Dutch culture from the viewpoint of an immigrant. (warning: rant, some swearing)

[The Artificially Prolonged]

snip

Well for what it's worth it doesn't sound like The Netherlands is any worse when come to intolerance to immigrants than other countries as the UK or any European country for that matter. Not saying that makes it okay but you just get idiots like that where ever you go in the world.

 

[Vuliev]

Don't worry, you probably won't see them unless you live in the rural parts of the Bible belt.

Eeehhhh, my university is pretty close to my grandparents, and they're pretty damn close to the belt. Home isn't, though, so I guess I can deal.

 

[sextus the crazy]

Don't worry, you probably won't see them unless you live in the rural parts of the Bible belt.

Eeehhhh, my university is pretty close to my grandparents, and they're pretty damn close to the belt. Home isn't, though, so I guess I can deal.

Don't worry. They're not really prevalent, there are just more than five of them now.

 

[Neonit]

Im sorry, but are you implying that im lying? No, no witches were burned, and no jews were beaten up - at least as far as i know. Sorry to disappoint you.
Trust me, i dont have to make up stories. I saw enough to write things that did happen.

Yes, I think you're lying. People don't get spat on spontaneously. Not even in the rare case of some ethnic hatred because you can't distinguish Polish from Dutch based on skin colour, and that's the only way you could identify someone as an immigrant on first sight.

You either made it up, or totally misinterpreted someone who spat on the ground just because he needed to get rid of someone. He was running remember? Sometimes people go on with that so long their throats dry out and such and you end up spitting things out because swallowing is hard.

Whatever the case I don't believe your story.

ahh i see. ok tell me, you see two people walking speaking in foreign language. this language seems to be east-European. you think its possible to figure out where they come from?

yes, i misinterpreted angry look and spat on the ground.

but if you dont believe my story, you're free to do so. its a free country.

 

[Alex Baas]

sadly my immagrant dutch-cannadian grandfather has some far right winged tendancies

 

[Thetwistedendgame]

This isn't and shouldn't be considered dutch "culture". This is hooliganism. A whole different thing.

 

[Theminimanx]

I once heard something about how PVV voters mainly lived in the smaller communities where there are fewer immigrants, so they don't know many themselves. Because of this they get all their information about them from the media, which have a tendancy of highlighting the bad parts about everything.
That might partially explain why you're having so much trouble with it, while don't notice all that much (I live in Eindhoven, around 200.000 people living here).

 

[Theminimanx]

I once heard something about how PVV voters mainly lived in the smaller communities where there are fewer immigrants, so they don't know many themselves.

And that would be untrue. They're mainly middle class, larger villages or small cities, and also found in those areas of said cities which aren't lower class housing. And the claim that there's no immigrants there is also exagerated. For one thing because not all immigrants are confined to the major cities (which is the implicit and quite dumb assumption behind saying that) and because many of the worst problems with immigrants do not occur in the major cities.

It's the Christian parties that reign supreme in the small villages in rural areas, or the conservative far left SP party if it's in the far northeast.

All right, fair enough. I was just speculating is all, and besides, it was ages ago when I heard that.

 

[ElPatron]

What you are facing is the general "hurr durr we civilized" the National-Socialists use as an excuse to perform those acts on the "less civilized".

The far-right sucks, the far-left sucks.

Ironically I feel better living near Asian immigrants than I did living near native whites whites. I'm very patriotic and all that, but Nationalism gets ridiculous when it comes to harassing immigrants.

And not paying in Greek restaurants? That's actually reason to call the police on those creeps.

What's happening in your place is happening just about everywhere in space and time when the economy gets worse. In the states, we've got tons of reactionary shitheads forming their own gun-toting militias because things are bad here.

Call me a reactionary shithead, but I would love to have friends like those in my city.

Every week I think to myself that it would be awesome to just meet up with a few people and leave everything behind if serious riots start destroying the city and looters start robbing everyone blind.

From your point of view, you see them as the kind of assholes that would start creating checkpoints and harassing people.

From my point of view, they are the people that are willing to just live in the woods if it's that what it takes to save their lives and possessions.

As an European most I can do is grab a baseball bat and do the fetal position while sucking my thumb. If I grab the guns everyone will think that I've watched way too much Mad Max.

 

[sextus the crazy]

What you are facing is the general "hurr durr we civilized" the National-Socialists use as an excuse to perform those acts on the "less civilized".

The far-right sucks, the far-left sucks.

Ironically I feel better living near Asian immigrants than I did living near native whites whites. I'm very patriotic and all that, but Nationalism gets ridiculous when it comes to harassing immigrants.

And not paying in Greek restaurants? That's actually reason to call the police on those creeps.

What's happening in your place is happening just about everywhere in space and time when the economy gets worse. In the states, we've got tons of reactionary shitheads forming their own gun-toting militias because things are bad here.

Call me a reactionary shithead, but I would love to have friends like those in my city.

Every week I think to myself that it would be awesome to just meet up with a few people and leave everything behind if serious riots start destroying the city and looters start robbing everyone blind.

From your point of view, you see them as the kind of assholes that would start creating checkpoints and harassing people.

From my point of view, they are the people that are willing to just live in the woods if it's that what it takes to save their lives and possessions.

As an European most I can do is grab a baseball bat and do the fetal position while sucking my thumb. If I grab the guns everyone will think that I've watched way too much Mad Max.

It's not preparing for the apocalypse to stock up on a shit load of armaments; it's preparing for them fereigners and mewslims when they show up to take our god given rights *sarcasm* to carry as much weaponry as we want because we hate fereigners so much.

These people are preparing for an armageddon that won't come.

