Infinity Ward Teases Modding Tools for PC Modern Warfare 2

[BonerMacTittyPants]

Hahahahahahaha.

No.



Fuck you Iw.

 

[Amnestic]

Fuck IW. Too little too late.

And for the author of this article, try veteran without lean. When you've had enough, then you can talk about it, till then shut the fuck up about stuff you haven't a clue about.

I wouldn't give a toss if IW went out of business but there's little chance of that happening unfortunately.

So - what - not one person has completed MW2 on Veteran because you can't lean?

 

[John Funk]

(and a curious stink over the most inconsequential complaint of all time, the removal of the ability to lean around corners).

Sorry.....inconsequential? It's a pretty big deal, especially for snipers. The whole "not balanced for lean" thing is complete BS. They simply didn't feel like putting it in.
Also:

[http://img25.imageshack.us/i/historyoflean1.gif/]

[http://g.imageshack.us/img25/historyoflean1.gif/1/]

Other FPS games manage just fine without lean. Judging by the popularity of MW2's multiplayer, it does too.

Okay, less annoyed now, time to write a proper response.


From one PC gamer to another, I can say I respectfully disagree with your view on leans and the controversies surrounding MW2 in general. Still, it's your call, I'll debate about it, but it doesn't make me angry.

What I refuse to be respectful about, and indeed what I think is generating so much anger is your insistence to shove your opinions down our throat every chance you get. would this article have been exactly the same without your derogatory remark? yes. I'm sorry, but to use a news article to bloviate is absolutely hideous journalism. If you have some rhetoric you want to vent about, please tell me, why couldn't you put it in an editorial?


If you were a forum user you could easily be banned for flame-baiting. As it is I personally think it's because the controversy attracts site hits, as this rapidly expanding thread shows. But regardless, can you honestly say that people have no good reason to be angry? If not for "not balanced for lean", then at you for so brazenly insulting users through the new posts?

Derogatory remark? It's an off-hand remark intended to make the news posts more interesting and entertaining to read rather than just writing it off like a robot. Show me wherever I've actively insulted players who feel that way, because I honestly haven't - even when arguing with people I disagree vehemently with, I've tried to keep it as cordial as possible.

We inject this sort of color commentary into our news posts all the time because they make them more interesting to read, and sometimes they're aimed at gamers, sometimes they're aimed at politicians, and sometimes they're aimed at Gabe Newell.

Coming from someone who once upon a time posted an impassioned plea to Blizzard's WoW team to not remove the ability to keep someone out of combat in a raid to resurrect players who had died, I understand full well what it's like to get angry over something that comes off as genuinely inconsequential to everyone else I've spoken to about it (and I have spoken to many people about it). But it doesn't mean I'm not going to think it's not silly now or in hindsight.

If I ever call the people who are angry about lean "brainless scumsucking ninnies" then you can criticize me all you want because you'd have one hell of a point. But saying that an argument is silly is hardly the same as insulting people.

 

[Say Anything]

I'm not defending anyone here and while I'm a bit off-topic I just have to say that I find it incredibly hilarious and immature that this much anger and hate can be carried out in regards to a remark towards the removal of a non-essential yet non-gamebreaking feature.

I had to check to make sure I wasn't in the religion and politics section for a second.

DAMN IT THIS COFFEE IS SWEETENED WITH SPLENDA WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO GOOD OLD SUGAR I'M NEVER BUYING THIS DAMN DRINK AGAIN

well excuse me good chap but while it's debatable we were just looking out for the coffee's best interest

 

[Doug]

I'm not defending anyone here and while I'm a bit off-topic I just have to say that I find it incredibly hilarious and immature that this much anger and hate can be carried out in regards to a remark towards the removal of a non-essential yet non-gamebreaking feature.

I had to check to make sure I wasn't in the religion and politics section for a second.

DAMN IT THIS COFFEE IS SWEETENED WITH SPLENDA WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO GOOD OLD SUGAR I'M NEVER BUYING THIS DAMN DRINK AGAIN

well excuse me good chap but while it's debatable we were just looking out for the coffee's best interest

I must admit, I do feel somewhat embarassed to appear on the same side as the 'fuck you, lean is important' people; I personally don't see it as that big of an issue, especially not when there's the actually game breaking stuff to complain about.

 

[Compatriot Block]

So, IW doesn't give you modding tools at first, so a lot of people complain. Now, they might release modding tools, so people pull the equivalent of a 5-year-old stomping their feet and
refusing a gift that they didn't get when they wanted.

And you wonder why IW doesn't want to spend more money than they have to.

I mean, I'm all for giving the PC players more stuff, but act like adults. Come on.

 

[fix-the-spade]

Too little too late?

No chance, put back mods and ded servers (officially) and I'd be out with my cash like a shot. MW2's multiplayer would be great if player's were afforded a little control and it ran smoothly. Unfortunately it does neither right now so I can't go out and but it for myself.

 

[hansari]

There are very real complaints with the PC version of MW2, but complaining about not being able to lean to the side is mind-numbingly inconsequential and petty, and is exactly the same as people complaining about a lack of grenades in TF2 from TFC. THEY CHANGED IT NOW IT SUCKS.

