it hard to belvie such subtle things are going to influence weather or not I sleep with a guy, UNLESS of coarse I get the impression he doesn't want to talk to me

eather I'm gonna get with him or I'm not....and if youre talking about Long term Reltiship then it goes deeper with how you present yourself on first impressions


[quote/]Step 1: Make your feelings perfectly clear. "I want you, I don't want to be your friend, I want something more." Be 100% direct, no bull, don't beat around the bush, put it all on the table. If you truly want her as a woman then do not settle for being "just friends."[/quote]
this is really all you need..minus the douchyness...make your inentions clear and then BAM no "freindzone" none of the PUA bullshit

[quote/]Step 2: If she says no, or she's hesitant, DROP HER. Meet other women. You need to be willing to drop it at a moment's notice, no skin off your back. If she knows that you need her, she's free to take advantage of you and do whatever the hell she wants. This is bad news.[/quote]not every women is a harpy out to get you..its a bad attitude to have

[quote/]Step 3: In this "separation," meet other women! Get to know new people! Pick up a hobby and better yourself! I highly recommend studying up on body language in the meantime, as it will help your game in the long run, and if you're not familiar with it, practice being playful and seductive.
.[/quote]
"game" oh lord...manipulation is just...yeah no...

 

[mecegirl]

If you liked her enough to consider her a friend before the feelings started up (I'm assuming that's how with happened) then frankly, do you really want to give up this relationship just because she is uncomfortable taking it to the next level? The feelings will pass, just let them go. Don't let HER go.

Also random note...how come guys are never accused of putting girls in the friend zone?

This isn't for all women but a lot tend to internalize things. Especially younger women, so it kinda mirrors the whole "friendzoning" thing because its generally an issue for younger men. And it's a part of the socialization more than anything inherent. So if a guy rejects a girl she is more likely to think that she needs to improve in some way to impress him. So she will most likely try loosing weight, or change her make up/clothing. If she's tomboyish she may even consider behaving in more stereotypically feminine ways. She will find the "faults" within herself and obsess/try to fix them instead of pushing the blame on someone else.

But there is also the likelihood of a woman doing all of that before any rejection can happen. She will find out all she can about the guy she likes, especially the type of girls he is attracted to. If she just decides that he isn't in her league she will move on. If not then she will come with her best while asking him. Or more commonly, she will take the passive approach and just make sure that she is as attractive as possible while "hanging out" around him and try to flirt in order to gain his interest so he will ask her out. But even if he doesn't ask her out she will still internalize, and try harder to get his attention next time.

 

[L. Declis]

I have just been reminded of a theory I have.

The rise of the "friendzone" has a direct link; romantic comedies and the like. This is in regard for both men and women.

In these kind of films, we see the plucky underdog win the girl by being a good friend, by hiding his feelings and doing big romantic gestures that always win her everytime. Young men are taught by media "this is how you win a girl". Be her friend. Get to know her. And then by being a friend, when you confess, she probably will accept you.

Which is usually not how it goes in my experience. Because of these expectations, they do what your romantic comedies say to do, and then when it doesn't work, they feel betrayed by the women for not doing what they've been taught should happen.

The idea is that if you keep TRYING to convince them to date you, if you just hang around long enough, if you let them cry on your shoulder enough times, EVENTUALLY they'll love you back.

Is it fair to either gender? No, not really. But it's my theory.

Also random note...how come guys are never accused of putting girls in the friend zone?

From what I'm reading here, most guys leave if they can't get sex so... no friend no zone :/

I have admitted in my post of friendzoning, so I can attest it is a two way street.

From my experience though, guys kinda look down on girls who try to force a relationship that isn't happening. The word "stalker" may be used.

Also, if a girl is offering a bloke sex or is indicating she would very much like some, he is probably going to take it if he is single.

If you liked her enough to consider her a friend before the feelings started up (I'm assuming that's how with happened) then frankly, do you really want to give up this relationship just because she is uncomfortable taking it to the next level? The feelings will pass, just let them go. Don't let HER go.

Also random note...how come guys are never accused of putting girls in the friend zone?

Hang around with more girls. I've had plenty of my female friends cry and tell me about how some guy they fancy doesn't fancy them back. They don't use the word "friendzone", but that's what they mean.

Also, it can suck to be friends with someone you're romantically interested in. So, you really like her? And you watch her go on multiple dates with other guys? And things go wrong, and she gets sad, and all you'll be thinking is "If she would give me a try, I'm sure I would do better. I'm sure I could make her happy."

It's a very particular kind of torture, and sometimes it's just not worth putting yourself through it.

 

[Netrigan]

My thoughts on the subject.

Trying to use friendship as a back door to a relationship is always a very iffy strategy, so if the attempt to do a Friend Upgrade is anything other than a natural development of your feelings, then you're just being stupid. If you do find yourself developing feelings for a friend, then ask her out before those feelings get away from you. The longer you let the feelings stew without a resolution, the harder it is to get back to normal.

