Is the death penalty ever justified?

[oppp7]

as for the "we become as bad as them" argument, there's a dif between innocent ppl n murderers/rapists...

 

[DoomyMcDoom]

I'm for death penalty for rapists and child molesters... sometimes a percieved murder is however more than that... and I think we should have more competent psychologists and other such professionals involved in the courts and justice system in general...

What? I don't understand if you're saying murder is better or worse.

also i am for televised gladiator fights... where you pit a group of death row convicts against eachother in a bloody fight to the death... the winner gets another last meal of hist/her choice and gets to fight in round 2... if someone fights and lives through 3 successive rounds they are recruited into the armed forces in a special battallion formed out of criminals to act as the front liners of the front liners... if they survive 5 years there they are considered rehabilitated and put into a communal living society formed to be both a constructive and supportive environment for a reformed criminal... there they will work and live in an organized and peaceful community till they die...

I must assume you're pisstaking...

as to better or worse... say you killed someone who raped your sister and got the death penalty for murder... is that fair?

whereas you assign said penalty to someone who violated a child, or took advantage of someone by force... that is fair, they have the right to experience the hopelessness and stillness in sorrow one approaching death feels. do you not agree?


also the rest is just a bit of a half formed idea of a possible situation leading to extra finding to the whole rehabilitation process... televised gladiator fights would bring something of the sort in... when it comes to the whole rewarding someone with service in a military unit almost guaranteeing them death in yet another fight, acting as a shield to someone who is not a criminal but a voluntary servant of their respective country... i see it as a kind of poetic justice. if they happen to live for 5 years in said service they will have seen enough shit to traumatize them into a life where they will either end their own life, be in a constant need to kill again(depending on specific psychological makeup), or live a life where they are haunted in their sleep... all of which are just as satisfying an end...


yeah... and I haven't slept for about 20 or so hours... so i am tired and tend to ramble.

 

[Gebi10000]

I've expressed my views on the death penalty before. basicly i'm against it, because evryone earns a scond chance

 

[oppp7]

really, there isnt a "right answer" or "wrong answer," it's just how u feel. ppl have their opinions, but it's like asking if Halo is better than Half-Life 2, no one is right.

 

[Antlers]

as to better or worse... say you killed someone who raped your sister and got the death penalty for murder... is that fair?

whereas you assign said penalty to someone who violated a child, or took advantage of someone by force... that is fair, they have the right to experience the hopelessness and stillness in sorrow one approaching death feels. do you not agree?

Erm... I don't think the death penalty is EVER fair so I don't really get what you're asking me. But I'm of the opinion that murder is worse than kiddie fiddling. I'd rather be fiddled with than murdered.

also the rest is just a bit of a half formed idea of a possible situation leading to extra finding to the whole rehabilitation process... televised gladiator fights would bring something of the sort in... when it comes to the whole rewarding someone with service in a military unit almost guaranteeing them death in yet another fight, acting as a shield to someone who is not a criminal but a voluntary servant of their respective country... i see it as a kind of poetic justice. if they happen to live for 5 years in said service they will have seen enough shit to traumatize them into a life where they will either end their own life, be in a constant need to kill again(depending on specific psychological makeup), or live a life where they are haunted in their sleep... all of which are just as satisfying an end...

Right... I think that's sick and will have absolutely no benefit to society/the criminals/anybody. Also I'd seriously judge anyone who'd watch that.

 

[Elivercury]

And what if they did? We're taking them regardless.

Although as horrible as it sounds, it would actually solve pretty much all the problems. NHS needs more funding and more organs. Killing off the prisoners would reduce the funding required there and supply said organs. Besides, if we are going to kill them then why bother wasting the organs? Given we've killed the person in a controlled manner, pretty much every single organ should be usable (assuming it's a match). Thus the guy who killed a few people could end up saving as many as perhaps half a dozen lives.

Solve all the problems?! Are you kidding me?!

You're KILLING OFF the prisoners to solve all the problems.

Hey I know, let's get the concentration camps back. They'd get everything under control again.

Christ.

Torturing and genocide of people who've committed no wrongs other than being of a certain race is hardly the same as killing scum who've killed, raped and violated other humans. Besides, you never answered my argument of "well what else are you going to do with the organs"?

 

[Meemaimoh]

I think it's irrelevant whether it's "justified". What we need to think about is whether it's the best thing to do for society, and to me that's a great big NO.