You mentioned in an earlier post how "if they'd balanced a game with lean from the beginning and then took it out, you'd have a point, but they never intended it to be in the game in the first place."

I just don't see the argument for that. The gameplay is based off its predecessor and many reviewers have noted how the gameplay isn't "different", but rather has made many "additions."

Not being able to lean puts you at a disadvantage against the AI, particularly in levels where your solo like Favela. If we were to talk about "balance" in gameplay, a good example would be how some weapons have thermal sights. Great for when enemy AI kills you through smoke. (like they did in MW1)

inconsequential and petty

See...this is where it started for me, and there are three problems I have with the statement.

1) We aren't talking about font size or color scheme. We are talking about a tactic that changes the way you play both online and offline. Its minor only at face-value, but then again, so was the removal of health kits for regeneration, or cooking grenades. These are minor changes that have had a huge impact.

Ex. Melee - When CoD first started, you would have to hit an enemy with full health 2-3 times with the butt of your rifle. This made the tactic unfavorable even when you were a few feet away. Why? Because it was more likely that your opponent would gun you down. Even if you had snuck up on someone, you would have shot them rather than meleed. Online and offline.

Now we have a knife which kills with 1 stab/throw. There are obvious changes in tactics and gameplay now to compensate for such a change. Which leads me into number two...

2) The developers didn't change the environment for lack of lean, the player adapted.

Again, a change to create balance was thermal sights, because the enemy AI would kill you through smokescreens with accuracy.

Removing leaning though doesn't address any unfairness. And your suggestion that it was "overpowered" not only shows your own difficulty in coming up with a reason, but...well we aren't talking about the grenade launcher or radar-perk here.

3) "There are very real complaints with the PC version of MW2"

On paper, leaning may seem "petty", but in real life its dedicated servers that is a "waste of time".

Sticking to principles has proven to be overrated with many people buying the game anyway. And the weeping of a hundreds of thousands of gamers on the interwebs and forums aren't gonna change that decision.

Now getting them to allow leaning in a patch...that seems more realistic don't it?

 

[Doug]

So, IW doesn't give you modding tools at first, so a lot of people complain. Now, they might release modding tools, so people pull the equivalent of a 5-year-old stomping their feet and
refusing a gift that they didn't get when they wanted.

And you wonder why IW doesn't want to spend more money than they have to.

I mean, I'm all for giving the PC players more stuff, but act like adults. Come on.

Actually, a) its a rumour they might at some point release modding tools, and b) I don't know about everyone else, but I would prefer they released dedicated servers.

 

[TOGSolid]

At this point, even if they added dedicated servers and mod tools, I still wouldn't touch MW2. Why, you may ask? Because the game is atrociously balanced and frankly the MP is just packed full of frat boy entertainment. Akimbo damn near everything? Get the fuck out of here with that. I didn't like the kill streaks in MW1 but could tolerate them, now they're ten times as worse. The balance in MW1 wasn't the greatest, but it worked ok. MW2 is just abysmal in how badly the MP weapons are balanced. MW2's MP isn't just a step backwards from MW1, it's like IW just turned around and ran the fuck away. Were they all drunk when they made MW2? With all of the glitches and balance issues, it sure seems like they were.

 

[Amnestic]

At this point, even if they added dedicated servers and mod tools, I still wouldn't touch MW2. Why, you may ask? Because the game is atrociously balanced and frankly the MP is just packed full of frat boy entertainment. Akimbo damn near everything? Get the fuck out of here with that. I didn't like the kill streaks in MW1 but could tolerate them, now they're ten times as worse. The balance in MW1 wasn't the greatest, but it worked ok. MW2 is just abysmal in how badly the MP weapons are balanced. MW2's MP isn't just a step backwards from MW1, it's like IW just turned around and ran the fuck away. Were they all drunk when they made MW2? With all of the glitches and balance issues, it sure seems like they were.

Technically with mod tools and dedicated servers, couldn't you make a server with more balanced weapons/perk loadouts?

Just a thought.

 

[John Funk]

There are very real complaints with the PC version of MW2, but complaining about not being able to lean to the side is mind-numbingly inconsequential and petty, and is exactly the same as people complaining about a lack of grenades in TF2 from TFC. THEY CHANGED IT NOW IT SUCKS.

You mentioned in an earlier post how "if they'd balanced a game with lean from the beginning and then took it out, you'd have a point, but they never intended it to be in the game in the first place."

I just don't see the argument for that. The gameplay is based off its predecessor and many reviewers have noted how the gameplay isn't "different", but rather has made many "additions."

Not being able to lean puts you at a disadvantage against the AI, particularly in levels where your solo like Favela. If we were to talk about "balance" in gameplay, a good example would be how some weapons have thermal sights. Great for when enemy AI kills you through smoke. (like they did in MW1)

inconsequential and petty

See...this is where it started for me, and there are three problems I have with the statement.

