Is it just me or will American troops' stupidity never stop?

[Azeban]

And frankly, I value a puppy over his life any day.

You know, arguments like this are what prevent me from calling myself a liberal. I agree with all of the political opinions of liberals, such as gay marriage, freedom of speech, etc. They all make sense to me. Liberals, however, sometimes get a bit misguided.

Max...

It's a puppy. An animal.

This poor dude is stuck in Iraq, constantly facing the threat of being blown to smithereens at any second. Unless you've gone through that, you can't possibly judge this man's life as worth less than an animal's. You can't know that you wouldn't crack under that pressure.

Yeah, it's sad. He probably should be expelled from the marines, before his actions cause another generation of Iraqis to think of Americans as assholes. However, his life is still worth more than the life of a puppy.

You can't displace your anger over this war onto this misguided guy.

These men and women joined the military to protect America and its freedoms. At the same time, conservatives, you can't say that the military is dying for our freedom...because they're not, not right now. They're dying for nothing. I agree that they do deserve our respect, however. They best way to respect them is to recognize that their lives are worth more than proving that your political party was right about Iraq, and therefore call them back. We're not going to fix the middle east.

You're making a lot of assumptions here.
I am not a liberal, one. I don't identify with either party.
What I am, however, is misanthropic. I don't like people until they prove to me they deserve to be liked. I don't value someone until they deserve that value.
I don't know this guy, for all I know he could be the greatest person ever. He did something stupid, and, in my opinion, wrong, and that's what I'm going to judge him on. Harsh, probably, but too bad for him.

You're right, though. He chose to go there, probably knowing he'd face death or boredom. That's still not an acceptable reason to throw anything off a cliff, human child or puppy.

Also: I'm not "angry" about the war. I think it's pointless, yes. I think it's wasteful, yes. I think it's bad for our image, yes.
Whether Bush had the best intentions or not, I don't know, but I doubt he went to war because there was FREEDOM to spread, or whatever.

Oh, also: Humans are animals too. You should probably remember that.
Final note: I'm not angry, I just don't think he's a person. I consider a lot of people unpeople. Even if your argument wasn't full of assumptions about my political affiliations (none, if you must know,) that wouldn't change what I think of this guy.

Oh, the only part targeted directly to you was that human lives are worth more than animal lives. I'd kick 100 puppies off a cliff if it would save a human life. The rest of it was to everyone else.

I'm similarly misanthropic, but I still value human life, because I recognize my life is more valuable than a puppies, and therefore so is yours and his.

Don't you think that you'd crack under the pressure though? I mean, it's all well and good to think that you'd never do that, but watching everyone around you die day after day can do funny things to a person. You're not in the conditions they're in. Sure, they signed up for it, but I don't think it's possible to anticipate how bad that would be. Many military personnel signed up with intentions of protecting this country, when most of us thought of Iraq as a threat.

Furthermore, these people need to be callous and uncaring about the value of life. It's their job to extinguish lives on command.

I don't understand your argument that people can be not people.

 

[electric discordian]

The highest level of US stupidity came in the first gulf war when they blew up a friend of mines fathers APC, they had a Union Jack painted on the roof answered all the hails and still 2 A10 tankbusters blew the thing apart with armour piercing bullets and rockets this after being visually ID'd and having a conversation with a US command post in person ten minutes before the incident.

His father was cooked alive inside his vehicle and my mate went pretty much mental and is now in a home.......

So yeah American stupidity.

 

[littlelacysurprisepageant]

Stupidity will always exist in all armies. They're only human after all.

 

[DragunovHUN]

I saw this on youtube earlier and started to think 'What depths will American troops not sink to?'

This? This is nothing. That guy just played a harmless joke on the kid. I guess you haven't seen what they do with puppies and sheep, eh? If you think this is bad, don't even watch those.

 

[Neonbob]

That was pretty funny. It was a little off-color, but thinking about the crap those guys have to deal with on a day-to-day basis, a harmless joke like that is perfectly fine with me.

 

[Lyiat]

I saw this on youtube earlier and started to think 'What depths will American troops not sink to?'

