Feminism: has it gone to far?

[One of Many]

Feminists are fine. Radical feminists, who I like to call "Feminazis", are not. They are pretty awful people, about on par with white supremacists in their ignorance and hatred of the world around them. One good example is that totally whacked-out ***** who wrote a mind-meltingly idiotic "review" of Firefly, in which she insisted that Wash regularly rapes Zoe and that Joss Whedon rapes his own wife, among many other awful things.

Here it is, in all it's revolting glory. (I found it again just now by googling "crazy feminist ***** Firefly review") http://users.livejournal.com/_allecto_/34718.html

Reading it certainly inspired hatred in me--hatred of this woman.

I know not all feminists are like this pathetic piece of shit, but it pains me to read all the comments supporting her dementia.

I am now consumed with rage after reading the first page of her so-called "review" and really want to kill something.

 

[Harley Q]

Basic Feminism- "We want equality!" Perfectly fair. Glass ceiling anyone?

Extreme Feminism- "We hate men and we are better than them" Bit far.

Marxist Feminism- "Repressed by the rich and gender inequality" To an extent, understandable.

Racial Feminism- "We suffered racism and gender inequality, that's not fair" This is on the ball, especially now. For example, think of how women are treated in places such as Saudi Arabia, or how many people are still racist these days. Frankly this form of feminism should be at the front of the queue.

 

[DeXusLM]

Feminists are bigoted fat skanks who cant get laid with a personal vendetta against men.
enough said

ps i am Australian and WTF are you on about?

 

[theSovietConnection]

The problem is that it's an overly vocal minority who demands that anyone who dare have a penis in their presence be enslaved to their beck and call. They seem to demand that, since women were the subject of such oppression, that men should now be repressed equally as some form of retribution. This is a highly unenlightened pont of view, however, for several reasons.

Firstly, retribution over an issue like this just doesn't make sense. While we're at it, we may as well let the Jewish start sticking Germans in concentration camps and let Native Americans go over and boot all of Europe onto reserves.

Secondly, not every man is a mysoginist bastard. I've never been against gender equality, so why should I suffer? Why should the millions of other men like me suffer for it?

I could go on, but I'm tired and need some rest, so I'll leave it at that.


There are many feminists out there, and they aren't all just female. The problem is, the overly vocal misandrists are hiding behind the feminism banner, and it's damaging feminism overall.

I stand for equality among the genders, that women should have equal chance of getting a job as men. I believe that if they have the brains, let them be a doctor, or a lawyer. If they have the charisma, let them be a politician. And if they have the physical capabilities, then they should be firefighters, soldiers, and paramedics. The problem is, and I can give a relevant example, that there are cases where it has gone too far.

The local ambulance base hired a pair of female paramedics. Normally, this isn't a problem, except they are in no way, shape, or form physically qualified for the job. This could be offset in most situations by teaming each one up with a physically capable paramedic, except any attempt to break them up is greeted with accusations of feminism. Now, because the owners of the depot aren't able to do anything about them being together, these two have to call out the fire department pretty much every time they have to pick a patient up because they are unable to lift the patient. Meaning that precious time is lost while waiting for the fire department to show up, and in the event of a major emergency/accident/disaster, that is a whole team and truck tied up because these two can't do their job.

 

[Harley Q]

Feminists are fine. Radical feminists, who I like to call "Feminazis", are not. They are pretty awful people, about on par with white supremacists in their ignorance and hatred of the world around them. One good example is that totally whacked-out ***** who wrote a mind-meltingly idiotic "review" of Firefly, in which she insisted that Wash regularly rapes Zoe and that Joss Whedon rapes his own wife, among many other awful things.

Here it is, in all it's revolting glory. (I found it again just now by googling "crazy feminist ***** Firefly review") http://users.livejournal.com/_allecto_/34718.html

Reading it certainly inspired hatred in me--hatred of this woman.

I know not all feminists are like this pathetic piece of shit, but it pains me to read all the comments supporting her dementia.

I am now consumed with rage after reading the first page of her so-called "review" and really want to kill something.

Oh for the love of curds and whey! Seriously, I just read thet review and i seriously want to make sure that woman never writes anything ever again. As a woman I am really annoyed, this crazy person seems to have no concept of history, evolution, logic and REALITY! I am going to go punch something now.