Imagine what we could learn from studying psychopaths if we didn't just go killing them off. I mean, what if we could screen this stuff from birth? Even cure it? Why do we waste this? For some lofty ideals of justice? For the feelings of a couple of victims-by-proxy? Sounds cold, I know, but it makes sense.

 

[hippykiller]

now the question is "is the death penalty ever justified?" well yes, yes it is. would you rather kill a killer in prison by death penalty. or would you make him serve a life sentence where he'll just keep on killing his fellow inmates.

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

In principle I'm against the death penalty, because I feel that there are many arguments against its use. (Wrongful conviction, killing is very rarely justified, etc) however, I see huge problems in the application of this use.

I think the American use of the death penalty stems from a fundamental difference of philosophy to the European and British view. As far as the European community is concerned, it is better to let ten criminals go free than let one innocent person be wrongfully imprisoned or killed. America is much bigger, and also, its crimes are of a much bigger scale. (I WILL NOT get into the debate about the Second Amendment, but if people have access to guns, more people are going to abuse that right, thus, more gun crime.) If the American government adopted the European philosophy, there woud be chaos, so for the greater good, it is acceptable to let one innocent die for every ten criminals you know you got right.

So while my principles recoil from killing on any level, for any reason beyond self defence, I am reaistic enough to know that in application, there must be some sacriices made to principles, for the sake of maintaining the law.

By the way, I'm British.

 

[MelziGurl]

I have nothing against the death penalty, so long as the person accused is proven 100% guilty of whichever crime he/she is accused of. I'd rather not see people innocent of said crime having their lives ended for absolutely no justifiable reason.

 

[Antlers]

And what if they did? We're taking them regardless.

Although as horrible as it sounds, it would actually solve pretty much all the problems. NHS needs more funding and more organs. Killing off the prisoners would reduce the funding required there and supply said organs. Besides, if we are going to kill them then why bother wasting the organs? Given we've killed the person in a controlled manner, pretty much every single organ should be usable (assuming it's a match). Thus the guy who killed a few people could end up saving as many as perhaps half a dozen lives.

Solve all the problems?! Are you kidding me?!

You're KILLING OFF the prisoners to solve all the problems.

Hey I know, let's get the concentration camps back. They'd get everything under control again.

Christ.

Torturing and genocide of people who've committed no wrongs other than being of a certain race is hardly the same as killing scum who've killed, raped and violated other humans. Besides, you never answered my argument of "well what else are you going to do with the organs"?

Oh my apologies. Um... I don't get your question. My idea was that you give prisoners the option to donate their organs. So... You'd use them, obviously. You don't have to die to donate an organ.

Torturing people is just never justified in my opinion (I hate writing that. It's obviously MY OPINION. I didn't get it off a wiki page of opinions). And your attitude rings of complete lack of any sort of empathy.

 

[Antlers]

I have nothing against the death penalty, so long as the person accused is proven 100% guilty of whichever crime he/she is accused of. I'd rather not see people innocent of said crime having their lives ended for absolutely no justifiable reason.

Well that makes you anti-death penalty. Because you can never be 100% sure.

 

[oppp7]

I highly support the death penalty as long as the courts are 100% sure they are guilty.
However I want a real death penalty, as in the minute they are sentenced they get taken out back into a nice concrete square with a drain in the centre and just shot in the back of the head.
Don't fuck around and waste tax payers money with this scum, keeping them locked up for years. Just shoot them and be done with it.
Also life sentence should be fixed, they just lay there doing nothing but costing money. At least sell them into slavery. Make them fucking useful.

courts r never 100% sure.

yes, y not make it effient instead of accurate? i used to think dp should b faster, but then i found out about the large # of innocent ppl in jail.

n slavery? i think a large portion of ppl would have issues with that...

 

[Antlers]

I wasn't going to mention it but oppp7... Do you see ANYONE else using shorthand?

 

[DoomyMcDoom]

as to better or worse... say you killed someone who raped your sister and got the death penalty for murder... is that fair?

whereas you assign said penalty to someone who violated a child, or took advantage of someone by force... that is fair, they have the right to experience the hopelessness and stillness in sorrow one approaching death feels. do you not agree?