Watch the link and you will see what i am talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpFY3YOSAZ8&feature=related

... Seriously? I'm actually a little offended that your taking that video at face value. The soldier was joking, through and through, and the kid UNDERSTOOD THAT and took it as a joke. God, I've seen parents and family do far worse to their own children. Like when my uncle kept threatening to drop my beta fish into his piranha tank (and then DID IT), or threw me around in the pool. The kid was under absolutely no danger, nor would have the soldier actually have given him the damn grenade. Use your bloody head, kid, before you start making fun of the ENTIRE AMERICAN ARMY because of what one GI found entertaining.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3CH2GFh8Jc&feature=related

There's so much of this. It make all American soldiers look bad.

EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE4yG8_UkqY&feature=related - There's more of it.

And your not much better, mate. Have you ever been in an area with a bunch of kids screaming in your ear? You tend to get a little snappy. Especially when your job is to be fighting people who shoot at you. As for the other one, thats called a training session. They are just screwing around for the camera.

Wow, you just sound like you've had a really shitty life. And now you want everyone else to suffer too.

Just because you were treated like crap and turned out "okay" does not mean that everyone else needs to go through the same level of shit that you did.

... What? Ok, mate, you shouldn't even be allowed to talk anymore. There are a million and one things wrong with what you just said and the ignorance is glaring me in the face right now. I have a very, very ignorant family. My mother is the typical blond and my step-father is a layabout. I have a redneck uncle and aunt, and then the family on my father's side have so many mental issues we might as well fill a psych ward.... Now, have I had a bad childhood?

Hardly. My father is/was (I stayed with my mother) a good man and I enjoyed spending time with him thoroughly, and I have a wonderful uncle who kept me interested in technology and knowledge. I am the first person in my family to graduate from highschool and continue on directly into college. I've also had a loving girlfriend for the past four years, and I've been considered part of their family for just as long.

My entire statement here is that the OP has no idea what cruelty and negligence is. If he thinks that whole grenade joke is:

A) The worst thing in the world
B) Representative of the entire US Army

... Than he is -exceedingly- ignorant. One catholic priest rapes a young boy, so clearly all Catholics must be rapists. A select few Muslims blow up several buildings in the US, so clearly ALL Muslims are terrorists, right? That is the type of ignorance that the OP is perpetrating here.

There are complete IDIOTS in the Army. I will admit that. I am, however, not going to bloody sit here and listen to these blanket statements about the people protecting my rights and liberties every damn day from the people that would rather see me burn in hell. Good day to you sir.

 

[Ionami]

Spoiler

I saw this on youtube earlier and started to think 'What depths will American troops not sink to?'

Watch the link and you will see what i am talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpFY3YOSAZ8&feature=related

... Seriously? I'm actually a little offended that your taking that video at face value. The soldier was joking, through and through, and the kid UNDERSTOOD THAT and took it as a joke. God, I've seen parents and family do far worse to their own children. Like when my uncle kept threatening to drop my beta fish into his piranha tank (and then DID IT), or threw me around in the pool. The kid was under absolutely no danger, nor would have the soldier actually have given him the damn grenade. Use your bloody head, kid, before you start making fun of the ENTIRE AMERICAN ARMY because of what one GI found entertaining.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3CH2GFh8Jc&feature=related

There's so much of this. It make all American soldiers look bad.

EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE4yG8_UkqY&feature=related - There's more of it.

And your not much better, mate. Have you ever been in an area with a bunch of kids screaming in your ear? You tend to get a little snappy. Especially when your job is to be fighting people who shoot at you. As for the other one, thats called a training session. They are just screwing around for the camera.

Wow, you just sound like you've had a really shitty life. And now you want everyone else to suffer too.

Just because you were treated like crap and turned out "okay" does not mean that everyone else needs to go through the same level of shit that you did.

... What? Ok, mate, you shouldn't even be allowed to talk anymore. There are a million and one things wrong with what you just said and the ignorance is glaring me in the face right now. I have a very, very ignorant family. My mother is the typical blond and my step-father is a layabout. I have a redneck uncle and aunt, and then the family on my father's side have so many mental issues we might as well fill a psych ward.... Now, have I had a bad childhood?

Hardly. My father is/was (I stayed with my mother) a good man and I enjoyed spending time with him thoroughly, and I have a wonderful uncle who kept me interested in technology and knowledge. I am the first person in my family to graduate from highschool and continue on directly into college. I've also had a loving girlfriend for the past four years, and I've been considered part of their family for just as long.

My entire statement here is that the OP has no idea what cruelty and negligence is. If he thinks that whole grenade joke is:

A) The worst thing in the world
B) Representative of the entire US Army

... Than he is -exceedingly- ignorant. One catholic priest rapes a young boy, so clearly all Catholics must be rapists. A select few Muslims blow up several buildings in the US, so clearly ALL Muslims are terrorists, right? That is the type of ignorance that the OP is perpetrating here.