 

[Vern]

I think you mean 'too' far.

 

[Rofl-kamikaze]

Ok...I don't want to start a war..or get shouted at...but I really think that feminism has gone a bit to far. I mean that I think that the feminists have done what they set out to do and now they are just trying to make them selves better then men.

Tell me what you think of feminism...and please don't flame me. Please?

Where is this mysterious land of Far you speak of?

Well Done. You get a cookie for that (its in the link, not sure how to post pics. noob poster ftw). Also u win a free internet.

http://technabob.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/super_mario_cookie.jpg

OT: Sure, there have been times and places where 'feminist' groups have gone over the top to get their rights (while still keeping the priviliges that chivalry gave them (btw as Chris Rock said, and I quote: "chivalry is dead, and women killed it")) but, they still deserve the same rights as men, but nothing more. It is perfectly possible for women to be equal to men politically, however women can not possibly be treated as physical equals as men unless, wait for it, they ARE men. Women and men are physically different, but both genders are still part of the human race, and the Human Race should have Identical rights for both genders.

 

[latenightapplepie]

Has the OP heard of something called the Third World?

 

[thom_cat_]

No. It has not.

A cursory glance at the world will show you that most women are not afforded the same rights.

Within the US, the laws technically are supposed to give women the same rights as men. In practice however, women are often treated very poorly by men, in business, in domestic matters and especially in the entertainment industry.

Feminism is a category of humanism. It asserts that women are PEOPLE, just like YOU, and thus, deserve to be treated like people. Many men do not do this. The prevalence of domestic violence is a sign of this - woman get beaten by their husbands far more than husbands ever get beaten by their wives.

Men do not have the right to ever tell women how to live their lives. That is up to them. Men don't like it when they are told how to live their lives, well, I think that most women feel the same way when men tell them how to live theirs.

Feminism has not gone too far - if you think it has, maybe you're just angry because you can't control women. Well, it's morally wrong to try to control women. They are people - human beings, just like you. It's very, very sad that so many men can't realize this incredibly simple fact.

I think that feminism goes to far in a few places, but I think that's just the extremists that appear in every strain of anything.
As for women getting beaten by their husbands more than men, this is mainly due to the fact that men are generally stronger than women and are physically more dominating. But yeah, any person that thinks it's correct behaviour or it's okay to do such a thing to anybody is sick. What can feminists do? Well, sure you can tell everyone it's not okay, but come on, everyone knows this, it's not going to help. Within those areas there is only one way out, the person receiving the abuse must come forward, or anyone who knows about it must do the same. Criminals don't stop being criminals just because it's not a good thing to be doing, or because somebody says it's wrong.

I think this thread is more about issues like women dressing in low cut tops and short skirts, and then saying it's inappropriate for a man to look at their chests or legs. Really, that's not the man's fault.
Or people that take chivalry as "the woman can't do it by herself".
You get what I mean. Feminism occasionally goes to far in areas that equality really isn't needed.
If I was wearing a mankini and some women stared at me this is obviously my fault for dressing this way. But if a woman does it, it's my fault for staring.
Feminism is needed, but it can and has been overused in places where it remains unneeded.

 

[minarri]

Re OP: where is "far" and how am I supposed to know whether or not feminism has gone there?

 

[asinann]

In summary: Equal means equal. I think in the more modern countries, women are equals now, but the annoying thing is that they keep pushing for more rights. They've become equal. What more do they want?

Yeah, they get on average paid less than men for the same work.
They're more likely to be assaulted, infinitely more likely to be raped, and more likely to be killed.
They're encouraged to be sexually repressed, because if you're sexual you're a slut. They're encouraged to be quiet around others because being outspoken is bitchy.
Femininity itself is associated with being vapid (like duh), shallow (all girls think about is shoes!), meek (save me, manly mansome!) and submissive.

Think about it for a moment. When was the last time you seen a woman start one of these 'has feminism gone too far?!' threads? Yeah, because it is almost always guys saying WOMEN ARE TRYING TO BE SUPERIOR NOW.

Err... no. Sorry. Not the case.

Women who actually do the same work as men make MORE than men because the men are expected to do that work while for women it is an extra. Extras get you promotions and raises. A woman takes maternity leave, and they come back without any issues. A man takes paternity leave and comes back to a hostile environment.