If you only gained her friendship as a pretext for a romantic/sexual relationship, then there's really no point hanging around after you've been shot down. As noted before, you picked the absolute worst strategy for success and one that earns you asshole points.

 

[Hagi]

My thoughts on the subject.

Trying to use friendship as a back door to a relationship is always a very iffy strategy, so if the attempt to do a Friend Upgrade is anything other than a natural development of your feelings, then you're just being stupid. If you do find yourself developing feelings for a friend, then ask her out before those feelings get away from you. The longer you let the feelings stew without a resolution, the harder it is to get back to normal.

If you only gained her friendship as a pretext for a romantic/sexual relationship, then there's really no point hanging around after you've been shot down. As noted before, you picked the absolute worst strategy for success and one that earns you asshole points.

Have to strongly disagree with this.

Friendship is a perfectly normal and much-used form of courtship. Like all courtships of course it won't be successful every time but there's absolutely no shortage of instances of it leading to successful relationships.

The friend-zone issue lies not using using friendships to establish relationships. It lies in not accepting the other party isn't interested.

Establishing a friendship with someone you're romantically interested in to get to know him/her, get on good terms and wait for a good time to progress it further, subsequently getting rejected and then either accepting it won't be more than a friendship or simply breaking it off altogether is in no way an asshole thing to do.

The asshole thing to do is neither accepting it won't be more than a friendship nor breaking it off. The asshole thing to do is, even after you've gotten rejected, to keep pursuing the other party even if under the guise of friendship. That's the point where the friend-zone turns toxic, not before.

Simply using a friendship as a potential entry into a romantic relationship is not toxic, is not an asshole-thing to do and is not an iffy strategy. Rather, it's how millions of people lead their love lives and meet their partners. You just have to accept when the other says no.

 

[MeTalHeD]

He felt ripped off hence his anger. If someone cons you out of your cash for a bad product, the greater the investment, the angrier you will get and the greater the damage. Both lead to emotional pain.

Exept that according to him, she never gave him any false hope or asked for any of those things and always told him she didn't want that kind of relationship with him.

If someone cons you, they are deceiving you, if someone tells you they are interested in a romantical relationship but actually has no intention of returning those feelings or letting the relationship change, then it would be similar.
Or if indeed you think someone is offering you friendship but in fact just is hoping they get to have sex with you or be in a romantic relationship.

Giving gifts to someone, or helping them, or being nice to them doesn't mean they are oblicated to have sex with you or become your boyfriend or a wife or even a friend.

Getting mad over it is like getting mad that throwing money at someone didn't make them give their car to you.

I like the analogy, but it is a bit off. In this case she took some of the cash used it for something else, but still didn't give him what he asked for. Sure, she said she was never going to give the car, but hell why did she take the cash then?

She accepted his help when she was in trouble. She was definitely not obligated to do anything but she unfortunately did manipulate him a little bit by contacting him whenever she needed him, knowing he had feelings for her. The simplest solution would have been to say no from his side (which he tried but failed at). Also, when he said he wanted more, she should have stopped it too because it was hurting him.

I said in a previous post that the tough part to accept is that he did this to himself, which would add to his anger (he might be angry at himself more than her). He hoped it would change her mind and it didn't. He hoped that by throwing money at the person they would sell the car instead of giving him a few rides. They used some of the cash to head through the drive through so he thought "aha! they want the money" and then he proceeded to give more. It's a very murky issue because by accepting SOME of the money he is throwing their way, it gives the impression there is hope for getting more from them, when there isn't. He admitted to that. What should happen is the person who doesn't want to sell the car should give the money back, not accept it. Don't take even a cent because it gives the other person false hope. It is not only the person throwing the money that is at fault. Both of them need to take responsibility.

He says, and I quote:

"Espescially since I was good enough to pay for her rent, living expenses, studies etc. when she didn't have a job(again, something she never explicitly asked for)"

When someone has romantic interest in you and you don't want to return those feelings, isn't it a bit strange to then accept things from them? Clearly at some point she must have figured something was up and she should have said "Listen, I can't accept this stuff because I know you're romantically interested, but I am not, and this is too much if all we're going to be doing is sleeping together. We need to part ways." If a woman gives you gifts and attention in the hope that you will date her, but you say you're not interested, then proceed to accept the gifts and attention, then clearly you're stringing her along. That is a form of deception and betrayal.

Saying he was stupid for what he did only places the responsibility on him and seemingly absolves her of wrongdoing - this is not acceptable especially considering they were both at fault. Both should have said no, not just him. She knew better but continued to accept the benefits without taking any responsibility. They both weren't thinking. He has a right to his anger even if it was stupid of him to continue to pursue her. Even if they said they aren't giving the car, taking the money is just pure selfishness and greed.

 

[stroopwafel]

-snip-

Well, let me just say there were other things that gave me hope, but they are too personal for me to share. That, and it still kinda hurts when I think about it too long.

I think the worst thing of all is, how could something that was so important to me mean nothing to her? In the end when she saw me so upset she admitted we had a very strong bond but that she eventually didn?t ''fall in love with me''. Then she just coldly said she ''wished me the best'' and that the only thing I could do was not contact her anymore from this moment on otherwise I could ''never let go''.

