Doctor Who Series 6.2 'Day of the Moon' SPOILERS

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Two reasons I hate Stephen Moffat.

1) He deliberately knew how I'd react to Episode 1 and planted those seeds there.

2) He's now given me what he thinks I think, what he hopes I think and what he thinks I won't think....and muddled them up.

GGGGGGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Dammit...loved the episode.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

an interesting point to make is that since the 1103 year old Doctor died,

Oh, did he?

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Spoiler: OK, what do we KNOW about the little girl?

1. She was an orphan in the 1960s, despite having pictures of her with Amy Pond, a woman from 2011.

Spoiler

"What's a time head?"

 

[Temah]

I'm sorry but turning the human race into subconscious killers really doesn't seem like something the Doctor would do.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

I'll tell you what didn't sit right for me:

I don't like guns! Killing is wrong and I deposed a prime minister for it! Genocide is bad and I locked away my own people, a version of myself and stand against it no matter what!

Do I have the right? Simply touch one wire against the other and that's it. The Daleks cease to exist. Hundreds of millions of people, thousands of generations can live without fear... in peace, and never even know the word "Dalek".
Sarah-Jane: Then why wait? If it was a disease or some sort of bacteria you were destroying, you wouldn't hesitate.
'But if I kill. Wipe out a whole intelligent life form, then I become like them. I'd be no better than the Daleks.

I just made the entire human race into murderers through hypnosis and forced them to commit genocide! Problem, Shadow proclamation? Trolololololol

He didn't. They did.
I'd also point to Nice Mr. Tennant and the Family of Blood...

He never raised his voice. That was the worst thing - the fury of the Time Lord - and then we discovered why. Why this Doctor, who had fought with gods and demons, why he had run away from us and hidden. He was being kind. He wrapped my father in unbreakable chains forged in the heart of a dwarf star. He tricked my mother into the event horizon of a collapsing galaxy to be imprisoned there, forever. He still visits my sister, once a year, every year. I wonder if one day he might forgive her, but there she is. Can you see? He trapped her inside a mirror. Every mirror. If ever you look at your reflection and see something move behind you just for a second, that's her. That's always her. As for me, I was suspended in time and the Doctor put me to work standing over the fields of England, as their protector. We wanted to live forever. So the Doctor made sure we did.

Answer me this - just one question, that's all. If the Doctor had never visited us, if he'd never chosen this place... on a whim... would anybody here have died?

 

[ZeoAssassin]

an interesting point to make is that since the 1103 year old Doctor died,

Oh, did he?

well since we found out that the little girl is part time-lord...yes the 1003 Doctor IS dead.

my theory being that the little girl will sacrifice her regeneration powers to resurrect the Doctor so the series can continue in a Post-Smith world. but that's just me talking

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

an interesting point to make is that since the 1103 year old Doctor died,

Oh, did he?

well since we found out that the little girl is part time-lord...yes the 1003 Doctor IS dead.

Is that what we really saw? Or did we just think we did?

Like I said, I loathe Moffat at times. I mean, it would be terrible if his [sub]daughter?[/sub] killed him.

 

[Rough Sausage]

Surely the most interesting thing wasn't the fact that the kid could regenerate, but the fact that Amy was in a quantum state of pregnancy, i.e. Both pregnant and non-pregnant at the same time?

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Surely the most interesting thing wasn't the fact that the kid could regenerate, but the fact that Amy was in a quantum state of pregnancy, i.e. Both pregnant and non-pregnant at the same time?

How about if the child really is Amy/Rory's, then it's half plastic?

 

[AhumbleKnight]

To be fair, the sycorax were running away, and Harriet Jones shot them in the back. The Silence had manipulated Humanity throughout time and had no qualms about it whatsoever. The Doctor just manipulated their manipulation.

Also, Humanity needs to succeed to preserve the integrity of any timeline, the Silence don't.

Well that's just good for establishing a difference between 10 and 11. Remember the 8th Doctor fought a Time War that killed millions. And the 4th attempted retroactive genocide on the Daleks.

I just didn't think that the Doctor should have done that, it's too far out of his character even taking into account the previous examples. The main difference is that if the Daleks had sued for peace the Doctor would have stopped, in all previous examples of him doing that he's never pushed harder than he's had to, even with the immediate example I think of (10 and Lumic) he never wanted to do it. This time the Doctor didn't set the trap and explain what would happen if they carried on, he just did it.

That's it actually, having thought on it it's that:

1. He manipulated innocent humans into killing without their knowledge.
2. He didn't give the Silence a chance to surrender, he just killed them all. In every previous example he's at least given them a chance but in these two episodes he never offered a peaceful way out.

This wasn't even like it was a fixed point or that something needed to happen, he could have literally solved this however he'd wanted and the Doctor actively chose to slaughter tens of thousands. Even Davros got an out when he built the Reality Bomb.

