Is Freedom Of Speech All It's Cracked Up To Be?

[interspark]

Ok, here's a thought, a lot of people think that they can say whatever they want, regardless of how racist, hurtful or upsetting it might be, simply by waving "freedom of speech" in people's faces. The fact is, words can do more damage than we give credit for, hundreds of school kids commit suicide because of relentless abuse, very often verbal, and insults and outcasting can often hurt a LOT more than any physical abuse, so does anyone else believe that there are certain things that LEGALLY, we should and shouldn't be allowed to say? Discuss-

 

[CODE-D]

Darwinism? there has to be something to weed out the weak. If words hurt you, come back stronger. Embarrassment and lack of consideration are probably to blame but whaya gonna do. If everyone was nice itd be boring. But heres the thing, a lot of people who do get made fun of/called names and just plain harassed come back to be better people(or sociopaths...) and go on to do great things.
7 billion people, just saiyan.

 

[Dandark]

No freedom of speech is not all America cracks it up to be. I'd say it works well here in Britain except for the part where muslims are treated as an exception since nobody wants to be "Racist".

 

[Dandark]

No freedom of speech is not all America cracks it up to be. I'd say it works well here in Britain except for the part where muslims are treated as an exception since nobody wants to be "Racist".

well thats why we don't have full freedom of speech, it stops with "hate speech" or some such silly term.

But it works.

Oh and i agree, its one of the many silly things americans harp on about and i honestly think the "american dream" is harmful as it prizes the one above the many. Which is selfish as hell.

If people carry it too far then it becomes hate speech, for example the WBC would not be allowed to protest over here as there message would be considered hate speech which is what it is.
My only complaint is that Muslims are still allowed to practice hate speech but it's a complicated matter that I hope gets resolved at some point, since I like the way it works here. Freedom of speech as long as it doesn't become hate speech.

 

[Lionsfan]

Freedom of Speech exists. You can say whatever you want, whether it's racist, sexist, derogatory, homophobic, etc. etc., and you won't get censored by the government (unless it's Libel/Slander)

However, there are always consequences to what you say, and anyone who thinks otherwise lives in a 1950's sitcom

 

[Thaluikhain]

It's a difficult issue.

We absolutely know that words have an effect on people. To scoiety they grow up in greatly influences them, to say nothing of the billions spent on advertising and propaganda.

On the other hand, limiting what people can say is very dangerous.

Like most things "it depends". It hate to bring up Hitler, but if he'd been banned from public speaking and mass media, nobody would remember his name. On the other hand, give the government the power to silence the next Hitler and they are likely to silence various others.

Of course, most discussions about free speech don't seem to involve this, they seem to be about people demanding the right to claim the ________s are less due to gender/race/sexuality/whatever, and not get called up on it in return.

Yes, if various speakings were banned (and it could be made to stick), then you could save any number of, say, gay people from abuse, murder, suicide etc, but at a cost to everyone else. I guess the question is should we protect them, or look to everyone else's interests, and the answer is likely to depend on which group the answerer falls into.

 

[Verzin]

Darwinism? there has to be something to weed out the weak. If words hurt you, come back stronger. Embarrassment and lack of consideration are probably to blame but whaya gonna do. If everyone was nice itd be boring. But heres the thing, a lot of people who do get made fun of/called names and just plain harassed come back to be better people(or sociopaths...) and go on to do great things.
7 billion people, just saiyan.

