Female Perspective - Friend Zone

[5mj7R7yf4Dwr3gdZyyu9PeGNwYjlNrjzuh3iTXQG]

Indeed, it does, as does the demographic of those who lack self awareness. I take you regard yourself a member?

Ah, what a beautifully crafted and cunningly snide repartee....

I was reflecting the snidey (snidish? snidesque? Snidley?) attitude I thought I was receiving in your first response, but my snidery is not without it's point: I think much of the Escapist readership is slightly to the right of 100 IQ points as you put it. And elitist or not[footnote]Though, I, for one, will certainly concede a certain amount of academic and intellectual elitism.[/footnote] sociological studies do suggest we tend to hook up on the long term with similar degrees of intelligence, physical attractiveness, physical capability, et. al.

In any case, we seem to agree on point if not on symantical choices. But people do seem to be undecided as to whether or not to take the Ladder Theory seriously. And there's plenty of confusing advice out there as it is when it comes to topics romantic.

238U.

 

[MasterChief892039]

http://www.laddertheory.com/

Ladder theory here to save the day!

I am quite honestly appalled. This is one of the most sexist things I've seen in a while - and I hang out on the internet. "Things that women say they care about but don't"... and strangers who aren't in their heads and claim to speak for the entire female sex would know better than these silly deceitful women, would they? I cannot believe this absolute bile even exists.

Yeah.. that pretty much sums up my opinion. What garbage.

Oh, and don't forget, all women are whores. We don't date you because we like you, we date you because you pay for dinner and shit (those times that we pay for the meal are just flukes).

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

Indeed, it does, as does the demographic of those who lack self awareness. I take you regard yourself a member?

Ah, what a beautifully crafted and cunningly snide repartee....

snidey (snidish? snidesque? Snidley?)

238U.

Snide. The word you are looking for is snide.

As for the rest of the post, the point is that by talking about the "100 IQ club" like you did, you neatly brushed aside half of the population of the planet -- more than that, actually, unless you want to ignore that the average range is anything within one standard deviation of 100. Much more, if you count it as that area and lower.

 

[Valdus]

I absolutly hate the "friend zone" theory. It's BS of the highest order. It's basically saying "I like you but don't find you attractive enough to add sex to the relationship as well". Anyone who tries to "friendzone" someone is, in my opinion, increadibly shallow and ranks sexual attraction as being far more importent than it should be.

 

[teh_v]

From the master of the friends zone I'm here to say it is there it does exist and it sucks. Case and point I've been friend zoned before but the situation that caused me to NEVER let me be put in the friend zone is this.

I was on a post breakup rebound. Kinda dating not really dating but I had meet this friend of a friend who was into me. We were flirting and stuff and even been pretty intimate once or twice. Then after about 2 month of this I got a I'm just coming out of a serious relationship I want to slow down for a bit let's keep going as friends for awhile. I was like ok if that's what you want. Being the nice guy (something that can kill you in moments like this), I just was there for her picking her up when she need a ride, being that shoulder she cried on when her roommates were giving her crap and other things, all the boyfriendish stuff without and of the boyfriend intimacy.

Then on a camping trip she gets drunk and ends up in my sleeping bag cuddling with me. I was a little drunk too but I remember warning her I still have feeling for you and that unless you have feeling for me this is a bad idea. She mumbled something like "don't care, trust you" and we spent the night like that. I thought "wow I'm out of the friends zone, who would have thought". The trip ended and soon after I had to leave town for a month cause of work. In the mean time she moved into a new place and was fooling around with some guy at her new place but was still using me for emotional support. When I came home from I thought I was about to get into a relationship then on 4 of July she drop the bombshell that she had been sleeping with another guy and he broke it off with her. Then she went and started flirting with my buddy who a bit of a gym rat.

