F@#&-ing Pirates....

[Woodsey]

Regardless of whether you buy the games or not, the copy that you pirated is still viewed as a lost sale by publishers.

that's the problem. That's how they think, but that's not how the math works at all. There is actual math, and it's actually every pirated game is approximately 0.001 lost sales. If they make a measure that stops 1000 pirated copies, it only produces 1 extra sale, statistically.

The problem is that the publishers have their heads on backwards about piracy.

And where's that figure from?

I didn't pull it out of my ass, except just to mention it here. It was floating around a few months back, when the Assassin's Creed 2 DRM was a hot subject, including in articles by both Shamus Young and Andy Chalk in their columns here.. Feel free to disregard it yourself, I don't have the reference onhand, but it is an actual figure

I wasn't saying you did, I just wanted to know where it's from; both for reliability, and I want to know how they themselves got the figure. I can't say I'd be particularly trusting of the results they get from asking pirates: "do you buy games after you've pirated them?"

 

[f0re1gn]

Most of the pirates wouldn't have bought the game if it couldn't have been pirated.

Pirating is what I would call unfair sharing, but it doesn't harm the developers as much as everyone thinks.

Don't hit me))

 

[dreadedcandiru99]

F@#&-ing Pirates...

How do they work?

(Sorry, but it had to be done.)

 

[f0re1gn]

Piracy is also on consoles fyi.

Yes, but consoles are much easier to protect and thus most piraters just don't bother since the PC is much easier to work with.

Actually, [cut].

If I were you, I wouldn't post stuff like that here)

 

[WestMountain]

I've heard that there wouldn't be any difference if piracy didn't exist because though some people doesn't pay anything for their games they can still tell their friends about how good it is etc and therefore there are some of those people who get told about how great the game is will buy the game so it evens out, you get it?


+The gaming scene wouldn't probably be as big as it is now without piracy

 

[WestMountain]

Piracy is also on consoles fyi.

Yes, but consoles are much easier to protect and thus most piraters just don't bother since the PC is much easier to work with.

Actually, [cut].

If I were you, I wouldn't post stuff like that here)

He/she doesn't do anything bad, he just presents information as his argument. :]

 

[Altorin]

Regardless of whether you buy the games or not, the copy that you pirated is still viewed as a lost sale by publishers.

that's the problem. That's how they think, but that's not how the math works at all. There is actual math, and it's actually every pirated game is approximately 0.001 lost sales. If they make a measure that stops 1000 pirated copies, it only produces 1 extra sale, statistically.

The problem is that the publishers have their heads on backwards about piracy.

And where's that figure from?

I didn't pull it out of my ass, except just to mention it here. It was floating around a few months back, when the Assassin's Creed 2 DRM was a hot subject, including in articles by both Shamus Young and Andy Chalk in their columns here.. Feel free to disregard it yourself, I don't have the reference onhand, but it is an actual figure

I wasn't saying you did, I just wanted to know where it's from; both for reliability, and I want to know how they themselves got the figure. I can't say I'd be particularly trusting of the results they get from asking pirates: "do you buy games after you've pirated them?"

the numbers aren't based on whether they bought the games or not. sales figures and piracy figures iirc... I forget exactly how the numbers were formulated, but iirc, they were pretty sound. they have pretty good numbers for piracy.. It wouldn't be too hard to extrapolate some data after years of looking at numbers.

But also, pirates get ahold of a LOT more software then a legitimate consumer. It would literally be impossible for 1 pirated copy to equal 1 lost sale. They just don't have the money to back up their "purchases" if they were forced to. A pirate can download 1000 dollars worth of software, movies, games, music, per month. I think the industry sees each sale/piracy instance as a different person.. But prolific pirates (most of them, in for a penny, in for a pound as they say), will download almost every game they can. New game came out? it's mine. New movie I want to see? it's mine. someone, somewhere on the planet, released a new cd in a genre I like (or don't like, if i'm a crazy avid collector of mp3s)? It's mine. So the figures can be skewed in that way too.. 30 million SPore downloads, 20 million MW2 downloads... might only be a total of 35 million pirates between those two alone... If thats making any sense.

A legitimate consumer will spend an average of 100-200 dollars on software per month, over the course of a year.. maybe a little more. a pirate can do 10x that.

So disregard the statistic if you care to, the point is, it's obvious to anyone that 1 piracy =/= 1 lost sale from just common sense.

All that being said, you can't blame publishers for not condoning piracy, and they definitely are in their right to attempt to thwart it if they think they can. Their pursuing a vain endeavor though, and their money and resources would be better served in other areas.

 

[Altorin]

Piracy is also on consoles fyi.

Yes, but consoles are much easier to protect and thus most piraters just don't bother since the PC is much easier to work with.

Actually, it quite easy to do it on all the consoles, minus the need for a Blu-Rat burner (PS3 games)

and the bandwidth to download games which allegedly fill BLuray discs.. I know my ISP would throw a conniption fit if I downloaded 50gb in one month on one file.

 

[Saxm13]

People download whole tv series which can skyrocket to over 30GB.

I myself have downloaded the whole Futurama collection. But only cause it's unwatchable here in Canada.

 

[clankwise]

Ive only pirated old games i cant find at gamestop. Gamestop has a horrible selection of pc games. But i buy new pc games if i find it

 

[Altorin]

and the bandwidth to download games which allegedly fill BLuray discs.. I know my ISP would through a conniption fit if I downloaded 50gb in one month on one file.

Yea, that too.

Though I think some Ps3 games aren't that large.
Someone told my LittleBigPlanet was only a 6gb download, but I can't comment on the truth/falsehood of the statement,.

most are not. most PS3 games fall into the 6-8gb zone, as they are multiplatforming on a system that only supports dual layer DVD.

However, some of the exclusives (like MGS4 for instance) are literally ginormous, and out of reach of most casual pirate's hands.

edit: Oh, and the fact that the PS3 hasn't been effectively cracked by the mass pirate market yet is a pretty big indicator on this. the 360 has been cracked every which way but loose though.

 

[meticadpa]

Piracy is copyright infringement, not stealing.

Someone downloading it illegally is not a lost sale.

Console piracy is rife.

Ive only pirated old games i cant find at gamestop. Gamestop has a horrible selection of pc games. But i buy new pc games if i find it

Ever heard of Steam?

 

[Madkipz]

F@#&-ing Pirates...

How do they work?

(Sorry, but it had to be done.)

yes,yes it did =D

as for piracy, i dont see why you or any game company would blame piracy for low sales.

 

[Altorin]

most are not. most PS3 games fall into the 6-8gb zone, as they are multiplatforming on a system that only supports dual layer DVD.

However, some of the exclusives (like MGS4 for instance) are literally ginormous, and out of reach of most casual pirate's hands.

True.

But probably the biggest factor preventing PS3 game being wide-spread pirated, as we have both said, the cost of BR burners.

In 2-3 years, those will have a good drop in price, and PS3 games will be more commonly pirated.

I don't think that's it. The PS3 is notoriously hard to crack. It requires some ludicrous backwards thinking.. and it's made more difficult with the removal of Other OS. sure, lack of BR burners is an issue, but PS3 piracy just doesn't work that well right now because, unlike the 360, with which you can just hook the DVD drive up to a computer and basically tell it "you're cracked now", the PS3 is a different beast when it comes to being cracked.

I don't even know if it has been cracked without Other OS yet. The only cracked PS3 I've heard about (and I'm pretty sure it's the only one as it made big news when it happened) used Other OS.

 

[veloper]

This issue is seriously pissing me off..

Don't be. If you cannot do anything about something, you shouldn't worry about it.

Moreover, unless you're in the industry, this isn't affecting you.
As for what the industry should do:

1. Cater mostly to adults, they are the ones with disposable incomes (and the average gamer age is 30-33 already).
2. Keep developers very close to their fans and potential fans through all the available media, because fans won't rip you off.
3. Kiddie games should be the type of games *adults* would want to buy for their kid's console.
4. Let kids pirate games to get as many as possible hooked, as they are the future customers.
5. Forget everything outside the First world, don't even bother localizing to less wealthy nations, unless it's an MMO.
6. Nintendo for kids; PC for adults (and pirating teens).
7. Keep DRM as it kills used sales, but don't waste anymore money into trying to make it harder to crack as you cannot beat the crackers and you shouldn't want to. Piracy gets em hooked; used sales is lost potential.