How can "gamers" and "social justice warriors" get along?

[Burnouts3s3]

Lately, I've been noticing a massive divide between hardcore gamers and gaming journalists or critics with a social agenda. There has been a lot of accusing, finger pointing, misrepresentation on both sides, and an ugliness that I hoped never to witness.

What is the middle ground and how do we reach it?

The fact is that gaming has become a mainstream hobby and developers, publishers, artists, etc. should have the freedom to create whatever they want and critics have the right to criticize whatever they want. How do we move past the argument? How do we move past the name calling? How do we find the the paradise where all gamers, social and hardcore, man and woman, can join hands and say "We love Video Games!"? I like games but there's always room to get better, whether it's graphical, gameplay related or in a social meaning.

Can't we all just... get along?

 

[Elfgore]

Some "gamers" tend to knee-jerk when they hear the word diversity, they think that SJWs want to take away their games, or maybe they just don't want the criticism of things they love. SJWs on the other hand, some[footnote]please read this word very carefully[/footnote] sound like they almost want a quota on diversity or whatever in games. Like we need X female, LGBT, etc. main characters in games. I don't know how to appease even more moderate SJWs. How can we add more diversity in games without a quota? Both of these ideologies clash and war breaks out.

Honestly, I can't think of any kind of solution. Maybe by increasing the amount of non-white game designers might change things, but that isn't something we can control. We can't force more ethnicity and sexual orientations into the gaming industry and we can't just ignore a CIS male looking for work because he is one. I wish everything would work out, the internet would be a much better place.

I'm also only using the word SJW, because it is so much shorter to type than anything else.

 

[senordesol]

Why on Earth would you want that?

I'm serious. Art is meant to be analyzed and scrutinized, if you enjoy a piece of work; fine. There's nothing stopping you from enjoying it. But our medium will stagnate if those who are willing to look at it with a critical eye go away.

Because, at the heart of everything --we DO love games, and we constantly want to see them improve and be perfected. Some people will have different ideas on how to go about that; and that's OKAY. This isn't a Zero-Sum issue. CoD and DOA Beach Volleyball aren't going away just because the needs of the market have expanded.

There isn't going to be some great 'social justice war'. Some games will try to address social issues ham-fistedly, some will be a little more careful. In time the approach will become more refined, and we'll find something else that needs addressing.

 

[briankoontz]

The only way for "everyone to get along" is through repression or oppression, neither of which is good. It's better for everyone to make their arguments and debate with each other.

I've witnessed decades with minimal criticism of video games, so it's really nice that some gamers are finally starting to analyze games - it's no coincidence that this gamer awakening is happening at the same time that games are becoming more creative, varied, and interesting.

The solution is not "everyone getting along", but EVEN MORE analysis and debate about games.

 

[Zontar]

It's impossible given how it's a situation where one extreme is against all interference in the games industry by outside forces (with good reason after the history of both video games and entertainment in general), while the other is a group which will never be satisfied. Really this is probably going to just go the way of "violence in video games", where the majority of people who play video games simply not caring about the issue will have the industry do the same.

 

[Batou667]

The solution is to influence the market by voting with your wallet if you like what you see, and voting with your feet if you don't - not by trying to socially engineer an existing gaming culture to fit an agenda, or trying to legislate and dictate what people "ought" to like.

 

[JimB]

If gamers want to get along with warriors, then gamers need to stop acting like every single warrior is a burgeoning, larval Hitler trying to take away the gamers' games and penises, and be willing to listen to warriors' complaints with an open mind and a reconciliatory attitude.

If warriors want to get along with gamers, then warriors need to stop acting like every single gamer is a cheerleader for rapists who wants to chain all women in a fuck-dungeon, and be willing to listen to gamers' complaints with an open mind and a reconciliatory attitude.

So basically, it will never happen, because neither side is willing to concede the other is not composed exclusively of monsters.

 

[PsychicTaco115]

By getting all that sexual frustration out of their systems and having the biggest orgy ever

It's obviously sexual frustration, what else could it be?

Here, I'll put up some mood music free of charge!

Spoiler: Bow Chicka Wow Wow

 

[Evil Smurf]

Easy, people in favour of social justice, want people to be treated equally, fairly and not discriminated against. If other people can resist the urge to discriminate, be racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise shitty, we can all get along.

What's hard about that?

 

[Promethax]

This question seems like a false dilemma because it treats gamers and SJW's as two distinct groups. Gamers are a diverse group, and it's pretty clear that many SJW's are gamers themselves. SJW's can't even get along with themselves most of the time anyway.

 

[Eddie the head]

Easy, people in favour of social justice, want people to be treated equally, fairly and not discriminated against. If other people can resist the urge to discriminate, be racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise shitty, we can all get along.

What's hard about that?

I know this was rhetorical, but human psychology.( Quick note, it's always other people right?)

 

[Evil Smurf]

Easy, people in favour of social justice, want people to be treated equally, fairly and not discriminated against. If other people can resist the urge to discriminate, be racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise shitty, we can all get along.