There are complete IDIOTS in the Army. I will admit that. I am, however, not going to bloody sit here and listen to these blanket statements about the people protecting my rights and liberties every damn day from the people that would rather see me burn in hell. Good day to you sir.

I'm not religious, and don't know/care whether or not you burn in hell. I just said you sound angry, and you listed some examples of your family being hurtful. I don't know you, so I tied together some things you said about yourself.

And don't kid yourself. You DO sound angry. Whether that's because of your family/childhood or not, you sound angry as hell.

If it's not your family, then please accept my apologies, it was obviously an incorrect assumption, but you can at least understand why I may have made that assumption can't you?

As to the puppy cliff dive, I have two things to add:

If he's been ordered or required to put the dogs/puppies down in order to be humane, then just do that. Shoot it in the head. Don't joke around like an asshole and throw it off a cliff. Be professional.

And also, yes the soldiers are surrounded by death and horror. But why then, would you want to ADD to that? And if you absolutely have NO choice, then do it quickly and properly and move on.

They're clearly joking around in the video, it's funny to them. That's what's so wrong about it. As terrible as it is to have to put these animals down, they make it worse with that behavior.

 

[Lyiat]

Spoiler

I saw this on youtube earlier and started to think 'What depths will American troops not sink to?'

Watch the link and you will see what i am talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpFY3YOSAZ8&feature=related

... Seriously? I'm actually a little offended that your taking that video at face value. The soldier was joking, through and through, and the kid UNDERSTOOD THAT and took it as a joke. God, I've seen parents and family do far worse to their own children. Like when my uncle kept threatening to drop my beta fish into his piranha tank (and then DID IT), or threw me around in the pool. The kid was under absolutely no danger, nor would have the soldier actually have given him the damn grenade. Use your bloody head, kid, before you start making fun of the ENTIRE AMERICAN ARMY because of what one GI found entertaining.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3CH2GFh8Jc&feature=related

There's so much of this. It make all American soldiers look bad.

EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE4yG8_UkqY&feature=related - There's more of it.

And your not much better, mate. Have you ever been in an area with a bunch of kids screaming in your ear? You tend to get a little snappy. Especially when your job is to be fighting people who shoot at you. As for the other one, thats called a training session. They are just screwing around for the camera.

Wow, you just sound like you've had a really shitty life. And now you want everyone else to suffer too.

Just because you were treated like crap and turned out "okay" does not mean that everyone else needs to go through the same level of shit that you did.

... What? Ok, mate, you shouldn't even be allowed to talk anymore. There are a million and one things wrong with what you just said and the ignorance is glaring me in the face right now. I have a very, very ignorant family. My mother is the typical blond and my step-father is a layabout. I have a redneck uncle and aunt, and then the family on my father's side have so many mental issues we might as well fill a psych ward.... Now, have I had a bad childhood?

Hardly. My father is/was (I stayed with my mother) a good man and I enjoyed spending time with him thoroughly, and I have a wonderful uncle who kept me interested in technology and knowledge. I am the first person in my family to graduate from highschool and continue on directly into college. I've also had a loving girlfriend for the past four years, and I've been considered part of their family for just as long.

My entire statement here is that the OP has no idea what cruelty and negligence is. If he thinks that whole grenade joke is:

A) The worst thing in the world
B) Representative of the entire US Army

... Than he is -exceedingly- ignorant. One catholic priest rapes a young boy, so clearly all Catholics must be rapists. A select few Muslims blow up several buildings in the US, so clearly ALL Muslims are terrorists, right? That is the type of ignorance that the OP is perpetrating here.

There are complete IDIOTS in the Army. I will admit that. I am, however, not going to bloody sit here and listen to these blanket statements about the people protecting my rights and liberties every damn day from the people that would rather see me burn in hell. Good day to you sir.

I'm not religious, and don't know/care whether or not you burn in hell. I just said you sound angry, and you listed some examples of your family being hurtful. I don't know you, so I tied together some things you said about yourself.

And don't kid yourself. You DO sound angry. Whether that's because of your family/childhood or not, you sound angry as hell.

If it's not your family, then please accept my apologies, it was obviously an incorrect assumption, but you can at least understand why I may have made that assumption can't you?

