Hey Dragon, You Can Have Her: Final Fantasy VIII

[zidine100]

To be honest i kind of liked the draw and the junction system, i used draw in moderation and junction a swell made things a little bit more tactical if you didnt grind out all of the spells and stuff (i can see your point on how it is somewhat boring for normal people, but im one of those madmen who find databases interesting at times so yeh ignore this point, as my opinion is somewhat weird.)

And yes the story was pathetic, really pathetic, i would quote spoony on this but i cant remember the exact quote

Spoiler

but to defeat the big evil you have to let them win and your only strategy to defeat her is the power of Friendship.....FRIENDSHIP, they were trying to keep the timeline together with the power of FRIENDSHIP, there only strategy against the destruction of the universe was FRENDSHIP. AGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. ehm let me give you a few minutes to let that one sink in, and for me to regain my composure.

even a little kid would find that plan flawed hell im quite sure langua (sp?) thought that plan was stupid, and he tossed his friends of a mountan into the sea (where there was more than likely to be either rocks, or not deap enougth water to support the fall) to save them when he had oh i don't know about 99 freaking potions which could have easily healed them. AND he thought there plan was stupid/

and the battle system was breakable as hell.

Oh might i mention the triple triad card game GAH IT SHALL BURN.

unless you're a bad person and use emulators.

its not difficult to rip your own ps1 games and bios, using emulators does not equal that your a bad person. *sorry im just rather picky on that*

 

[jthm]

Aeris dies, they dont use a pheonix down. DERP!

Because we only had like 80 of those motherfuckers stocked up! Cloud might need them later!

As opposed to now!?

Yeah, someone important might die! Like Cait Sith!

 

[SavingPrincess]

Wow, nice to see everyone weighing in on this with minimal to no casting of "Flame 1" (see what I did there?)

Oh and, I'm interested what your take is on the mechanics if you wanna carry on.

I'm actually more interested in a trend that seems to be happening, where people who love the game aren't citing any of it having to do with the story itself. It's all about "I got to build up my characters" and "the summons and limit breaks were cool." Opposingly, the people coming down on the game's mechanics are also the ones coming down on the story. I leads me to believe that this game seems to cater to a type of mentality that may just escape me.

I also noticed the digression of the thread turning into things like arguing Final Fantasy VII v. Final Fantasy VIII which I suppose is logical enough, but hoped to avoid.

If you want to check out a more in-depth analysis of story mechanics in Final Fantasy and draw out even more of what went wrong in my opinion, check out this thread [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.181071-A-Princess-Worth-Saving-Final-Fantasy-Story-Mechanics].

Mechanically I can't really say more than what's already been said. This game was a game full of mechanical "ideas" that failed in execution. If I can leave a penny and rubber band wrapped around a controller, walk away (and consequently NOT play the game), and come back with my characters more powerful than before, that's a broken mechanic. It's not the first broken Final Fantasy by any means... (go back to Final Fantasy II and the "fight yourself" exploit, but even that required interactivity).

 

[Sylocat]

You know, I think the Laguna/Squall flashback story had the POTENTIAL to be one of the greatest stories of all time, but while the mystery was incredibly engaging at first, the payoff... well, I can't help thinking that the writing process went something like this: They came up with this brilliant idea for a setup: A mystery involving flashbacks that take the main character into the life of a predecessor, which would drop clues about the connection and explain the present-day events... but they came up with the mystery first, and had no idea what the payoff, the solution, the big reveal would be, so they choked and just winged it.

As for the "Guardian Forces give you selective amnesia" thing, not only was that the mother of all wall-bangers, but five seconds after reading it in the actual game, I found myself coming up with several explanations that could have made much more sense (Ellone erasing their memories of her in order to protect them, for instance). When I don't even have to think about it for five seconds to realize it doesn't make sense, AND I can instantly think of several better ways they could have done it... yikes.

 

[SavingPrincess]

The thing about Final Fantasy is that each entry feels different. Even if you're told that FF7 is the one to get, you should consider checking the others too. Although, the PC entries will limit you to only 7 and 8 unless you're a bad person and use emulators.

Emulators hurt my brain. The PS2 ones especially are a ***** to get running.

I'll give 7 a go. I'm not a massive JRPG guy, but it'd be nice to see what everyone's talking about.