I don't really like how you state this. It seems callous and mildly cruel, but unfortunately, I have to agree with you.
There is a quote I like that I think applies here: "Sometimes you have to suffer a little bit in your youth to motivate yourself to succeed in later life. Do you think if Bill Gates got laid in high school, do you think there'd be a Microsoft?
Of course not.
You got to spend a long time in your own locker with your underwear shoved up your ass before you start to think, "You'll see. I'm going to take of the world of computers! I'll show them."

the point, I think, is that adversity, torment even, is absolutely vital to prepare kids for the real world.
The real world, the world outside of school and family, is a dark, cruel, unfeeling, sadistic, and remorseless meat grinder. Anyone who comes into the real world unprepared without being lucky enough to have the way paved out for them is not getting anywhere without finding their soft, easily injured self-esteem torn into shreds. better the lesson is learned early.
The reality, in my opinion, is that negative re-enforcement is 1000% stronger than positive will ever be. How could it not? Nothing teaches like pain. I don't believe that anything can teach a lesson more clearly than overcoming it. and those who don't or can't? well....too bad. another terribly sad truth is that not everyone can succeed in our current society. Those who can't deal with the world in a constructive way are....well..screwed. If they're lucky, they'll manage to get by in a reasonably comfortable manner, if they're not...homelessness, mental institutions, and welfare are what they have to look forward to.

EDIT (forgot to add): Limiting human behavior beyond what is necessary to keep us from raping and butchering each other in mass is extremely dangerous! History books are ABSOLUTELY FILLED with examples of where that particular path leads.
We are a cruel species OP. Hateful, willfully ignorant, violent...I'm ashamed to be a part of our society more often than I'd care to admit, but there is no point in denying it.

 

[Chimpzy_v1legacy]

Too many people confuse 'Freedom of Speech' with 'Freedom To Be An Asshole'.

Having the freedom to do something doesn't mean you should. It doesn't give you the right to be heard or agreed with, nor does it prove you right, nor does it guarantee you are free of consequences.

 

[viranimus]

Ok, here's a thought, a lot of people think that they can say whatever they want, regardless of how racist, hurtful or upsetting it might be, simply by waving "freedom of speech" in people's faces. The fact is, words can do more damage than we give credit for, hundreds of school kids commit suicide because of relentless abuse, very often verbal, and insults and outcasting can often hurt a LOT more than any physical abuse, so does anyone else believe that there are certain things that LEGALLY, we should and shouldn't be allowed to say? Discuss-

/facepalm


NO!

The only person who can give words power is you. World, Stop trying to convince people that stomping on peoples rights is a good thing because some rice paper skinned jackovs failed to study the complex and longstanding principles governed by the law of sticks and stones.

If someone wants to call me nazi welfare receiving baby raper I would gladly let them so I still retain the freedom to call a shitty idea, a shitty idea.I kmow I am not, and anyone who knows me knows they are wrong, so I simply cannot be compelled to give a single fuck what they think.

 

[MysticToast]

Ok, here's a thought, a lot of people think that they can say whatever they want, regardless of how racist, hurtful or upsetting it might be, simply by waving "freedom of speech" in people's faces. The fact is, words can do more damage than we give credit for, hundreds of school kids commit suicide because of relentless abuse, very often verbal, and insults and outcasting can often hurt a LOT more than any physical abuse, so does anyone else believe that there are certain things that LEGALLY, we should and shouldn't be allowed to say? Discuss-

/facepalm


NO!

The only person who can give words power is you. World, Stop trying to convince people that stomping on peoples rights is a good thing because some rice paper skinned jackovs failed to study the complex and longstanding principles governed by the law of sticks and stones.

If someone wants to call me nazi welfare receiving baby raper I would gladly let them so I still retain the freedom to call a shitty idea, a shitty idea.

Freaking this.

I was trying to think of a good way to say it but this guy hit the nail on the head.

 

[Aprilgold]

Yeah, it is. I can go out into the public and scream that all Jews should be purged from the land and all woman should be pregnant, but that doesn't mean that I wouldn't get arrested afterwards.

It only means that I can speak, not that it won't have repercussions.

It's a difficult issue.

We absolutely know that words have an effect on people. To scoiety they grow up in greatly influences them, to say nothing of the billions spent on advertising and propaganda.

On the other hand, limiting what people can say is very dangerous.