Oh, your right about me being angry. I'm downright pissed off with how people have been treating my country and my people. America is a great country with a rich culture and generally good people. We have our share of absolute morons, but when people cite those morons as being the entirety of us, I tend to get a little upset. We've been made out to be the cesspool of the world as of late, and its absolutely inane and insulting to be singled out in this way.

Every single country has their skeletons in the closet. Japan invaded China and raped their women while committing wholesale slaughter. The Hebrews came in from out in the desert and decided to lay claim to an entire land, telling everyone else to GTFO. Likewise, the Eygptions enslaved the Hebrews. England assaulted large portions of Africa and Asia, and also subjugated America for a long time. And America? Iraq and Korea. Enough said there. If every single countries entire culture is biased off of a select few horrible individuals and mistakes, then let me tell you that there is NO good in the world anymore, my friend. Its just absolute ignorance for these blanketed statements to be continued.

 

[Azeban]

People seem to be missing something here.

You don't think rationally when put under severe stress.

Hell, humans don't ever think rationally. It's been proven time and again that humans first form an opinion with their emotions, and then rationalize it second.

 

[NoSeraph]

let me put it this way. 49% of all world millitayr spending is spent by america. and all the contries they are at war with spend less than 1% of the worlds military spending. and america is still strugling

Sources? Context? Numbers standing on their own don't do much for me, and all they really do is encourage rampant speculation on what they could possibly indicate.

If your figures are accurate, it is important to remember that the U.S. has bases all over the world, a very large and prominent standing military, and the most modern armaments on land, sea, and air. Military spending also includes homeland security, veteran's benefits, and wages for non-combat government workers (the Pentagon, for example).

Take into account that the U.S. is also a primary player in international peace-keeping and humanitarian efforts and the 49% that you quote makes more sense.

Please be more prudent in your posting of statistics in the future - it would reflect much more favourably on you, and would also help to dispel any hate-speech/flaming of a collective group of people.

 

[Ionami]

Oh, your right about me being angry. I'm downright pissed off with how people have been treating my country and my people. America is a great country with a rich culture and generally good people. We have our share of absolute morons, but when people cite those morons as being the entirety of us, I tend to get a little upset. We've been made out to be the cesspool of the world as of late, and its absolutely inane and insulting to be singled out in this way.

Every single country has their skeletons in the closet. Japan invaded China and raped their women while committing wholesale slaughter. The Hebrews came in from out in the desert and decided to lay claim to an entire land, telling everyone else to GTFO. Likewise, the Eygptions enslaved the Hebrews. England assaulted large portions of Africa and Asia, and also subjugated America for a long time. And America? Iraq and Korea. Enough said there. If every single countries entire culture is biased off of a select few horrible individuals and mistakes, then let me tell you that there is NO good in the world anymore, my friend. Its just absolute ignorance for these blanketed statements to be continued.

Well I guess it's good I didn't make a blanket statement about your country then.

Also, you wanna talk about your country getting bagged on a lot? I'm Canadian. We're the CHAMPIONS of being ripped on.

 

[Lyiat]

Oh, your right about me being angry. I'm downright pissed off with how people have been treating my country and my people. America is a great country with a rich culture and generally good people. We have our share of absolute morons, but when people cite those morons as being the entirety of us, I tend to get a little upset. We've been made out to be the cesspool of the world as of late, and its absolutely inane and insulting to be singled out in this way.

Every single country has their skeletons in the closet. Japan invaded China and raped their women while committing wholesale slaughter. The Hebrews came in from out in the desert and decided to lay claim to an entire land, telling everyone else to GTFO. Likewise, the Eygptions enslaved the Hebrews. England assaulted large portions of Africa and Asia, and also subjugated America for a long time. And America? Iraq and Korea. Enough said there. If every single countries entire culture is biased off of a select few horrible individuals and mistakes, then let me tell you that there is NO good in the world anymore, my friend. Its just absolute ignorance for these blanketed statements to be continued.

Well I guess it's good I didn't make a blanket statement about your country then.

Also, you wanna talk about your country getting bagged on a lot? I'm Canadian. We're the CHAMPIONS of being ripped on.

Oh. Go play your hockey, you little Canadian.....

Kidding! Kidding! There is nothing wrong with Canada at all. You guys have wolves. That makes you awesome.