What's hard about that?

I know this was rhetorical, but human psychology.( Quick note, it's always other people right?)

>: ( You know what I meant.

 

[Lord Krunk]

I appreciate diversity, so long as it doesn't feel forced. Truth be told, I don't particularly care what gender, sexuality or racial ethnicity the character I'm either playing as or interacting with is, so long as it makes sense and isn't obvious 'progressive' dick-swinging. I'm certain I'm in the majority in this case.

Stuff like the Assassins Creed debacle ring hollow (I assume this is at least partially what this is about), because at this point it's only being perpetuated by the people who wanted to be offended to begin with. The whole 'it's difficult to animate women' was stupid, and I'm the first to agree there, but the core of the Assassins Creed games from the beginning is its character-driven nature. All the co-op characters look the same because they're supposed to be variants of the same person, and a lot of people seem to be intentionally ignoring that tidbit of information.

So to the average gamer who is apathetic toward these kinds of social issues, it's all just white noise. An unpleasable portion of the fanbase getting way too smug and loud for their own good. And it reflects poorly on the saner elements of the social justice community.

Probably the most elegant solution: Stop complaining about content creators who don't do what you want them to do, and start leading by example. If you don't feel like you have the energy/resources/desire to make your own socially diverse content, that's fine. But giving some money and goodwill that the content creators who already do will work wonders. If all you do is complain, all you'll get is told to shut up by people who are beyond sick of hearing about it.

That said, there is a fine line between genuine game criticism and incessant whining.

tl;dr: Nobody likes getting stuff shoved down their throats by self-righteous assholes.

 

[StriderShinryu]

I think everyone needs to realize that gaming is, quite frankly, big enough that it can be for everyone. It's the emerging form of media in the modern age and, as such, can and should encompass everything that it wants to encompass. Put simply,game developers should be allowed to make the games they want to make and nothing is forcing everyone to like or play every game out there. There are going to be totally solid and totally enjoyable games that you don't actually like. And there's nothing wrong with that.

No one complains when every single movie doesn't cater to their interests. No one complains when every book isn't to their tastes. No one complains when every song on the radio isn't one they personally enjoy. Games, on the other hand, are currently being scrutinized from all sides with the apparent expectation that every single game must appeal to every gamer.. and this is just impossible given that everyone has different tastes and different desires in what they want to see in the medium. What needs to happen is that people need to realize that if you don't like a game, especially if it's one getting a lot of buzz or generating a lot of interest, it's not the end of the world. The status quo may be challenged, but the type of games you like aren't going to disappear.

All of that said, I also feel that the stereotypical "core gamer" needs to grow up and accept that diversity in games is a good thing overall. Whether that be diversity in the cast of characters or diversity of themes. More diversity will mean more people playing games, more people making games and more unique gaming experiences for everyone. Honestly, if your approach is one that leads to gaming being insular and exclusionary then I think the problem is bigger, and more of a personal issue, than anything limited to just videogames and we probably shouldn't be discussing it solely in that context.

 

[dragonswarrior]

I am a gamer and a social justice warrior and I get along with myself just fine.

Additionally, my house hold (myself and three others) are all gamers and social justice warriors and we get along with each other just fine.

My best friend is a gamer and a social justice warrior, and we get along just fine.

My brother is a gamer and a social justice warrior and we get along just fine.

So, I actually don't see the problem. There are a shit ton of problems in the world today that are overlooked and ignored, and a lot of those problems intersect with gaming. But it isn't just gamers that ignore and try to shout down these problems, everyone does it. So, for me personally, there isn't much difference between the average gamer who isn't fully aware of how shit some things are, and the average everyone else who isn't aware of how shit some things are. Except that I would personally like the gamers to be better quicker, because more of them like the same things I like and so it'd be nice if they would stop being problematic and offensive and oppressive a lot of the time.

 

[Lord Krunk]

As an addendum though, I was pretty happy that Nintendo took everyone's excitement about "female" Link to heart. Given that the creative director is very seriously considering making it a thing, I think this serves as a fine example of how to push diversity in the right direction in the games industry.

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

Easy, people in favour of social justice, want people to be treated equally, fairly and not discriminated against. If other people can resist the urge to discriminate, be racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise shitty, we can all get along.

What's hard about that?

Unfortunately, some people get different definitions of what is discrimination, racism, sexism, homophobia etc.

I mean, equal rights I can agree with, same wage for workers, and equal workers rights etc. But then you get the few loud idiots who say something ridiculous and scream that everyone's a fascist for disagreeing with them.
And then there's the "news" pieces about the next Creed being misogynistic, and Far Cry being racist.

I think we could all get along just fine as long as a few psychotic agitators were just ignored.

 

[Something Amyss]

Isn't that an artificial distinction? The "gamers" are doing the same things, just usually with more rape threats.

Maybe stop pretending it's two separate groups?