1) We aren't talking about font size or color scheme. We are talking about a tactic that changes the way you play both online and offline. Its minor only at face-value, but then again, so was the removal of health kits for regeneration, or cooking grenades. These are minor changes that have had a huge impact.

Ex. Melee - When CoD first started, you would have to hit an enemy with full health 2-3 times with the butt of your rifle. This made the tactic unfavorable even when you were a few feet away. Why? Because it was more likely that your opponent would gun you down. Even if you had snuck up on someone, you would have shot them rather than meleed. Online and offline.

Now we have a knife which kills with 1 stab/throw. There are obvious changes in tactics and gameplay now to compensate for such a change. Which leads me into number two...

2) The developers didn't change the environment for lack of lean, the player adapted.

Again, a change to create balance was thermal sights, because the enemy AI would kill you through smokescreens with accuracy.

Removing leaning though doesn't address any unfairness. And your suggestion that it was "overpowered" not only shows your own difficulty in coming up with a reason, but...well we aren't talking about the grenade launcher or radar-perk here.

3) "There are very real complaints with the PC version of MW2"

On paper, leaning may seem "petty", but in real life its dedicated servers that is a "waste of time".

Sticking to principles has proven to be overrated with many people buying the game anyway. And the weeping of a hundreds of thousands of gamers on the interwebs and forums aren't gonna change that decision.

Now getting them to allow leaning in a patch...that seems more realistic don't it?

I don't recall ever saying it was overpowered. Merely that it was different, and it apparently just wasn't part of the game they wanted to make.

 

[MR T3D]

So, IW doesn't give you modding tools at first, so a lot of people complain. Now, they might release modding tools, so people pull the equivalent of a 5-year-old stomping their feet and
refusing a gift that they didn't get when they wanted.

And you wonder why IW doesn't want to spend more money than they have to.

I mean, I'm all for giving the PC players more stuff, but act like adults. Come on.

Its hard for *us* (referring to the highly optimistic notion that PC gamers can be referred to as a single entity, when MW2 has really shown how divided *we* are, and you can't disagree with that statement) to accept that the developer of one of *our* favourite franchises starts removing several features *we* had come to accept, some even wished would be eventually extended to our console brothers, and then TEASE at giving some of them back and expecting *us* to forgive them for *****-slapping *us* well I for one will never forgive or forget, and if i couldn't articulate this notion, I would simply throw a fit, not yet knowing a good reason to still hate them.

I feel its a bad move to remove features that have always been in the PC game, just because the console one can't support them. that's BS as far as i'm concerned, the best effort SHOULD be made to give the console game the features of the PC game, and not just remove the features that PC has and consoles do not.

HOWEVER, i have seen videos of the maps in MW2, and to a very small extent see where lean would be very effective, but in no way could it be game-breaking, let alone unbalanced, as it would only really force some caution before sprinting down the hall, something you learn shortly after dying, once. not unbalanced in any way, really, its a feature everyone has, just like the 'balanced' perk stopping power, aswell as myriad of other things in the game.

 

[fix-the-spade]

Technically with mod tools and dedicated servers, couldn't you make a server with more balanced weapons/perk loadouts?

Just a thought.

Possibly, although I've just had a horrible thought.

What if 'mod tools' actually means something along the lines of Halo 3's Forge? There'll be a minor earth tremor from millions of heads hitting desks if that becomes the case.

Not that Forge is a bad system by any means, just that to the average modder that would be like asking an architect to build you a house, then giving him a duplo kit to do it with. Kind of limiting and very over simplified.

But it would allow players to address weapon load outs on maps, just without giving them a chance to address their major gripes or create any serious crazyness in the way Valve/id/Gearbox customers tend to.

 

[AndyFromMonday]

Why not introduce Dedicated Servers, JUST a thought.

 

[Baggie]

Mods? But... how will this work without a certain something called a dedicated server?

 

[The_Bearded_One]

mods are nice how bout them dedicated servers im sick of your so called IWnet

 

[Doug]

Technically with mod tools and dedicated servers, couldn't you make a server with more balanced weapons/perk loadouts?

Just a thought.

Possibly, although I've just had a horrible thought.

What if 'mod tools' actually means something along the lines of Halo 3's Forge? There'll be a minor earth tremor from millions of heads hitting desks if that becomes the case.

Not that Forge is a bad system by any means, just that to the average modder that would be like asking an architect to build you a house, then giving him a duplo kit to do it with. Kind of limiting and very over simplified.

But it would allow players to address weapon load outs on maps, just without giving them a chance to address their major gripes or create any serious crazyness in the way Valve/id/Gearbox customers tend to.

Hmmm, I don't think its that. After all, if it where a forge system, they wouldn't say 'PC modding tools'. And thats assuming this rumour is true. But if it where the forge system, I don't see them limiting it to the PC - after all, it comes from an XBox game, so no reason to assume it won't be a console thing too.

 

[CAW4]

Here's an idea for all you PC players; quit bitching. Just because you're using a PC doesn't magically entitle you to benefits that other players on different consoles don't get.
Honestly, you PC players are acting like kidults who just learned they have to work for a living.