 

[Ionami]

Oh, your right about me being angry. I'm downright pissed off with how people have been treating my country and my people. America is a great country with a rich culture and generally good people. We have our share of absolute morons, but when people cite those morons as being the entirety of us, I tend to get a little upset. We've been made out to be the cesspool of the world as of late, and its absolutely inane and insulting to be singled out in this way.

Every single country has their skeletons in the closet. Japan invaded China and raped their women while committing wholesale slaughter. The Hebrews came in from out in the desert and decided to lay claim to an entire land, telling everyone else to GTFO. Likewise, the Eygptions enslaved the Hebrews. England assaulted large portions of Africa and Asia, and also subjugated America for a long time. And America? Iraq and Korea. Enough said there. If every single countries entire culture is biased off of a select few horrible individuals and mistakes, then let me tell you that there is NO good in the world anymore, my friend. Its just absolute ignorance for these blanketed statements to be continued.

Well I guess it's good I didn't make a blanket statement about your country then.

Also, you wanna talk about your country getting bagged on a lot? I'm Canadian. We're the CHAMPIONS of being ripped on.

Oh. Go play your hockey, you little Canadian.....

Kidding! Kidding! There is nothing wrong with Canada at all. You guys have wolves. That makes you awesome.

Funny you say that, I HATE hockey...

 

[Superbeast]

Take into account that the U.S. is also a primary player in international peace-keeping and humanitarian efforts and the 49% that you quote makes more sense.

Ah, another victim of government propaganda.

http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/peacekpg/data/pktp08.htm

That chart puts the US at...43rd in the world in terms of military personel for 2008 (France at 11th)...31st in 2005...but a far more respectable 14th in 2000.

Obviously with the war you aren't going to have as many troops to send to peacekeeping operations, but even so in 2000 that was ~900 troops, compared to Nigeria's average of ~3000


Right now I can't find summaries for all countries ever (trying to find some), nor for the amount of financial aid offered, but in terms of peacekeeping the US is now (and has been rapidly falling for the last 9 years) way, way, way down the list (note: not that the UK is much better in the current state of affairs). So much so you don't even make it into the Top 10 over a 3-year-period from 2005-2007: http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/peacekpg/data/top10contributors.htm

You are also top in the world for owing most money to the UN in regards to peacekeeping operations: http://www.globalpolicy.org/finance/tables/pko/due2008.htm Now, this link is regarding the 15 largest financial contributors, so perhaps the USA is top in that as well (but still, over $1000,000,000 in debt to the UN as of April 2008 (though a more respectable $800,000,000 by December 2008 - but then look how all the other contributing member states compare in terms of debt, and suddenly things don't look so great). Just found on Wikipedia that the US contributes 22% of all the money the UN has ($4.19 billion), that's pretty high (but remember, $800,000,000 debt still and things suddenly don't seem so rosy), and I wish I had some numbers in terms of equipment to try this hypothesis out futher.


Now, I'm not saying that the USA doesn't give more to charities (I know it is high up on the leaderboard there, in terms of total amount donated but lags a little on a per-capita basis, but I cannot find the article with this information in), or that it doesn't provide aid in other ways such as directly funding/providing equipment for other nations' armies, but in terms of UN peacekeeping operations (mostly those that involve troops, though it appears there is a large amount of debt owed to the UN even if you are the top donator), which you yourself highlighted, you ain't doing so hot these days at 43rd in the world (especially considering the status of many of the countries ahead of you).

Now please, don't take this as an attack, it's just I am sick of American Media always saying how it leads the way in peacekeeping throughout the world, and despite being merely a British Citizen, this winds me up because it refuses to acknowledge the amount of work Pakistan and many African countries do towards world peace. Then again, with the pro-isolationist America (at least in the media mindset) it is to be expected, it just irks me to refuse to accept that some countries that the media portrays as being backwards (Ghana) or dangerous (Pakistan) aren't actually portrayed correctly to the American people., nor is it acknowledging the sacrifices made by those countries (similar levels of, if not more, sacrifices that the Media loves to play up regarding US service personnel in Iraq)

 

[sorry user name taken.]

I'm still mad about the one Marine who threw a puppy off a cliff.

I'm still mad about what happened in Abu Graib and Guantanamo Bay. Much worse than killing one puppy in my opinion.

how...?

where?...

did they get a puppy?!

 

[lacktheknack]

I'm still mad about the one Marine who threw a puppy off a cliff.

This isn't even close to comparable with killing a dog. It's not like he pulled the pin!

Honestly, everyone would have thought this was funny if it wasn't Iraq.