Given your disposition and appreciation of story, I'd recommend picking up the GBA version or DS versions of Final Fantasy VI & IV respectively. Final Fantasy VII was quite good, but you might be turned off by a lot of the current stereotypes it had a hand in creating.

 

[LeonLethality]

I love how you say FFVII was a good game and fun to play, while I admit it has very interesting battle mechanics (albeit exploitable) it was overall boring for me, lifeless characters, forgettable story, repetitive battles etc. I thought they fixed a lot of those problems with FFVIII It had well rounded characters with personalities something that went away in VII (No clue why as VI was full of interesting well rounded characters) people criticize the draw system but in all reality there are many ways around it, Carding foes is free and easy and cards can be converted in to magic, in less than half the time it takes to draw. FFVIII was difficult and needed more strategy than the hold attack button battle that ruined the experience of VII. I think FFVIII was the fix to the failure that is VII but this is just my opinion, and many many people disagree with it. But to each his own.

I really dislike Nomura and miss Amano and it is true that the development of VIII was very different due to different people running it but it turned out a huge success. the fact that the developers went for what they did in VII meant it was time for a change and I think that worked as now each new FF is very different from the last due to constantly switching positions.

 

[SavingPrincess]

I love how you say FFVII was a good game and fun to play, while I admit it has very interesting battle mechanics (albeit exploitable) it was overall boring for me, lifeless characters, forgettable story, repetitive battles etc. I thought they fixed a lot of those problems with FFVIII It had well rounded characters with personalities something that went away in VII (No clue why as VI was full of interesting well rounded characters) people criticize the draw system but in all reality there are many ways around it, Carding foes is free and easy and cards can be converted in to magic, in less than half the time it takes to draw. FFVIII was difficult and needed more strategy than the hold attack button battle that ruined the experience of VII. I think FFVIII was the fix to the failure that is VII but this is just my opinion, and many many people disagree with it. But to each his own.

I really dislike Nomura and miss Amano and it is true that the development of VIII was very different due to different people running it but it turned out a huge success. the fact that the developers went for what they did in VII meant it was time for a change and I think that worked as now each new FF is very different from the last due to constantly switching positions.

You win for the only comment that was actually on topic, here's your cookie!

[cookie=for you]Cookie.[/cookie]

That out of the way, I agree with nearly everything you said to an almost scary degree. I wish Mistwalker would just swallow Yoshinori Kitase into its fold and Kitase, Sakaguchi, Uematsu and either Amano or Akira Toriyama can work together again. We'd end up with potentially another Final Fantasy VI or Chrono Trigger.

 

[LeonLethality]

You win for the only comment that was actually on topic, here's your cookie!

[cookie=for you]Cookie.[/cookie]

That out of the way, I agree with nearly everything you said to an almost scary degree. I wish Mistwalker would just swallow Yoshinori Kitase into its fold and Kitase, Sakaguchi, Uematsu and either Amano or Akira Toriyama can work together again. We'd end up with potentially another Final Fantasy VI or Chrono Trigger.

1. YAY COOKIE!

2. I would love another game on the same level as CT of FF6 But I want it to be something different as well, more of the same just loses its shine and that's why I want a few different developers thrown in the mix, but of course I want the same guys who made FF6 and CT in there too.

 

[rhyno435]

I liked the game. However, I'm refraining from playing through it again because I really don't want to grind through the card games and item collecting again, just to get the really good magic and the lionheart gunblade.

 

[A Weary Exile]

The thing about Final Fantasy is that each entry feels different. Even if you're told that FF7 is the one to get, you should consider checking the others too. Although, the PC entries will limit you to only 7 and 8 unless you're a bad person and use emulators.

Emulators hurt my brain. The PS2 ones especially are a ***** to get running.

I'll give 7 a go. I'm not a massive JRPG guy, but it'd be nice to see what everyone's talking about.

I think I would go with nine if I were you, it seems (To me anyway) to be the most universally liked. Nine and ten are my favorites, but not so many people enjoy ten, so I think nine would be your best bet.

OP: Nice review, I've always hated eight for the reasons you mentioned (And many, many more). Eight, X-2, and twelve are the absolute worst installements in the Final Fantasy series (IMO) and I was severly disappointed with all of them given my love for the other ones I've played.

