Is Zelda going downhill?
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I appreciate the clarification on the split there. However, i actually kind of feel like that reinforces my position a little bit. I mean simply the existence of splitting timelines and two alternate realities I would say pretty accurately shows that there was never going to BE a measure of continuity in these games, and that they were kind of daisy-chained together after they had been released to seem like they were made to compliment each other.Avatar Roku said:
Again, I'm a fan of the series and will most probably enjoy the next one. But I guess after 20 years or so I'm a bit exhausted of games that have been (to put it charitably), re-imaginations and variations on a SINGLE game model. It can (with a few notable exceptions) be easily drawn to the original Zelda series over and over and over again with a new style, such as next-gen graphics or 3D rendering. The presentation changes, but the events and style never do.
Plus, to quote a famous and more wise man than I, when it comes to the next Zelda game "....I can't wait to se if we get the boomerang or the grappling hook first this time."
Out of curiosity, why do you hate the Cell Shaded games? You've explained Spirit Tracks well enough, but why Wind Waker and Phantom Hourglass?Kahrooch said:
Sorry man, I mistook your original post to mean that you hadn't heard the theory. Yeah, I see what you're saying now. I'm still holding out hope for that one game eventually that really ties it all together, but I'm not holding my breath.Silencer_007 said:
First off Wind Waker destroyed the series for me. DESTROYED. Does anyonne remember that video that was going around on the net back when the GameCube was new and shiny? That one where Link was fighting Ganondorf? That's what I thought Wind Waker was going to be.
Majora's Mask is the high point for the series. The game had a complex atmosphere beyond that of most Nintendo titles. It was dark and brooding, and pretty to look at. It was such a perfect logical next step up from OOT. After that there was a deep dip where Wind Waker assed around, and then a dying spike for the OOT remake that was Twilight Princess. I don't follow the hand held games.
Majora's Mask is the high point for the series. The game had a complex atmosphere beyond that of most Nintendo titles. It was dark and brooding, and pretty to look at. It was such a perfect logical next step up from OOT. After that there was a deep dip where Wind Waker assed around, and then a dying spike for the OOT remake that was Twilight Princess. I don't follow the hand held games.
I thought twilight princess was really good, took me about 50 hours to complete and none of them 50 hours felt slow or lacking, the only thing i would change is the way you sing the songs as the wolf was a bit fiddly, but the wolf sections themselves were great and added variety, they were a bit like Okami but didnt rip it off
I don't think Zelda's going downhill. I've always enjoyed each and every title that has come out, and I've been playing Zelda since the beginning. Some games might not be as epic, but that doesn't mean they're not good games.
The perceived downward slant of Zelda games is caused by two things: nostalgia and expectations. First, We grew up with Zelda games. They helped us get through our days and we had lots of fun. As a result, we tend to remember the fun to the exclusion of all else and the games become more fun than when we actually played them. This makes the modern games, which don't have the same nostalgia boost, seem worse by comparison. In the same way, the older games often did something revolutionary to the game play. A Link to the Past is where the better puzzle solving began to appear, Ocarina of Time was the first one to be in 3d, and brought a whole lot to the series. In other words, these games were essentially miles ahead of their predacessors. This gives us a slightly irrational desire for just as much improvement from our modern ones as from the older. As there is only so much room for improvement, the modern games inevitably fail to meet these expectations; even though they improve on gameplay, it doesn't feel good enough.
Ignoring these two things (and it can be tough), the games have consistently gotten better, albeit on diverging tendencies. The Console Zelda's are becoming more and more story oriented. The original games gave us a brief idea of what was going on, and sent us on our way; ALttP reminded us of what we were doing now and then; Ocarina had the occasional plot point that tied in with the rest of the story; Majora's mask introduced characters that started to have personality. A big jump occurred in WW, when they gave Link a brand new personality, something neverbefore seen.in Twilight Princess, it was further fleshed out, giving Link relationships with other people, and made the storyline more flowing overall. The Portable Zelda's have been getting consistently better. They, unlike the Console Zelda's, are more than just finding a switch. That said, I'm getting irked at how the portable games are steadily removing the ability to actually explore the overworld.
Ignoring these two things (and it can be tough), the games have consistently gotten better, albeit on diverging tendencies. The Console Zelda's are becoming more and more story oriented. The original games gave us a brief idea of what was going on, and sent us on our way; ALttP reminded us of what we were doing now and then; Ocarina had the occasional plot point that tied in with the rest of the story; Majora's mask introduced characters that started to have personality. A big jump occurred in WW, when they gave Link a brand new personality, something neverbefore seen.in Twilight Princess, it was further fleshed out, giving Link relationships with other people, and made the storyline more flowing overall. The Portable Zelda's have been getting consistently better. They, unlike the Console Zelda's, are more than just finding a switch. That said, I'm getting irked at how the portable games are steadily removing the ability to actually explore the overworld.