Even after all that I'm still hanging out with her having a good time. Going to concerts and just hanging out watch tv and stuff. Also being her person to turn to when she's had a bad day. Yet it's this pattern of "when x guy I'm fucking busy or not returning my calls I'll go hang out with Jared" or I'll go to the bar with jared til this guy I think is cute calls me then I'm gonna leave him at the bar by himself. This goes on for months. The worst part would be is she would flirt with me a little any time she drank and then pretend like it didn't happen. By Aug right around my Bday I ask her what ever happened with us getting back together after we had amazing night at a deftones concert. I get the "I'm so sorry but we're just gonna be friends" speech and that I'm her best guy friend. One week later it's my birthday and she misses it because some random she known for like 2 weeks was throwing some party.

Two months later on Halloween after watching her just ditch me completely for another random guy she just met I completely defriend her unfacebooked her the works. I couldn't take putting my emotion into her and only getting back her emotional scraps when the guys she really wanted weren't paying attention to her.

Guys the friends zone is bad if you have feeling for a girl. I have tons of female friends who I have no feelings for and we work amazing well as friends. Yet if you have feeling for a girl and she doesn't for you move on. You have to, you'll make yourself emotional wreck if you don't. Now if I hear the words "lets be friends" and I like the girl in a more then friends way I say "I know you're trying to make me feel better but I don't want that honest yes or no" and if its no (95% of the time it is) I move on if its yes we date and see where it goes.

Also, it's not just for guys I've personally done the same thing to women but I'm more up front cause that's how I would want to be handled myself. I've told women "I think your funny and attractive but for these x reasons I can't see myself dating you". It sucks but like a band aid, yanking right off is better then lightly tugging.

Sorry this is a super long post... guess I got a lot of bitter still built up.

 

[AngloDoom]

I thought 'friend zone' was just a way of saying 'we're only friends' with some added negative connotations.

I mean, if that person liked you so much more than a friend and you did too, most likely you wouldn't just be friends. The 'friend zone' just sounds like friendship wielded as a weapon.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

From the master of the friends zone I'm here to say it is there it does exist and it sucks. Case and point I've been friend zoned before but the situation that caused me to NEVER let me be put in the friend zone is this.

I was on a post breakup rebound. Kinda dating not really dating but I had meet this friend of a friend who was into me. We were flirting and stuff and even been pretty intimate once or twice. Then after about 2 month of this I got a I'm just coming out of a serious relationship I want to slow down for a bit let's keep going as friends for awhile. I was like ok if that's what you want. Being the nice guy (something that can kill you in moments like this), I just was there for her picking her up when she need a ride, being that shoulder she cried on when her roommates were giving her crap and other things, all the boyfriendish stuff without and of the boyfriend intimacy.

Then on a camping trip she gets drunk and ends up in my sleeping bag cuddling with me. I was a little drunk too but I remember warning her I still have feeling for you and that unless you have feeling for me this is a bad idea. She mumbled something like "don't care, trust you" and we spent the night like that. I thought "wow I'm out of the friends zone, who would have thought". The trip ended and soon after I had to leave town for a month cause of work. In the mean time she moved into a new place and was fooling around with some guy at her new place but was still using me for emotional support. When I came home from I thought I was about to get into a relationship then on 4 of July she drop the bombshell that she had been sleeping with another guy and he broke it off with her. Then she went and started flirting with my buddy who a bit of a gym rat.

Even after all that I'm still hanging out with her having a good time. Going to concerts and just hanging out watch tv and stuff. Also being her person to turn to when she's had a bad day. Yet it's this pattern of "when x guy I'm fucking busy or not returning my calls I'll go hang out with Jared" or I'll go to the bar with jared til this guy I think is cute calls me then I'm gonna leave him at the bar by himself. This goes on for months. The worst part would be is she would flirt with me a little any time she drank and then pretend like it didn't happen. By Aug right around my Bday I ask her what ever happened with us getting back together after we had amazing night at a deftones concert. I get the "I'm so sorry but we're just gonna be friends" speech and that I'm her best guy friend. One week later it's my birthday and she misses it because some random she known for like 2 weeks was throwing some party.

