Feminist Kickstarter Project gets Harassed/Threatened

[meepop]

I must say, I disapprove of her video in which she had a segment about Legos. She stated that the male firemen would come to put out the fire. Well, yes. I'd like to see YOU (referring to her) lift a grown man out of a burning building. Granted, some women can. But it's just not in the cards for every woman.

In the same way, there are also some male bakers. But the fact that one gender dominates a role is to be expected. It just can't be that there is an equal amount of male and females in every career. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's alright for a career or indeed a game to have a 10-man crew be 9 men and 1 woman, but...

EDIT: Why does she need money, exactly? I know she's funding a series, but what is the money going to do for her?

 

[Zydrate]

I must say, I disapprove of her video in which she had a segment about Legos.

Really? I found her Legoes videos to be some of the best she had. They were strangely even... She was merely asking for the more gender-neutral stuff.

I have a Lego table and a small built base under siege... RIGHT BEHIND ME.
I like Legoes. But the stories I write about them are consistently violent because that's the only thing for sale. I'd love to have some non-pink Cafe's in my stories so my heroes can finally take a goddamn break.

I'm 23, by the way. I feel the need to note that >_>

 

[Ragsnstitches]

snip

Heh, that was long and detailed. A deep look and my posts and thoughts. Interesting.

Still no arguments on the actual subject at hand though, which is also interesting.

I'll get to this later and pick it apart in all it's glory, but right now I need some sleep. One more thing though -

I also can't help but notice you don't like being ganged up on... feeling a bit victimised are we? I wonder how that feels.

Oh Rag. I have an inkling you know the feeling better than I do.

1st off, that jab sailed right over me. Citation might be needed.

Okay, I'll bite. Let's discuss the topic at hand, but before we go into it, lets make sure we are at least on the same page and know what this topic is.

My view of the topic at hand (the one Bloatedguppy started): In the broadest sense this topic is about Sexism (Duh), in particular the kind we see on the internet. We can both generally agree that what was shown in the OP was both grossly offensive but completely typical. However, there is also a belligerent element particular to this topic (the kickstarter) that I find unbearable. There is a concious and co-ordinated (relatively) effort to sabotage her project. It will likely fail but that isn't the point...

This goes BEYOND stating opinions. This is an attempt at imposing ones will over another. These people don't like what they see and instead of boycotting or criticising the project, they attack her and the project directly. That is inexcusable.

Sexism be damned, my issue here is how malicious the whole thing is. I have my own view on sexism and I deal with in my own way, but this worries me and I can't just "let it slide". I also can't bury my head in the sand and hope it goes away. This is also NOT the only place I'm discussing this issue. I've chimed in on this topic elsewhere, including with real people who MIGHT actually be able to offer a solution or at least spread the word to people who might.

Okay? I think we can take the next step.

My reasoning for partaking in these discussions (and getting involved with this kickstarter) is that I don't believe wilful ignorance will makes things better but will actually get WORSE.

So my stance is this: Show no quarter. These people can't have a cushion of complacency and indifference to fall onto. Especially not on the scale we see here... I agree it will never go away, but the least we can do is make it abundantly clear that they aren't welcome and if possible, force them back into the recesses of the various offensive chan sites and its ilk, where they can fester and circle jerk over their painfully low wit until the end of days.

I try not to worry about things I can't change, however devastating they may be - some may frown upon that but I think it's quite reasonable.

Yet you will be argumentative towards people who do? So you don't care about the issues facing the world/internet/forum whatever, just the people talking about them?

Let me try that again... You try not to worry about things that you can't change BUT will argue the reasons for caring about things that people want to argue about?

 

[Ragsnstitches]

EDIT: Why does she need money, exactly? I know she's funding a series, but what is the money going to do for her?

Better recording equipment? Better editing software? Computer upgrades to make the production process easier?

I'm honestly surprised so many people are asking this.