The difference I see is that he is not commiting genocide. The silence will be perfectly safe and able to live out their lives in peace, so long as they stay away from humans (and their empire in the future). I quite like it because it means that any attempts to manipulate and control will be dangerous for them while living on their own planets will be perfectly safe.

 

[ZeoAssassin]

snip

I don't mean to be a dick but this is like the fifth time I've completed a reasoning chain on this and someone's requoted my OP. basically it wasn't the fact that he killed aliens (cause I kind of get he does that) it was the fact that he brainwashed all of humanity, which when the Master did it was evil and that the ancestors of this species will be dying for billions of years on worlds that were never involved in this.



So mostly it's because he took away humanity's free will and made them into a species comparable with the Daleks as far as this species is concerned.

well...
the Master never brainwashed anyone (assuming your only mentioning New Who). He projected his conscience onto the entire human race in a pretty much hive-mind kind of mind-control which is NOT what the Silence or the Doctor did.

the Silence have been using their post-hypnotic suggestion to pervert humanities freewill for their own use for 1000s of years, which is why we went to the moon..because it lead to inventing the Apollo tech that they needed for the suit and whatever else.

the Doctor turned the Silence's tricks against them in order to make humanity fight back at their oppressors which considering anyone who stops looking at the Silence forget them...making any resistance against them impossible, it wasn't outright killing all of the Silents at once but establishing that Earth will no longer be a save place for them so GTFO

the Silence destroying the Universe and hijacking the TARDIS destroyed any chance for a 2nd chance from the Doctor but what he did is still rather merciful to them considering what hes done to other threats.

not saying its the most ideal solution but i would hardly call that full fledged brainwashing

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

snip

I don't mean to be a dick but this is like the fifth time I've completed a reasoning chain on this and someone's requoted my OP.

Ah, my bad. I only just got time enough free to watch it.

basically it wasn't the fact that he killed aliens (cause I kind of get he does that) it was the fact that he brainwashed all of humanity, which when the Master did it was evil and that the ancestors of this species will be dying for billions of years on worlds that were never involved in this.

So mostly it's because he took away humanity's free will and made them into a species comparable with the Daleks as far as this species is concerned.

OK, I sort of get that. But even the Shadow Proclamation can't really touch him now. You could equally say that he did the same thing to the TimeLords...problem is with mixing the characterisations of Nathan Turner, RTD and Moffat.

There's a difference between what the Master and the Doctor did though. The Doctor did it to free humanity of the same thing. The Master just did it for the lulz.

 

[algalon]

There are allusions here to the library, with Amy's voice eerily coming through a spacesuit - which actually scared me for a second, and the doctor's connection to US Secret Service. I'm thinking when the Doctor finally catches up to the little girl, she'll be put under government custody and eventually become the library's keeper. What better mind than a timelord's to hold that much raw data?

 

[Jimmy T. Malice]

It looks like the Silence are trying to copy Time Lord technology, as evidenced by the appearance of a fake TARDIS like the one in The Lodger, and the little girl regenerating and tearing her way out of the space suit.

 

[TimeLord]

an interesting point to make is that since the 1103 year old Doctor died,

Oh, did he?

well since we found out that the little girl is part time-lord...yes the 1003 Doctor IS dead.

Is that what we really saw? Or did we just think we did?

Like I said, I loathe Moffat at times. I mean, it would be terrible if his [sub]daughter?[/sub] killed him.

£5 says you are right

 

[TimeLord]

Surely the most interesting thing wasn't the fact that the kid could regenerate, but the fact that Amy was in a quantum state of pregnancy, i.e. Both pregnant and non-pregnant at the same time?

How about if the child really is Amy/Rory's, then it's half plastic?

I'm pretty sure Rory became non-plastic when the Doctor threw himself into the exploding TARDIS in 'The Big Bang'.
Otherwise he would have used his gun hand against the Silence and/or the FBI and/or the Spaceman when it kills 1103

 

[CrazT]

I have two theories. The first is that there is a parallel dimension where the Doctor and Amy are together, and a doorway to said dimension was left open due to the crack in time last series, causing their offspring to come through

My other theory is that the child is a young River Song. Yes, the girl can regenerate, so you can't adult River? Well, maybe she has used up all of the regenerations by the time we meet her?

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

I'm pretty sure Rory became non-plastic when the Doctor threw himself into the exploding TARDIS in 'The Big Bang'.
Otherwise he would have used his gun hand against the Silence and/or the FBI and/or the Spaceman when it kills 1103

He stills remember being a Roman Centurion at times...when he lets that little door open in his mind...

But then, Amy isn't really human either...

 

[Merkavar]

im going to go with it being the doctor and thingos daughter. she will have twins. one being rory and hers and one will have a timehead.