Like most things "it depends". It hate to bring up Hitler, but if he'd been banned from public speaking and mass media, nobody would remember his name. On the other hand, give the government the power to silence the next Hitler and they are likely to silence various others.

Of course, most discussions about free speech don't seem to involve this, they seem to be about people demanding the right to claim the ________s are less due to gender/race/sexuality/whatever, and not get called up on it in return.

Yes, if various speakings were banned (and it could be made to stick), then you could save any number of, say, gay people from abuse, murder, suicide etc, but at a cost to everyone else. I guess the question is should we protect them, or look to everyone else's interests, and the answer is likely to depend on which group the answerer falls into.

I agree with you on this one. We do know that words, can infact cause highly tramatic things to happen in a person's life. Not only that, but society basically speaks to its people and can influence their likes. Boy's like Fire Trucks, girls like Barbies and stuff like that.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

No freedom of speech is not all America cracks it up to be. I'd say it works well here in Britain except for the part where muslims are treated as an exception since nobody wants to be "Racist".

well thats why we don't have full freedom of speech, it stops with "hate speech" or some such silly term.

But it works.

Oh and i agree, its one of the many silly things americans harp on about and i honestly think the "american dream" is harmful as it prizes the one above the many. Which is selfish as hell.

If people carry it too far then it becomes hate speech, for example the WBC would not be allowed to protest over here as there message would be considered hate speech which is what it is.
My only complaint is that Muslims are still allowed to practice hate speech but it's a complicated matter that I hope gets resolved at some point, since I like the way it works here. Freedom of speech as long as it doesn't become hate speech.

WBC have actually been banned from coming here to protest before. I punch that into my calculator it comes out with a happy face ^^

And i agree theres a bit of unevenness when it comes to muslims, but its a touchy issue because people don't want to be accused as part of islamaphobia (thank you for that daily mail).

Add on to that, people really, really, really, really, really, really, really don't want to be associated with these guys: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PL1jDcAHkc8

 

[Seventh Actuality]

Not the retarded perversion of it that covers targeted harassment, incitement to violence and defaming lies which a lot of Americans seem to believe in, no. Trying to defend the WBC picketing funerals and people abusing the relatives of children who committed suicide online (to take examples I've actually seen on this site) on the "slippery slope" basis demeans actual freedom of speech and makes it that much harder to defend in legitimate cases. There are plenty of countries with much more sensible versions of it that somehow don't turn into Orwellville, though.

 

[370999]

Yeah, it is. I can go out into the public and scream that all Jews should be purged from the land and all woman should be pregnant, but that doesn't mean that I wouldn't get arrested afterwards.

It only means that I can speak, not that it won't have repercussions.

That's not freedom of speech. Freedom of speech implies freedom from government censor otherwise I have freedom of rape, freedom of murder, freedom of theft, etc.

Freedom of speech is a very nuanced thing, honestly i tend to having it be as free as possible. To me, suffering the occasional unpleasant comment or unsavory view is far more palatable then trusting in a government official to determine what can be said and what shouldn't be.

 

[Ifrit7th]

It's unfortunate that people like WBC and Neo-Nazi groups get their say, but if it means that I can say whatever I want free of persecution from the law, then I'll support the right even if I don't agree with the message.

That said, Freedom of Speech is not freedom from consequence; if someone says something racist, they deserve to be ostracized for it, just not put in jail for their words.

 

[bz316]

One cannot have the benefits of something and escape its negative effects. You cannot have crops without rain, you cannot have joy without suffering to contrast it, you cannot have life-giving sun and no annoying glare that gets in your face while trying to drive home. Its the same with free speech. Its a shame that some people use it to express hateful things, but forbidding people from saying it will not change their hate. Complaining about the negative consequences of free speech is akin to complaining that life isn't perfect. I still prefer being alive to not being alive, and by the same token I prefer having the right to free speech to not having the right. At least my ability to speak freely allows me the freedom to tell hateful jerks to go fuck themselves...