I think the thing that will really grind people is that she needs to play games in order to analyse them. So yeah, costs include games to play...

I can see where some reactions can come from. If I was to fund her, it would be with the lowest possible amount because I want her to do this, but I don't want to pay for a gaming binge...

This is a weird one really.

 

[Zydrate]

I can see where some reactions can come from. If I was to fund her, it would be with the lowest possible amount because I want her to do this, but I don't want to pay for a gaming binge...

This is a weird one really.

It's no different than whatever funding she has had to binge on movies or books.

Besides. People CAN do something about it. People can donate to the kickstarter fund. That's something.

So we should donate to someone because you feel bad people are harassing them?

Christ, that's even worse than donating towards this crapfest in the first place. (Note that it's a crapfest not due to the topic (entirely) but because she clearly already HAS the means to create this show and is just begging for money because... well, she can. Kickstarter is at it's best when funding project that otherwise could not exist. That's why the concept was so exciting.)

*facepalm* Ugh, no, that's not what I meant.
I meant like giving her money as a sign of "They're being dicks, here's a donation, go you!"

I will repeat that I don't fully approve of the kickstarter thing she's doing. I don't think she needs the money. Reading other replies, I UNDERSTAND why she'd need a few grand for shiney cameras, travel costs for interviews, etc etc. I don't think she needs a HUNDRED THOUSAND to do this.

 

[Smeatza]

What I read in the article.
"Look, look how morally outraged I am, arn't I a good person?"

The abuse certainly shows that the issue needs to be addressed. I'm skeptical that she'll do a decent job of it though.

 

[Brad Calkins]

I know at some point, some moron will say something about the freedom of speech. But the freedom from speech is not freedom from consequence. If you let assholes be assholes, they'll just get worse.

Oh that's right. You won't because this is the internet and nothing about it matters. So much so, that you just can't wait to tell us all about it and how we're foolish we all are for not agreeing with you.

You don't have a real answer, do you.

 

[Ragsnstitches]

I can see where some reactions can come from. If I was to fund her, it would be with the lowest possible amount because I want her to do this, but I don't want to pay for a gaming binge...

This is a weird one really.

It's no different than whatever funding she has had to binge on movies or books.

Besides. People CAN do something about it. People can donate to the kickstarter fund. That's something.

So we should donate to someone because you feel bad people are harassing them?

Christ, that's even worse than donating towards this crapfest in the first place. (Note that it's a crapfest not due to the topic (entirely) but because she clearly already HAS the means to create this show and is just begging for money because... well, she can. Kickstarter is at it's best when funding project that otherwise could not exist. That's why the concept was so exciting.)

*facepalm* Ugh, no, that's not what I meant.
I meant like giving her money as a sign of "They're being dicks, here's a donation, go you!"

Considering you can pay as little as $1, means that a gesture like that won't break the bank.

Also, has she done a public fund for her youtube videos before, or does she get revenue from youtube?

Considering I'm not particularly confident towards crowdfunding (waiting on a few projects to pan out before I take the plunge), don't take my word as anything other then mild scepticism towards the system and its users, not the intent behind the project.

 

[Zydrate]

Considering I'm not particularly confident towards crowdfunding (waiting on a few projects to pan out before I take the plunge), don't take my word as anything other then mild scepticism towards the system and its users, not the intent behind the project.

Like I've said a couple times before.
I'm right there with you, I'm skeptical with some of this.

I just don't like the hatefest. It's practically proving some feminist's points.

 

[xDarc]

I mean, granted, it by no means justifies the abuse, but what can you do? I think the right thing for everyone to do in this situation would just be to give less fucks. Some woman making a stupid documentary? Who cares?

You read my mind, at one point I was literally finishing your next sentence before I read it.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Not familiar with the term.

Elaborate?

It's a manifestation of confirmation bias where the longer you argue a perspective, the more entrenched in an extreme position you become. It's most frequently used to describe the polarization of political belief, but it applies in all situations.