Two months later on Halloween after watching her just ditch me completely for another random guy she just met I completely defriend her unfacebooked her the works. I couldn't take putting my emotion into her and only getting back her emotional scraps when the guys she really wanted weren't paying attention to her.

Guys the friends zone is bad if you have feeling for a girl. I have tons of female friends who I have no feelings for and we work amazing well as friends. Yet if you have feeling for a girl and she doesn't for you move on. You have to, you'll make yourself emotional wreck if you don't. Now if I hear the words "lets be friends" and I like the girl in a more then friends way I say "I know you're trying to make me feel better but I don't want that honest yes or no" and if its no (95% of the time it is) I move on if its yes we date and see where it goes.

Also, it's not just for guys I've personally done the same thing to women but I'm more up front cause that's how I would want to be handled myself. I've told women "I think your funny and attractive but for these x reasons I can't see myself dating you". It sucks but like a band aid, yanking right off is better then lightly tugging.

Sorry this is a super long post... guess I got a lot of bitter still built up.

Super long, but well worth reading. It took a few cases like this -- although not quite that bad -- for me to wise up as well.

 

[5mj7R7yf4Dwr3gdZyyu9PeGNwYjlNrjzuh3iTXQG]

snidey (snidish? snidesque? Snidley?)

Snide. The word you are looking for is snide.

My sense of humor is apparently lost on you.[footnote]And snidey is an acceptable variant, according to some dictionaries.[/footnote]

And I had thought this conversation was done.

As for the rest of the post, the point is that by talking about the "100 IQ club" like you did, you neatly brushed aside half of the population of the planet -- more than that, actually, unless you want to ignore that the average range is anything within one standard deviation of 100. Much more, if you count it as that area and lower.

Considering I hypothesize it is the 100 IQ club for whom we have to thank for much of the GOP platform,[footnote]That is to say, legislative war on gays, war on women, war on science, war on the lower and middle classes, and war on any culture or counterculture regarded as fringe, including the gamer community and the world's intelligentsia, these being due to the pandemic of attitude polarization [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attitude_polarization], and the hardwired tendency for humans to want to kill anyone that doesn't look like their first cousin, a once useful instinct that doesn't work so well in the epoch of nations.[/footnote] I am more than happy to distance myself from them.

Also, I was disclaiming, given I was speaking from my own anecdotal experience, and not from data published in journals, I can only specify what works for me, and a certain degree of self-awareness is one thing I've cultivated that separates me from the norm. I had presumed that here on The Escapist this was not uncommon, at least that folks here are more prone to personal introspection than is typical of US citizens.

I still make that presumption, though obviously it isn't true in all cases.

238U.

 

[NoeL]

http://www.laddertheory.com/

Ladder theory here to save the day!

The ladder theory is somewhat offensive and far from 100% true. Sure it's true in most cases, but not all of them. It also does not account for region, culture and age as that does change the pie charts somewhat.

I don't like the ladder theory, in case my opinion wasn't clear with that statement. Narcissism has done no good for anyone.

Sigh.

The ladder theory - like all theories of behaviour - seeks to explain/describe the status quo of behaviour. If it doesn't apply to you don't get upset, it just means you're a weirdo you fall outside the norm. I find the ladder theory to be an accurate (though somewhat disappointing) representation of the typical male psyche regarding their female friends. They will gladly bone any of them if they ask, and be willing to take any of their "close" friendships to the next level if the girl displayed similar interest (and we're much more likely to reach "closeness" with girls we find attractive). Because really, that's all the typical male (along with many females) wants in a relationship - a close friend they can bone.

 

[5mj7R7yf4Dwr3gdZyyu9PeGNwYjlNrjzuh3iTXQG]

From the master of the friends zone I'm here to say it is there it does exist and it sucks...

I think your story lends strength to the idea that the friend-zone is not a state of mind held by the object of desire, but the one doing the desiring.