 

[Daedalus1942]

It really pisses me off how people say FFVIII was the worst one. Yes some of the characters were annoying, and the story was decent (though not that well explained).
It was hardly the worst one. The gameplay I thought was quite inventive and unusual. I didn't mind the junction system and I thought the GF's were well done (i don't want to hear bitching about sitting through the long cutscenes everytime, it was done for a reason).
I enjoyed the card game and if anything I think the sidequests in FFVIII were some of the best in ANY final fantasy game. The only part I thought was kind of pointless was fighting the aliens on the Ragnarok, that seemed really out of place.
I love how everyone bitches about the the battle system for FFVIII, yet out of all the games, it's easily the most similar battle system to FFXIII, who'm everyone is raving about and praising the game for.
I am so sick of "hardcore elitist imbeciles" bitching about what was essentially a good game when it first came out (compare it to alot of the other crap that came out round the same time). I don't care if you didn't like it, but stop bitching about it and calling it the worst game in the series. It was better than Mystic Quest, X-2,IX, XII, crystal chronicles, chocobo's dungeon, my life as king, chocobo tales, dissidia, revenant wings (frankly the list could easily go on and on).

I've said my piece.

 

[SavingPrincess]

I am so sick of "hardcore elitist imbeciles" bitching about what was essentially a good game when it first came out (compare it to alot of the other crap that came out round the same time). I don't care if you didn't like it, but stop bitching about it and calling it the worst game in the series. It was better than Mystic Quest, X-2,IX, XII, crystal chronicles, chocobo's dungeon, my life as king, chocobo tales, dissidia, revenant wings (frankly the list could easily go on and on).

I've said my piece.

Well, as one of those supposed "hardcore elitist imbeciles" I have to ask:

Did you read the original post?

Also, I'd love to hear how Final Fantasy VIII's battle system is the "most similar" to Final Fantasy XIII as I find that it's closer to Final Fantasy X-2's "Dress Sphere" (read: Job) system.

Also, look at the games you say Final Fantasy VIII is better than: Mystic Quest, Final Fantasy X-2, Crystal Chronicles, Chocobo's Dungeon, My Life as King, Chocobo Tales, Dissidia, Revenant Wings...

None of those you mentioned (I have to disagree with you on Final Fantasy IX & XII, I believe those were both far better games than Final Fantasy VIII and can write a dissertation on the numerous reasons why) are part of the Final Fantasy series proper.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that one or more of the following assumptions are true:

• - Final Fantasy VIII was your first Final Fantasy gamme
  - You've never played a Final Fantasy game that didn't come on a disc
  - You played Final Fantasy VIII at a very young age (i.e. less than 14 years old)

Not trying to offend; the reason I say those things is that usually when someone tells me that Final Fantasy VIII is good (or the best) game in the series, one or more of those factors come into play... so it's more of a scientific thing based on experience than a personal attack.

That being well and good, Final Fantasy VIII is not a totally "bad" game (just mostly), it's a fine game, it's just not great, and borderlines on not being good when compared to others in the series. I give Final Fantasy XII a pass because it's not really Final Fantasy proper either, it's really Final Fantasy Tactics in the shape of a regular Final Fantasy game as everything is pulled from that universe (Ivalice) and the design is closer to Vagrant Story.

 

[Daedalus1942]

I am so sick of "hardcore elitist imbeciles" bitching about what was essentially a good game when it first came out (compare it to alot of the other crap that came out round the same time). I don't care if you didn't like it, but stop bitching about it and calling it the worst game in the series. It was better than Mystic Quest, X-2,IX, XII, crystal chronicles, chocobo's dungeon, my life as king, chocobo tales, dissidia, revenant wings (frankly the list could easily go on and on).

I've said my piece.

Well, as one of those supposed "hardcore elitist imbeciles" I have to ask:

Did you read the original post?

Also, I'd love to hear how Final Fantasy VIII's battle system is the "most similar" to Final Fantasy XIII as I find that it's closer to Final Fantasy X-2's "Dress Sphere" (read: Job) system.

Also, look at the games you say Final Fantasy VIII is better than: Mystic Quest, Final Fantasy X-2, Crystal Chronicles, Chocobo's Dungeon, My Life as King, Chocobo Tales, Dissidia, Revenant Wings...

None of those you mentioned (I have to disagree with you on Final Fantasy IX & XII, I believe those were both far better games than Final Fantasy VIII and can write a dissertation on the numerous reasons why) are part of the Final Fantasy series proper.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that one or more of the following assumptions are true:

• - Final Fantasy VIII was your first Final Fantasy gamme
  - You've never played a Final Fantasy game that didn't come on a disc
  - You played Final Fantasy VIII at a very young age (i.e. less than 14 years old)

Not trying to offend; the reason I say those things is that usually when someone tells me that Final Fantasy VIII is good (or the best) game in the series, one or more of those factors come into play... so it's more of a scientific thing based on experience than a personal attack.

That being well and good, Final Fantasy VIII is not a totally "bad" game (just mostly), it's a fine game, it's just not great, and borderlines on not being good when compared to others in the series. I give Final Fantasy XII a pass because it's not really Final Fantasy proper either, it's really Final Fantasy Tactics in the shape of a regular Final Fantasy game as everything is pulled from that universe (Ivalice) and the design is closer to Vagrant Story.

Yes, I played FFVIII at a very young age, and you're right it was the first one I owned.
I wasn't able to play it properly when I got it and I relied mainly on magic and GF's, had no idea how to junction or pull off limit breaks.

But that being said I've played it several times recently in the last few years and it still to this day remains one of my favourites. The characters (bar Selphie Tilmitt) are interesting, even though Squall's a tad too morose for my liking, the story's well put together though a tad convoluted, and the gameplay is lightyears ahead of FFI, II, III, V, VII, IX, and XII.

I really enjoyed the battle system and while summoning the Guardian Force took forever, later on when you acquire the boost ability for them you understand why its movie is so long.
I enjoyed manufacturing weapons as well as junctioning magic to my weapons, it was new, it was quirky and it worked (for me, obviously not others).
I liked the draw system even though the first time i played it I missed at least 60% of the GFs from bosses.

One thing you have to agree on surely are the sidequests. VIII had amazing sidequests the likes of which I hadn't seen in any other FF other than X.

I liked the subplot with all the characters being tied through [spoiler\]Matron's Orphanage where they all grew up together without knowing (or forgot) I don't remember which. [/spoiler]

I just don't understand why people hate it, as I said compared to the rest of the crap that came out around the same time, it wasn't that bad. It's always being picked on and I don't understand when it had alot of ideas implemented that I thought worked quite well.

Also, to answer your question about me not playing an FF on Cartridge, FFVI and IV (and then VIII) both happen to be my absolute favourite Final Fantasy games. I found 1 and 2 to be a tad lacklustre, though the individual stats for II was an interesting change from the other games.
I never finished V.
That for me was the worst one. Not a great plot, most annoying characters, nothing new in terms of the battle system and overall it just bored me (what sort of a name is Exdeath... really?).

 

[lapan]

I personally enjoyed FFVIII. Sure, the story may not be perfect and had some rather unexplained plottwists, but all in all it was a satisfying experience. Squall didn't seem that emo to me, more like an introverted asshole who just wants to be left alone by the rest of the cast. Since i didn't abuse the draw system back when i played it and didn't want to destroy any of my card collection for items the difficulty seemed just right to me back then.

All in all, it's definitly neither the best, nor the worst part in the Final Fantasy francise. I did enjoy it, thats all that matters to me

 

[Shoggoth2588]

I look forward to your analysis of Final Fantasy XIII.

For the record though, I am one of those people who thought Final Fantasy VIII was a 100% improvement over VII.

 

[SavingPrincess]

I look forward to your analysis of Final Fantasy XIII.

For the record though, I am one of those people who thought Final Fantasy VIII was a 100% improvement over VII.

I'd love to hear why you thought it was a "100% improvement" because the only thing I saw improving were the graphics... score wasn't bad either.

 

[darkheart291]

I know i'm about to slander some form of heresy and feel free to troll me about it but FF8 was actually my favourite of the Final Fantasy games.

 

[Soulkiller3]

ill have to admit, ff7 was my first FF and still is my top 3 best ever games played, but i did really enjoy FF8 and FF9, its after that I lost intrest. I ended up getting FF6 and playing that, alot more fun.

 

[The_Decoy]

Personally I just found it to be an enjoyable timesink, which is all I ask. Characters were fairly rounded, game play was alright. Though I must admit I was rather displeased when it took all my GF's off before that fight on the train and I didn't notice. Meant I had to do that bit all over again...

I enjoyed the complete Deus Ex Machina of the flying gardens. Just suddenly sprouting jet engines and screaming away from the missiles.

Anyways certainly not the best FF but certainly better than most games of other franchises.