Simplest terms possible...when people argue emotionally, they tend to move further apart, rather than towards a point of consensus.

 

[Zydrate]

Not familiar with the term.

Elaborate?

It's a manifestation of confirmation bias where the longer you argue a perspective, the more entrenched in an extreme position you become. It's most frequently used to describe the polarization of political belief, but it applies in all situations.

Simplest terms possible...when people argue emotionally, they tend to move further apart, rather than towards a point of consensus.

That makes sense. And it's a goddamned shame.

I'm guilty of my own "Fair point, but..." thing, but at least I make an effort to see other sides. Which is why despite being a casual feminist, you don't see me writing novels in reply to some of the posts here.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

That makes sense. And it's a goddamned shame.

I'm guilty of my own "Fair point, but..." thing, but at least I make an effort to see other sides. Which is why despite being a casual feminist, you don't see me writing novels in reply to some of the posts here.

Occasionally I've had someone say they've had their mind changed by something I've said. Not often, but every now and then. Even on these forums.

Of course, when it does happen, I always like to assume it's because I'm extraordinarily persuasive, rather than credit them with being open minded. =P

 

[Zydrate]

Occasionally I've had someone say they've had their mind changed by something I've said. Not often, but every now and then. Even on these forums.

Of course, when it does happen, I always like to assume it's because I'm extraordinarily persuasive, rather than credit them with being open minded. =P

Haha, that's just mean!
Sadly, I have not had such luck. Maybe I'm not as good of a writer as you (Though I don't know you, but the few posts I have seen has had some much welcomed humor).

I'm sure I'll be making many faces when it does.

 

[lowhat]

What we really need is some "real" feminists to come forward.

Trouble is, they do. And they inevitably get screamed down by the same insecure, emasculated little boys you describe. The kind who are so scared of women that they feel the need to verbally harass them online, though not in person because then the big scary cops would come by and get all Politically Correct on their asses.

I really do believe that modern culture has this weird fear of femininity. And men have forgotten how to be men.

I'm pretty sure that when Christina Hoff Summers, who is a "real feminist" by any definition of the words, got screamed down for presenting the concept of equity feminism vs gender feminism, it wasn't the "man-children" of the world that did it.

It's interesting how the internet is so selective in it's treatment of online abuse. Not to excuse the vicious taunting of the woman making political videos for youtube, but I'm pretty sure that if she was some nerdy guy making political propaganda about the stereotypical portrayal of vegetarians in video games as weak, soft targets for FPS man to explode into a gory mist, this conversation wouldn't even be happening.

I happen to like FPS games, and I couldn't even begin to count the number of times I've been told "you just got raped so bad", or seen "let's rape the shit out of the other team", and yet, these comments didn't ignite a six figure controversy. Is there a reason that this kind of abusive shit is acceptable there(at least to the point of not generating huge "I'm so offended" threads online), but it's a global famine level crisis when a political rhetorician is on the receiving end?

This strikes me as a "if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen" situation, in that if you're going to wet yourself over getting the same kind of harassment/abuse that "80smontagesrcool4evr" gets for posting 80s style montages on youtube every 3 days, maybe you should stop posting shit on youtube.

 

[Zydrate]

I happen to like FPS games, and I couldn't even begin to count the number of times I've been told "you just got raped so bad", or seen "let's rape the shit out of the other team", and yet, these comments didn't ignite a six figure controversy. Is there a reason that this kind of abusive shit is acceptable there(at least to the point of not generating huge "I'm so offended" threads online), but it's a global famine level crisis when a political rhetorician is on the receiving end?

You don't see it, then. That shit ISN'T acceptable. And there's multiple topics of such harassment all over the place. Extra Credits and Moviebob have covered it.

I grit my teeth every time I hear the term used in such a casual manner. Like how "gay" became synonymous with "stupid".

I'm a gay female atheist. Internet life for me is FUN.