On one hand, it is quite romantic to hold unrequited love, and to be there for someone on the hope that they will recognize and return your feelings for them. Many a story has been told about the hopelessly enamored hero seeking the unachievable bride, or the hopelessly enamored villain whose descent into wickedness is driven by such an unsated desire.[footnote] I suggest Cyrano de Bergerac [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyrano_de_Bergerac]. The tale is fiction though the person is real.[/footnote]

In reality, though, it's not practical. So stop hoping unless you're really getting off on the emo thing. If tragic angst is working for you, by all means keep being her support on a hopeless gamble.

If it's not working the way you want, then consider whether you would be her crying shoulder if there was absolutely no chance of her ever falling for you. If you wouldn't, walk away.

This applies to all relationships: If you'd be her friend just to be her friend, id est, because you like being her friend and not because you hope to get into her pants one day, then by all means, be her friend.

If, on the other hand, you're just there for the sex, find out sooner than later, and take no for no, not not now but maybe later, not after you woo me for a week. No means no. It's time to start looking for other hot fish in other seas (and there are plenty). Yeah, it sucks being rejected. It sucks more being rejected after you spent so much time investing on a relationship that was never gonna happen.

You may find that a friend later turns out to be a great romantic partner. It's nice when it happens, but it is generally a bad idea to go into a friendship on the expectation that it will become a romance.

238U.

 

[NoeL]

From the master of the friends zone I'm here to say it is there it does exist and it sucks. Case and point I've been friend zoned before but the situation that caused me to NEVER let me be put in the friend zone is this.

-snip-

You got pwnd!

tl:dr = Nice guys finish last.


Anyway, I think your story is fairly typical (to varying degrees) of many "beta" males (that's not meant to be offensive, I'm just referring to guys who aren't terribly assertive, and are comfortable and content with letting others set the standard). It's an unfortunate reality that if you put other peoples' wants and desires above your own you're going to get taken advantage of. "Nice guys finish last".

Now girls, before you say "That's not true! I'd date a nice guy over a jerk any day!", we're using "nice" in different contexts. To use an example:

Let's say you're at a restaurant and you ask for no cucumber in your salad, but when your salad arrives it has cucumber in it. You call the waiter over, explain you asked for no cucumber and ask them for a replacement salad. Now, as long as you didn't abuse the waiter or anything, it's perfectly reasonable to expect to get what you ordered and there's nothing not-nice about asking for a replacement. A girl would have no trouble identifying you as a "nice" guy.

If, on the other hand, you said "I don't want to cause a fuss, and I can easily pick out the cucumber", you are putting the restaurant staff's happiness above your own even though they were in error, and it would be unreasonable if they got upset with you for asking for what you ordered. This is the kind of "nice" the quote "nice guys finish last" is talking about - people that willingly bear the faults of others, either through some misguided sense of duty or, as in most cases, a fear of or reluctance to engage in conflict.

Like most things, it mostly comes down to what experiences people had when they were young. If most of their experiences include fair, reasonable people then they're not going to see people as inherently unreasonable and don't expect there to be any conflict when they inform the waiter of their error. If, on the other hand, they frequently dealt with unreasonable, aggressive people in their childhood they tend to see people as being inherently unreasonable and aggressive, and so they DO expect asking for a replacement to be met with conflict, even though this is almost never the case.

I wonder if there's a correlation between child order and this personality difference. My older brother fits the former demographic, where I fit the latter. Could it be that my near constant interaction with an older, oppressive sibling was the primary cause of my irrational expectation of conflict? Probably not, but I'm curious anyway.

 

[Calcium]

I havn't heard the expression 'Friend Zone' before, but I'm best friends with a girl and so I'd have to say that claiming to be friends with a girl is not ficticious. Not saying that this is your view - I get the impression I'm not fully understading the thread.

Other people I know go straight to dating, then end up awkward friends.

I'm not trying to be a creeper, but uhm who old are? Your response makes you seem really young...

I'm 19. I understand the situation, just havn't heard it called that before.