 

[James Joseph Emerald]

A couple of weeks ago, there was a party in a little town we live in (about 2000 people live here). At around 3 o'clock i was waked from my sleep because of chanting outside. Ik had to endure about 30 minuts of shouts like "Kut polen (loose translation: **** polish)" Constant beating the door, and - you wont believe this shit, someone threw a living cat at our balcony.
I keep hearing how youth of the immigrants is leading to criminality. All of those young people outside were dutch. Every week, such a party takes place, sometimes is quiet, but most of the time (pretty much always) a local bus stop is getting vandalized.

The exact same thing happens in Ireland. And I presume most other countries/regions with a lot of immigrants. And even if it wasn't immigrants, it would be class struggles, or religious persecution, or feuds between communities.

Humans just look for excuses to hate each other. It's no different outside of the Netherlands, I'm afraid. I'm certain it's no different in Poland either.

 

[ElPatron]

It's not preparing for the apocalypse to stock up on a shit load of armaments; it's preparing for them fereigners and mewslims when they show up to take our god given rights *sarcasm* to carry as much weaponry as we want because we hate fereigners so much.

These people are preparing for an armageddon that won't come.

Way to be a bigot. Have you noticed that your prejudice is no different than a xenophobe? I am an atheist. And so are a lot of "preppers" (or whatever). "OH MY THEIR GAWD GIVEN RIGHTS!" doesn't really work. It's just like saying that everyone darker than me is a Muslim.

Their rights were given by men and losing them means they won't even get them back. Many people in both Europe and North America should be imprisoned for high-treason because I AM FED UP WITH POLITICIANS NOT RESPECTING CONSTITUTIONS. They exist for a reason.


Must I remind you what happened after Katrina? Looting. The authorities started knocking on doors and taking guns away.

It doesn't make you a weirdo to know how to hunt, skin animals and perform light medical assistance - EVERYONE in the world should have that kind of knowledge in their head. It doesn't make you a weirdo to use "doomsday" as an excuse to prepare for EARTHQUAKES, VOLCANIC ACTIVITY, CHEMICAL OR NUCLEAR DISASTER, TSUNAMIS, HURRICANES, etc.


I am a city person. I understand perfectly what you are saying. But how about you forget that bull that we call the Boy/Girl Scouts and actually learn something that will help you in REAL scenarios?

Doomsday might never come, but tell me in my face that there are no tsunamis or earthquakes in this planet! Tell me that there would make no difference if the people in Fukushima had proper knowledge of what to do to avoid high radiation doses!

 

[Lovely Mixture]

snip

Those are two very different types of preparation.

Preparing for natural disaster or possible impending invasion? Fine

Preparing for war against local ethnic groups because the economy is doing bad or there was a recent assassination? Just look at what happened to Rwanda and you can see that this is a bad idea.

Sextus is obviously talking about the latter.

 

[ElPatron]

Preparing for war against local ethnic groups because the economy is doing bad or there was a recent assassination? Just look at what happened to Rwanda and you can see that this is a bad idea.

Sextus is obviously talking about the latter.

How about providing evidence to those claims? Actual evidence, not news pieces about one or two batshit insane guys that was blown out of proportion to make them look like thousands.

I have been following the "prepping" scene for a while and I have NEVER come across people trying to target ethnic groups. That only happens on the "Turner Diaries" and "Patriots" (the latter being something like this "I am not a racist. Oh, look - a group of people who are not Christian whites! They must be up to no good!").

I know that he was talking about - read the first part of the post you quoted. He is simply implying all sorts of things about people who are preparing for SHTF, which to me sounds like intolerance.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

How about providing evidence to those claims? Actual evidence, not news pieces about one or two batshit insane guys that was blown out of proportion to make them look like thousands.

You haven't heard of the Rwandan Genocide?

I have been following the "prepping" scene for a while and I have NEVER come across people trying to target ethnic groups. That only happens on the "Turner Diaries" and "Patriots" (the latter being something like this "I am not a racist. Oh, look - a group of people who are not Christian whites! They must be up to no good!").

He never pointed out the "prepping" movement. He pointed out right-wing nutjobs.

I know that he was talking about - read the first part of the post you quoted. He is simply implying all sorts of things about people who are preparing for SHTF, which to me sounds like intolerance.

He never said all of them we're like that. I see him just pointing out bible-belt right-wing nutjobs who happened to be involved.

 

[ElPatron]

How about providing evidence to those claims? Actual evidence, not news pieces about one or two batshit insane guys that was blown out of proportion to make them look like thousands.

You haven't heard of the Rwandan Genocide?

I have. But I fail to see how that serves as any evidence to prove that the same is happening... in America.

He never pointed out the "prepping" movement. He pointed out right-wing nutjobs.

"It's not preparing for the apocalypse to stock up on a shit load of armaments"

But gathering weapons so that you can give them to family and friends is one of the main points of prepping. He's just being inconsiderate for others' opinions about what to do after SHTF.

He never said all of them we're like that. I see him just pointing out bible-belt right-wing nutjobs who happened to be involved.

Religious people don't prep. That actually requires use of SCIENCE.

"In the states, we've got tons of reactionary shitheads forming their own gun-toting militias because things are bad here."

No mention of right wing nor religious people.

The fact is that stupid people like Nutnfancy on youtube want to be come "Sheepdogs" and all that crap but they are a minority. Most people are just gathering weapons because there is a chance of a social breakdown.

Look what happened in the LA Riots. All it took was a guy being beaten by the police to cause people to just start trashing other people's business.

The people at Koreantown in LA did what they could to protect themselves. The riot hit Korean businesses pretty hard. They weren't morons like Nutnfancy and his "Sheepdawgs".

 

[neversleep]

As a Dutch speaking Belgian I feel ashamed for the things done to you. Rightwing politicians are also somehow gaining ground in Belgium and i'm ashamed for their complete incompetence and what it says about our culture.