A woman refuses to go on a trip of any kind, it's taken as normal. Man does the same thing and he gets bad performance reviews and eventually fired.

See where I'm going yet? Women don't want equality, they want the same pay, but still expect to be treated as princesses for the most part and expect men to pick up the tabs for EVERYTHING while they complain that they aren't treated fairly.

 

[Kortney]

Feminism is (in many ways) awfully silly. Why? Because I have the belief that you can't have it both ways. If you want true equality, if you truly want to be on the equal level in society as men - then you can't complain when you get drafted into the armed forces. You can't complain when you get hit for swearing at someone at the pub. You can't complain when no one offers you a seat on the bus.

You can't use your gender to work in favour of you when it suits you. That's my main gripe about feminism. The feminists I know (admittedly I don't know a lot) are extremely quick to wave their arms and cry when a woman is denied a job opportunity on the basis because she is a woman, yet they seem to ignore it when women are excused from undesirable activities men are made to do.

It seems like it's a double standard thing and, in some ways, almost aggressive viewpoint. It comes across to me 99.9% of the time as whining nonsense.

 

[Axolotl]

I thinkl this thread is proof enough that sexism is far from dead.

 

[raven_glory]

See the issue is that now, in most western countries, men and women are equal in the eyes of the law, in the eyes of men however it is a different story. See it is very hard to forcibly change public opinion even if it is to a perhaps better way of thinking. I believe everyone on this forum can agree that if a man and a woman are doing the same job they should be paid the same. However they are not, so feminists now push for any means they can to improve the situation, as any advocacy group would. I hope this is understandable.

Now in defense of chivalry,
Basically put women have something men want, early stages of relationships, in my view anyway, can basically be simplified to a business transaction. The way our society is structured is that men court women, though i seem to notice that changing as i grow older, guys you have to impress women, you hold doors open, ask her out and pick up the cheque. I feel that most women like it that way, let's be honest who wouldn't, and questioning it makes you look like a cheap bastard so we all go along with it. Honestly guys, come on its fine that way, I mean you might be able to find a girl who realizes that the system seems a bit screwed up and in reality both parties want the end result as much as the other, but in all honesty get into relationship and that distinction soon disappears and displays of chivalry become token.

In more general circumstances, such as holding doors open for strangers or offering seats on buses, i don't think the feminist do complain about this. Think about it, feminists want no relevant distinction between men and women, whereas chivalry only furthers and accentuates that gap. If anyone can find a IN CONTEXT quote of a noted feminist, academic or political only no celebrities, I will happily retract these last two paragraphs, but i'm pretty sure you guys are using straw man arguments here.

Also a quick side note on conscription and feminism, i'm pretty sure most feminist tend to be liberals who in turn tend to oppose the draft, so of course no feminist is going to be out there arguing to get women to be forced to sign up because (they might believe) no-one should be forced to sign up. If no-one is calling for political change then no change happens. Finally it may interest you to know that in about a few countries with the draft women are made to serve, most notably Israel and China.

 

[KarumaK]

I'd say the main problem with Feminism is the name; Feminism.

Name just doesn't seem to be about equal rights so much as female rights. It's a pretty polarizing term. Maybe something like Equalitism or whatever the proper term for such a viewpoint would be following normal naming conventions.

Personal thoughts on feminism; It's a crusade no crusade can ever go to far because no crusade will ever really reach it's goal. Things will never be completely equal for anyone no matter how hard you try. People won't stop fighting wars or animal testing, people won't stop hating. No big deal that's life yo.

So yeah... feminism is still doing what it's supposed to. But hey this is just the two cents of some anonymous douche on the net, so take it as you will eh?

 

[The Ghost]

Well women already have preferential treatment in America in court. Also I'd say not being eligible for the military draft (if it's ever reinstated) is another form of preferential treatment. My 2 cents.

 

[Chewster]

I think that there is still a ways to go with regards to equality (on many fronts, not just this one) and I think that, like most things, people get it in their heads that the few, vocal crazies are somehow representative of the whole.

They are not.

but i/m pretty sure you guys are using straw man arguments here.

That seems to happen a lot in discussions like this...

 

[hyperhammy]

I'm all for equality, but in my opinion, this is fucking disgusting...
Unless I get to wear a dick around my neck... that's just distasteful