 

[agrajagthetesty]

Having thought about this issue some more, I'm really starting to wish that guys would just drop the whole "friends zone" thing and be honest with themselves. How about, instead of saying "I really liked this girl but she friend zoned me", you just say "I really liked this girl but she wasn't sexually interested in me, although she apparently didn't mind my personality despite my latent misogyny. I then found it very difficult to deal with and accept her unspoken or spoken rejection. I became angry and embittered, went into denial, and started blaming the girl for her heinous crime of not wanting to have sex with me"?

Less snappy, sure. But accurate.

 

[Drake_Dercon]

http://www.laddertheory.com/

Ladder theory here to save the day!

The ladder theory is somewhat offensive and far from 100% true. Sure it's true in most cases, but not all of them. It also does not account for region, culture and age as that does change the pie charts somewhat.

I don't like the ladder theory, in case my opinion wasn't clear with that statement. Narcissism has done no good for anyone.

Sigh.

The ladder theory - like all theories of behaviour - seeks to explain/describe the status quo of behaviour. If it doesn't apply to you don't get upset, it just means you're a weirdo you fall outside the norm. I find the ladder theory to be an accurate (though somewhat disappointing) representation of the typical male psyche regarding their female friends. They will gladly bone any of them if they ask, and be willing to take any of their "close" friendships to the next level if the girl displayed similar interest (and we're much more likely to reach "closeness" with girls we find attractive). Because really, that's all the typical male (along with many females) wants in a relationship - a close friend they can bone.

And I agree with you completely. Sorry if my post sounded too negative.

 

[Oskamunda]

Fuck the Friend Zone.

That's all I have to say about that.

 

[shitoutonme]

From the master of the friends zone I'm here to say it is there it does exist and it sucks. Case and point I've been friend zoned before but the situation that caused me to NEVER let me be put in the friend zone is this.

I was on a post breakup rebound. Kinda dating not really dating but I had meet this friend of a friend who was into me. We were flirting and stuff and even been pretty intimate once or twice. Then after about 2 month of this I got a I'm just coming out of a serious relationship I want to slow down for a bit let's keep going as friends for awhile. I was like ok if that's what you want. Being the nice guy (something that can kill you in moments like this), I just was there for her picking her up when she need a ride, being that shoulder she cried on when her roommates were giving her crap and other things, all the boyfriendish stuff without and of the boyfriend intimacy.

Then on a camping trip she gets drunk and ends up in my sleeping bag cuddling with me. I was a little drunk too but I remember warning her I still have feeling for you and that unless you have feeling for me this is a bad idea. She mumbled something like "don't care, trust you" and we spent the night like that. I thought "wow I'm out of the friends zone, who would have thought". The trip ended and soon after I had to leave town for a month cause of work. In the mean time she moved into a new place and was fooling around with some guy at her new place but was still using me for emotional support. When I came home from I thought I was about to get into a relationship then on 4 of July she drop the bombshell that she had been sleeping with another guy and he broke it off with her. Then she went and started flirting with my buddy who a bit of a gym rat.

Even after all that I'm still hanging out with her having a good time. Going to concerts and just hanging out watch tv and stuff. Also being her person to turn to when she's had a bad day. Yet it's this pattern of "when x guy I'm fucking busy or not returning my calls I'll go hang out with Jared" or I'll go to the bar with jared til this guy I think is cute calls me then I'm gonna leave him at the bar by himself. This goes on for months. The worst part would be is she would flirt with me a little any time she drank and then pretend like it didn't happen. By Aug right around my Bday I ask her what ever happened with us getting back together after we had amazing night at a deftones concert. I get the "I'm so sorry but we're just gonna be friends" speech and that I'm her best guy friend. One week later it's my birthday and she misses it because some random she known for like 2 weeks was throwing some party.

Two months later on Halloween after watching her just ditch me completely for another random guy she just met I completely defriend her unfacebooked her the works. I couldn't take putting my emotion into her and only getting back her emotional scraps when the guys she really wanted weren't paying attention to her.

^This mess is slightly depressing.

See, this is why I don't believe a word that comes out of any girl's mouth concerning her ideal mate. Every girl states that she wants a "sweet, nice guy that will treat them right", and yet, they completely pass by all the nice guys in their lives for some asshole. It takes something traumatic for them to actually wise up.

Yes, yes, I know this doesn't pertain to all women, but speaking as one of the supposed "assholes" who has nice guy friends, this sweeping generalization has shown to be a practical truth in real life. All these guys worldwide can't be completely wrong if they're all speaking with one accord, and all these ladies who admit to it can't be entirely wrong either. I don't know if it's related to changes in modern society or pop culture, or if this trend has been around since the dawn of humanity, but I'm thoroughly convinced that women are generally inconsistent in this matter. And I'll be damned if I don't take full advantage of that inconsistency.

Having thought about this issue some more, I'm really starting to wish that guys would just drop the whole "friends zone" thing and be honest with themselves. How about, instead of saying "I really liked this girl but she friend zoned me", you just say "I really liked this girl but she wasn't sexually interested in me, although she apparently didn't mind my personality despite my latent misogyny. I then found it very difficult to deal with and accept her unspoken or spoken rejection. I became angry and embittered, went into denial, and started blaming the girl for her heinous crime of not wanting to have sex with me"?

Less snappy, sure. But accurate.

It is a fact that people who get friend zoned are responsible for allowing themselves to be placed in that situation. However, half of what you wrote was crap. Don't think for a second that the friend zone is a "boy's club" type of thing. It isn't, and it seem that the only girls that will ever understand this are the ones who get friend zoned as well.

 

[NoeL]

EDIT: Ignore this, I jumped the gun

Every girl states that she wants a "sweet, nice guy that will treat them right", and yet, they completely pass by all the nice guys in their lives for some asshole.

See my last post. The "nice guys" are weak and unattractive, and women want a strong partner - and there ARE guys that are "sweet, nice guy that will treat them right" that are also strong. You perceiving them to be "assholes" isn't without bias. Sure, some of them WILL be assholes, but that's part of the risk (lots of guys pass up sweet girls for a shot at their hot friend, even if she's a cow). Most of them will be reasonable guys but you're so green with envy you can't help but hate them.

 

[Labyrinth]

http://www.laddertheory.com/

Ladder theory here to save the day!

The problem with this kind of bullshit is that a lot of people probably use stereotypes like "all women lie about sex!" or "all women are manipulative!" to talk out of their arses. Chances are, they've talked out of their arses to someone who genuinely believed it, and had abused, assaulted or raped a woman. They probably don't know which individual this is too. And you know what, that person, the one who probably did those things thinks that those using these stereotypes are on their side. Ditto for the kind of bullshit which comes out of believing that all men are arseholes.

That theory is full of biased data representation, lack of evidence, selective data group collection, speculation, stereotype, heteronormativity and narcissism. I will gladly take my '*****' badge, thank you.

Back to the theme of this thread.

The kind of groups for whom the 'friend zone' is a concern tend to have really poor communication skills around sex and attraction. This goes both ways, might I add. From what I have observed it seems to happen the most when the person believing themselves to have been placed in the 'friend zone' hasn't been honest about their motivations for entering into the friendship. As someone who's come up against this in the past allow me to say that, gentlemen, and despite all rumour to the contrary, women are not mind readers. If we are told that it's a friendly thing, we take you on that and expect you to be honest about it. If you can't be honest about something like that, are you really surprised that people might be concerned about being in a relationship with you? Shyness is one thing and quite understandable but being disingenuous entirely another. I will add that women who are said to position the 'friend zone' out of lying are more likely to do it because we live in a culture which systematically shames and disgraces women who are prepared to be upfront with their sexuality. Don't believe me? When's the last time you thought 'slut', in a derogatory manner, about a woman?

All of this comes back to communication and honestly, two things which are beyond crucial to functional relationships.

 

[agrajagthetesty]

Having thought about this issue some more, I'm really starting to wish that guys would just drop the whole "friends zone" thing and be honest with themselves. How about, instead of saying "I really liked this girl but she friend zoned me", you just say "I really liked this girl but she wasn't sexually interested in me, although she apparently didn't mind my personality despite my latent misogyny. I then found it very difficult to deal with and accept her unspoken or spoken rejection. I became angry and embittered, went into denial, and started blaming the girl for her heinous crime of not wanting to have sex with me"?

Less snappy, sure. But accurate.

It is a fact that people who get friend zoned are responsible for allowing themselves to be placed in that situation. However, half of what you wrote was crap. Don't think for a second that the friend zone is a "boy's club" type of thing. It isn't, and it seem that the only girls that will ever understand this are the ones who get friend zoned as well.

This is just the thing. Guys are by no means the only ones who end up falling for people that are only interested in them as friends. But it is almost solely guys who use the term "friends zone", and in all the definitions I've seen it's treated as an entirely heterosexual phenomenon, from the point of view of the rejected male. I actually agree with what you're saying, more or less: anyone can end up falling for a friend, when the friend isn't sexually or romantically interested. But the "friends zone" is a bit more complex than that, and whenever I see people talking about it it's almost invariably guys complaining about girls who have turned them down but want to still be friends.

Don't assume I've never had a crush on a friend who wasn't interested. I have. It sucks. But I don't blame the friends for that, and I don't delude myself into thinking that if only my timing had been different we could have had something. I didn't get "friend zoned", they just weren't interested. Shit sucks. I moved on.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

Growing up with my guy friends, I never thought about them any different than I did any other friend. Most of my friends have always been male because I share more common interests with males than females. I was always a "tom boy" in regards to what I enjoyed doing. I didn't play with dolls, no I was out building forts and weapons in the woods and having wars with my male friends. I grew up enjoying paintball wars, 4 wheelers, and video games. Not once growing up did I see myself as much different than the boys I hung out with until one by one things became awkward later.

I was also the type of girl who always had a boyfriend. I think the most I ever have been without a date was maybe a week at most. I have always "friend zoned" EVERYONE upon meeting them, and basically if a guy ever had a chance with me they had to give me more reasons to like them other than be "attractive" or "funny". Basically, every guy I have ever met was not considered for anything other than a friend unless I got to know them well enough to develop stronger feelings than just infatuation. I also have a very strong sex drive, so Chemistry was a big part of it as well, though even if I had chemistry with someone they still had slim to none chance of me ever acting on chemistry because something else in their personality would override that for me. It had to be a great combination of things for me to move forward on anything but a friendship status with them.

From my perspective though, I think guys are more likely to befriend a girl with alternative intentions rather than girls. My guy friends one by one over the years ALL hit on me at one point or another expressing desire to move things into a relationship realm. After a series of strange marriage proposals and love confessions, I started to just find it easier to fix them up with someone I thought they might like to redirect affection rather than have to punch anyone else in the mouth.

I honestly lost respect for some though and could not remain friends with them because they had dishonrable intentions to begin with. For example, Befriending me when I was in a reltionship with one of their friends only because they wanted to steal me away and have me for themselves. I am not sure what runs through someone's mind when they do such a thing to their friend, but I could never date anyone who would stab friend like that in the back. If they were that malicious to their friend, why on earth would I want to have anything to do with them? To me that is just deplorable, and a major turn off, so even if they may have had a chance before, by acting in such an underhanded manner, they lost it all by being a scumbag.

Also for those that assume girls want the "bad boy" over "nice guys", I don't think that is necessarily the case either. "Bad boys" are good liars, so they are good at deceiving the girl, making her think he is all of the things she is looking for. A Girl does not want a guy to abuse her, lie to her, cheat on her, no. I think the reason why the bad guy gets the girl is because the bad guy is better at telling a girl what she wants to hear.