Erm... I don't think the death penalty is EVER fair so I don't really get what you're asking me. But I'm of the opinion that murder is worse than kiddie fiddling. I'd rather be fiddled with than murdered.

also the rest is just a bit of a half formed idea of a possible situation leading to extra finding to the whole rehabilitation process... televised gladiator fights would bring something of the sort in... when it comes to the whole rewarding someone with service in a military unit almost guaranteeing them death in yet another fight, acting as a shield to someone who is not a criminal but a voluntary servant of their respective country... i see it as a kind of poetic justice. if they happen to live for 5 years in said service they will have seen enough shit to traumatize them into a life where they will either end their own life, be in a constant need to kill again(depending on specific psychological makeup), or live a life where they are haunted in their sleep... all of which are just as satisfying an end...

Right... I think that's sick and will have absolutely no benefit to society/the criminals/anybody. Also I'd seriously judge anyone who'd watch that.

do you seriously judge people who watch UFC? or any other simulated "short of" blood sports? after all humans have always gotten their kicks killing eachother or watching it happen... hell look at the gaming community... I think anyone who looks at history and at humanity in general will agree with me. it would be popular, doesn't matter how many idealists there are, there are always twice as many brutes. and why not use them t distract said brutes into donating money into helping to propperly rehabilitate people who have done less than death penalty deserving crimes... like thieves for instance. people who have not completely destroyed someone's physical or emotional state, eh?

I see it as drawing the line, as an ironic way of dealing with things, as it is both progressive and regressive, it in a sense cancels itself out.

after all as long as there are people someone will kill someone else for some reason, call it the human condition, or whatever you want, that's just how it is.

 

[Elivercury]

And what if they did? We're taking them regardless.

Although as horrible as it sounds, it would actually solve pretty much all the problems. NHS needs more funding and more organs. Killing off the prisoners would reduce the funding required there and supply said organs. Besides, if we are going to kill them then why bother wasting the organs? Given we've killed the person in a controlled manner, pretty much every single organ should be usable (assuming it's a match). Thus the guy who killed a few people could end up saving as many as perhaps half a dozen lives.

Solve all the problems?! Are you kidding me?!

You're KILLING OFF the prisoners to solve all the problems.

Hey I know, let's get the concentration camps back. They'd get everything under control again.

Christ.

Torturing and genocide of people who've committed no wrongs other than being of a certain race is hardly the same as killing scum who've killed, raped and violated other humans. Besides, you never answered my argument of "well what else are you going to do with the organs"?

Oh my apologies. Um... I don't get your question. My idea was that you give prisoners the option to donate their organs. So... You'd use them, obviously. You don't have to die to donate an organ.

Torturing people is just never justified in my opinion (I hate writing that. It's obviously MY OPINION. I didn't get it off a wiki page of opinions). And your attitude rings of complete lack of any sort of empathy.

What sort of empathy are you expecting me to have exactly? "You just killed your 20th 5 year old, here have a cigar, a ferrari and a mansion in the bahama's!"? Yeah they clearly deserve lots of compassion and love.

I'm of the opinion we should bring the death penalty back, once they are dead their organs are there for the taking, and no i wasn't planning on given them an option about whether they get to donate or not. Besides, technically me idea doesn't fit under the "eye for an eye" category which most people seem to have a problem with. I just think those people are scum and should be put to use. It's a good system that will help good people survive and remove the bad people from society.

 

[Rolling Thunder]

And what if they did? We're taking them regardless.

Although as horrible as it sounds, it would actually solve pretty much all the problems. NHS needs more funding and more organs. Killing off the prisoners would reduce the funding required there and supply said organs. Besides, if we are going to kill them then why bother wasting the organs? Given we've killed the person in a controlled manner, pretty much every single organ should be usable (assuming it's a match). Thus the guy who killed a few people could end up saving as many as perhaps half a dozen lives.

Solve all the problems?! Are you kidding me?!

You're KILLING OFF the prisoners to solve all the problems.

Hey I know, let's get the concentration camps back. They'd get everything under control again.

Christ.

Oh, Godwin's Law, how I love thee. I was waiting for this.


Look, you seem to have some sort of notion that justice is supposed to be this impartial light hanging in the sky dealing out measured, 'socially useful' punishments. Well, I must disagree. Justice should not be about social usefulness. It should be about redemption, retribution, and, ultimately, vengeance. It is from these ideals that justice stems, ideals that are inbuilt to the human psyche, not the pity-ethics* of a few. I hold, sir, that the only persons who are truly capable of judging the impact of the criminals act are the victim's family, and the victim in rape cases. It is they who should be permitted to deciede the criminal's ultimate fate, be there to see justice done, and, should they wish, be the ones to pull the trigger.



*Yes, I just quoted Hitler. Oh dear.