Now I know feelings are subjective. And what I interpreted as hope was maybe just reading the signs wrong. I realized this before ofcourse but everytime during our 5-year long endeavour I had given up hope there was this little ?sign? that immediately rekindled it.

Another thing is, what the mind knows isn?t necessarily what the heart desires. I probably bought her truck loads of presents over the years (jewelry, expensive clothes and lingerie etc.) in addition to the financial support. None of these things I did was b/c I wanted something from her but b/c I genuinely loved her and had this deep feeling of wanting to protect and support her and make her happy.

It wasn?t even all sex either. Many times we just talked for hours, watched a movie or went out for dinner. In my perception we were on the same level in every way imaginable. Same humour, thought about things the same and had a strong attraction to eachother. Sometimes I like to believe it was more difficult for her to say goodbye than she cared to admit, but that's probably just wishful thinking.

I guess the one thing that made me angry the most was just thinking, ??why, why don?t or can?t you see that what we have is so special??? Not even the money or knowing I was stupid but that empty, painful feeling of never seeing her again.

But well, there was nothing I could do about that anymore but to move on. Which I did. C?est la vie. Love hurts.

 

[Vegosiux]

Western society empowers women to step outside of their gender for the sake of power. Women have been taught to seek power, not respect and love.

I would absolutely love to hear you elaborate on this further.
Please, do tell me how all women have been taught to seek power rather than love and respect?

Something tells me it might just be because one woman didn't want your "love and respect."

The same way all men only do nice things for a woman to get into her pants, not because they actually wanted to do a nice thing for the woman, I suppose.

 

[Yopaz]

If someone is worth having a romantic relationship with, they are worth having a platonic relationship with.

But, if unable to move past the romantic desire and accept platonic friendship, it would be best to sever contact.

I'd say this is a fairly good answer that can be used in most cases.

I've never experienced rejection mainly because I don't have the balls to even try and I have never rejected anyone because I don't have the balls to respond in any way. The last time that happened I entered stealth mode until I thought it was safe to emerge (after birth of first son) so I am more comfortable with platonic friendships than relationships so I am probably the wrong person to ask about this.

However I have been hanging out with someone whom I had a mild crush on several occasions and those have been some of my most treasured friendships I've got, but then again, rejection hurts (or so I've heard) and it might be hard to move past that. If you can't get past the pain of rejection or let go of your feelings then a friendship might be too hard. The best thing would be to tell the person in question that you need some time, get a break, gather your thoughts sort out how you feel then make a decision. Staying near to a person you love but can't have will often result in bitterness and those annoying friend zone threads we see here from time to time.

Now this comes from someone who doesn't understand relationships or humans in general at all so take this with a few fistfuls of salt.

 

[Hazy]

I find it hard to belvie such subtle things are going to influence weather or not I sleep with a guy, UNLESS of coarse I get the impression he doesn't want to talk to me

eather I'm gonna get with him or I'm not....and if youre talking about Long term Reltiship then it goes deeper with how you present yourself on first impressions

Who would you rather be with: a man who carries himself with pride and confidence or a man who is more than happy to be life's doormat? Presenting yourself is great and all, but if you fall apart under pressure or when things get rough, then the cracks will start to show.

this is really all you need..minus the douchyness...make your inentions clear and then BAM no "freindzone" none of the PUA bullshit

What's douchey about that?

not every women is a harpy out to get you..its a bad attitude to have

No, not every woman is out to get you, but as I mentioned a few pages back, people are far more prone to devalue something when it's in plentiful supply. If your water could run out at a moment's notice, you bet that you'd savor every last drop.

"game" oh lord...manipulation is just...yeah no...

Game - How you carry yourself, how you present yourself, how you interact with others. There's no "manipulation" about it, unless you put a gun to their head and plan on outright making demands, which this post wasn't about doing in the slightest.

Do you project yourself into a conversation with ease, or do you stutter around, avoiding eye contact and talking way too fast? Are you clean shaven and dressed to kill?

 

[Doclector]

Honestly, I would. I have, in fact.

I would usually assume that if someone you confess your feelings for doesn't feel the same way, they probably don't want you around for at least a little while, simply because it's awkward and a little creepy. Add in the fact that you've humiliated yourself in front of that circle of friends, and it's safe to assume that you're not gonna be welcome around here for a while. Not that this is somehow unfair, it's the risk you take when you confess your feelings. It's only to be expected.

Hopefully it'd die down after a while, but sometimes it doesn't.

Other times, you may have to stay away because fuck, having feelings for someone who doesn't feel the same way hurts, doubly so if they're close. It's simply too painful, and y'know, I really don't care what someone may say about that being selfish. For one, I'm not somehow deluded into thinking people would miss my company all that much, and for another, what other solution is there? I've been told multiple times there is no way to simply rid yourself of those feelings, as much as I wish I could.

These days I pre-emptively stay away from people I have feelings for. That I would not suggest, it's a bad habit I've gotten into.