How could it be going downhill when the only problems you can find with the games are "too much like ocarina of time or not as good as ocarina of time" I hate to break it to you but if you go back and play Ocarina of time you'll see that it's an amazing game but the controls and camera are nowhere near as good as you remember them. Nostalgia is a powerful thing and not many things from your childhood are as good as you remember, for example, I tried to play super Mario sunshine the other day and realized how unresponsive the controls were.
To tell the truth the cell shaded graphics did put me off also I never got past the first 3 hours of wind waker because it was so slow and God awful. I saw my cousin play through it and figured i wasn't missing much. I like some of the soundtrack though. Also the DS, to me, is just as gimmicky and has as few good games as the Wii. I don't fancy walking around playing games the I have to huff and puff at the screen wildly...also most graphics on the DS suuuuuuck they are so pixelated. The gameboy advance and the SNES look better than the DS.Avatar Roku said:
Give me Link to the Past or OOT anyday...but i think zelda is one of the last series we should be talking about going downhill really i think its fine the way it seems to be going. but we'll see when the next game comes out.
I think the Zelda games are fine I just wished they were more difficulty. The series has been getting progressively easy. Fix that and the Zelda games perfect.
I think the people who say the series has gone downhill are just too attached to one game and shrug off the others because the aren't that one game.
The Legend of Zelda series still features well-designed maps, responsive controls and great stories in every game. Compare Zelda games next to Sonic games, and then say if it has gone downhill
The Legend of Zelda series still features well-designed maps, responsive controls and great stories in every game. Compare Zelda games next to Sonic games, and then say if it has gone downhill
How can they go "downhill?" They've never done anything new or innovative in ANY of the titles that would make them rise from that plateau they hit back in the N64 days. It's the same damned game with better graphics now. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.
Majora's Mask is dark and deep, and it's my favorite, but Wind Waker is incredible in its own right. Generally people who have a low opinion of Wind Waker haven't played it, so I'll just go ahead and tell you that Wind Waker isn't all cuddles and bunny rabbits. There's destruction and sacrifice, death and one of my all-time favorite game endings.captainaweshum said:
I've said this before somewhat recently, but I'm often thankful that I escaped this crippling nostalgia that older gamers have which prevents them from enjoying anything new or appreciating change and progression.
I like them all, but my favourite is Twilight Princess. OoT was great for it's time, but I played the version that was bundled with Wind Waker, so nostalgia isn't that much of a factor to me.
Twilight Princess has a similar atmosphere to Ocarina, but has improves in mechanics and graphics.
EDIY: the only real complaint I have about TP is that it's too easy. As was Metroid Prime 3 and especially Super Mario Galaxy.
Twilight Princess has a similar atmosphere to Ocarina, but has improves in mechanics and graphics.
EDIY: the only real complaint I have about TP is that it's too easy. As was Metroid Prime 3 and especially Super Mario Galaxy.
You can't really go downhill on a Zelda game unless the games themselves took a huge dip in quality, like obviously poor writing and gameplay. For the most part, anyone thinking it's gone downhill is just being bias or their personal preferences aren't being met.
Personally I haven't felt like they've been going downhill, but I do take issue with the hand held ones. Just because when I play portable games I'm probably not playing for long and it's harder to keep tabs on what I'm doing in the game. The console games I sit down and play for an hour or two so they're easier to get sucked in to and enjoy. Only a few portable games have managed to capture my attention in that way and that was when I was way younger, didn't drive, had no responsibilities, and had to go stop Felix, Saturos, and Menardi from lighting the elemental lighthouses.
Personally I haven't felt like they've been going downhill, but I do take issue with the hand held ones. Just because when I play portable games I'm probably not playing for long and it's harder to keep tabs on what I'm doing in the game. The console games I sit down and play for an hour or two so they're easier to get sucked in to and enjoy. Only a few portable games have managed to capture my attention in that way and that was when I was way younger, didn't drive, had no responsibilities, and had to go stop Felix, Saturos, and Menardi from lighting the elemental lighthouses.
ive played wind waker and thought it was ok, i played the second and thought it was the worst zelda ive ever played, and minish cap that was pretty good, but this spirit tracks...no just no.Avatar Roku said: