Jimquisition: Mass Effect 3: A Gay Erotic Love Story

[Loethlin]

Okay, general question. What would be the feeling if one of the romance options was married? And I mean happily married with a still living spouse and child/children that they were eagerly awaiting to return home to until Shepard came along and decided to knowingly screw that up.

Well, MY Shepard isn't a homewrecker!
But to each their own. I wouldn't deny anyone's right to do this. You know, if the OTHER set of pixels wants to cheat on their partner with Shepard. I don't feel forced to do anything I don't want to.
Not my job to question YOUR moral choices.
I wouldn't do it. You might.

 

[goliath6711]

Okay, general question. What would be the feeling if one of the romance options was married? And I mean happily married with a still living spouse and child/children that they were eagerly awaiting to return home to until Shepard came along and decided to knowingly screw that up.

Well, MY Shepard isn't a homewrecker!
But to each their own. I wouldn't deny anyone's right to do this. You know, if the OTHER set of pixels wants to cheat on their partner with Shepard. I don't feel forced to do anything I don't want to.
Not my job to question YOUR moral choices.
I wouldn't do it. You might.

I'm not saying I would. I was just generally asking "What would you do?"

 

[secretsantaone]

Is it really worth it if it's cheapened? Surely it would be better to finish off this franchise and start a new one with a homosexual character, rather than shoe-horning it in so late. To me it just seems patronising, like 'here's your token gay relationship, now leave us alone.'.

On the issue of resources spent, let's have a look different at what different elements go into a videogame.


Writing - Someone has to write the romance, which characters, how it progresses, how it ends up etc.

Dialogue writing - After that, the dialogue between the characters needs to be written including multiple speech trees and paths for different conversation choices

Voice acting - Then they need to get the voice actors in to record the lines and the sound editors to get it into a fit state

Animation - Someone needs to animate the romance scenes, including a presumably unique sex scene which uses no stock animations

Coding - After that, someone needs to actually put all the different elements into the game and not have it clash with everything else

Quality control - The romance needs to be played through multiple times under different conditions to make sure there are no bugs or errors

So probably quite a bit of time I'd imagine.

This argument is so board it's pointless to even list this. I could take everything you just said and use for any argument from "Here's why they shouldn't allow any romance options" to "Here's why they shouldn't allow moral choices".

In order to have this in, it had to be planned. Back when the game was first starting, and since its elements were planned in the first one it's been in the planning since at least 2006. Nothing about Shepard beyond the actual romance dialogue trees ever seemed to say out loud what his sexual preference was, because it was always left up to the player's choice. Saying that they cheapened it and made it token seems belittling to said choice.

Except moral choices have been a hallmark of the series and it's something all players will experience, while the heterosexual relationships already exist.

Does it matter if they originally wanted to put it in? They didn't and the series has moved on, meaning that a lot of the planned writing from the first game won't make sense. Why bring in something that only a minority of people will see this late?

 

[cyrad]

I don't understand the whole point of this. Does Mass Effect 3 force your avatar to have a homosexual relationship?

To me, I just wasted 8 minutes of my day listening to disturbing homosexual porn.

 

[yeah_so_no]

That being said I can understand people not being keen on there being man on man lovin' in ME3. I just can't imagine anyone sitting around playing the first two and thinking to themselves "Ya know this is a pretty good game but dammit all if it wouldn't just be about perfect if I could just bugger the Hell out of Garrus".

You clearly have spent no time on the (woman-centric) gaming comms on LJ, I see.

Trust me, a LOT more people than you think sit around thinking just those things. I actually had a little chuckle when I read that line, and went, "Aww, how cute. This guy has NO idea." XD

 

[Loethlin]

I'm not saying I would. I was just generally asking "What would you do?"

I wouldn't let my Shep get involved with a cheater. This is me answering your question.
But, I wouldn't be trying to force this point of view on others. I'm not saying you are, please, don't take it like this. I'm trying to say, I'm only in the position to decide for myself and my Shepard. Definitely not in the position of telling people on the internet how to feel about this sort of thing, make a big drama and throw hissyfits, like some people are doing right now.

You clearly have spent no time on the (woman-centric) gaming comms on LJ, I see.

Don't be like that! It's not "woman-centric" but "fanfiction-centric".
There are guys who write fanfiction. Not too many of them, but they do exist. Surprisingly, the percentage in ME fandom is much bigger than the others, such as Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings.
Most of them write femslash, too. What. A. Shocker. /sarcasm.

 

[yeah_so_no]

Actually, it isn't Bioware's fault. They tried to have homosexual options in ME1 (the code is still in there, half done) but the guy who did the motion capture for Male Shep (some sort of Underwear model, I believe?) threw a hissy fit about anything "gay" being associated with him and threatened to not let them use his face for Shepard if they made it possible for Male Shep to be gay.

Unable to have gay Male Shep, Bioware removed Ashley from Femshep's options to make things fair.

They tried again in ME2 (again, the options are in the code, but unfinished) but hit the same wall from Mr. Underpants model.

However, since ME3 is the last game with Shepard in it, they no longer have to give a fuck about pissing Mr. Underpants off. Hence the gay options in ME3.

Is that what happened? Oh BOO~. I had been wondering why they completely avoided a gay male option in ME when it was hoo-yay all over the place in DA (...even though I'm still kinda mad I can't romance Alistair with my male elf mage. Alistair likes him so much it's almost off the scale, and yet, lol).

I'm glad they're adding the options they originally were going to with this last game.

OT, I was cracking up watching this. Good show, Jim, good show.

 

[yeah_so_no]

Don't be like that! It's not "woman-centric" but "fanfiction-centric".
There are guys who write fanfiction. Not too many of them, but they do exist. Surprisingly, the percentage in ME fandom is much bigger than the others, such as Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings.
Most of them write femslash, too. What. A. Shocker. /sarcasm.

Ahaha, I'm not actually talking about the fanfic comms; I'm talking about the plain-ol' gaming comms (they exist!) Slash writers aren't the only woman who like imagining guys romancing other guys.

And color me shocked femslash gets a pass that regular slash doesn't.

 

[SaunaKalja]

Oh no, why am I blushing?

 

[Loethlin]

Ahaha, I'm not actually talking about the fanfic comms; I'm talking about the plain-ol' gaming comms (they exist!) Slash writers aren't the only woman who like imagining guys romancing other guys.

And color me shocked femslash gets a pass that regular slash doesn't.

Oh. Right. Well, I apologise for assuming you meant fic comms. Thanks for reminding me, then, why I'm not visiting girly gaming comms despite being a woman myself.

Femslash gets a pass because guys think two girls together are hot, without threatening their sexuality. Not the case with slash. Or on this case, gay!Shep.
It gets a pass from women because they're more open-minded about the idea. Do not confuse this with me saying "women are bi from the get-go". They aren't and this is not what I'm saying.

 

[idodo35]

you are a sick sick man jim... sick sick man...

 

[Simonoly]

ActuaLOL. Very good video. I've been romancing Liara for a long time now so I feel like I should see that through in ME3. However, when I start again from Mass Effect 1, my golly is Garrus going to get it. Hard and fast in that weird face of his.

 

[BanZeus]

Not to single anyone out but if you decide to watch a video with the words "gay" and "erotic" in the title, you don't get to complain when the content is gay and erotic.

 

[yeah_so_no]

Ahaha, I'm not actually talking about the fanfic comms; I'm talking about the plain-ol' gaming comms (they exist!) Slash writers aren't the only woman who like imagining guys romancing other guys.

And color me shocked femslash gets a pass that regular slash doesn't.

Oh. Right. Well, I apologise for assuming you meant fic comms. Thanks for reminding me, then, why I'm not visiting girly gaming comms despite being a woman myself.

Femslash gets a pass because guys think two girls together are hot, without threatening their sexuality. Not the case with slash. Or on this case, gay!Shep.
It gets a pass from women because they're more open-minded about the idea. Do not confuse this with me saying "women are bi from the get-go". They aren't and this is not what I'm saying.

Oh lord, please don't pull the "I'm not like THOSE stupid girly gamers UGH, I'M ONE OF THE BOYSSS!!" card, please. Just...no. There is no call to bash other women players, especially not for being ~girly or whatev. You don't get points for that, and can we just not? There is no ONE TRUE WAY to "acceptably" be a woman who games, nor is there anything wrong with quote-unquote girliness (and not even to touch the implications of internalized misogyny that comes as baggage with the belittling of something as being feminine). Just, no. No.

And no, I did not confuse it with you saying "women are bi;" I was unshocked because for a lot a men, lesbians are HAWT but gay men are icky, thus, femslsh is OK and regular slash is not. We were kind of on the same page, there. :/

 

[yeah_so_no]

No they aren't, otherwise there wouldn't be rules about putting such things in games. It isn't illegal to show homosexuality.

You are aware rules and laws are constantly changing and altering to the current norm and that just because RIGHT NOW there is a rule about it =/= it is necessarily "right"?

there were once laws saying people could be enslaved
there were once rules saying women weren't people
etc. etc.
and they all changed

Not that I want that stuff in game myself, I am just pointing that out.

...You picked a bad example with that, because guess what? Pederasty and child abuse USED to be legal. It used to be legal for a grown man to marry a ten-year-old girl and consummate their marriage. Then, we realized, oh wow, that's kinda NOT OK, and laws against it came into being.

There is a very big difference between depictions of a consensual sexual relationship and rape. And make no mistake, you are calling for games to depict child RAPE, because children are unable to consent, which makes any depiction of a sexual "relationship" involving a child a depiction of RAPE.

There are games for that. Go import and play one of those if you want a rape option so badly.

 

[Loethlin]

Oh lord, please don't pull the "I'm not like THOSE stupid girly gamers UGH, I'M ONE OF THE BOYSSS!!" card, please. Just...no. There is no call to bash other women players, especially not for being ~girly or whatev. You don't get points for that, and can we just not? There is no ONE TRUE WAY to "acceptably" be a woman who games, nor is there anything wrong with quote-unquote girliness (and not even to touch the implications of internalized misogyny that comes as baggage with the belittling of something as being feminine). Just, no. No.

What? Ok, this is going really badly, I didn't mean it like that. I'm not criticising anybody. I'm not claiming to be a "tomboy", either. You might've noticed I haven't said a single harsh word in the "girly girl" gamer's direction. All I said it that it's not my style and I don't feel comfortable in such communities therefore I do not visit.

And no, I did not confuse it with you saying "women are bi;" I was unshocked because for a lot a men, lesbians are HAWT but gay men are icky, thus, femslsh is OK and regular slash is not. We were kind of on the same page, there. :/

Glad we agree on this. This bi women thing was an attempt to clarify. See what happened when I didn't clarify? You thought I'm being offensive when I wasn't trying to be.

 

[Frankster]

Watched first 2 mins of vid, saw it wasn't gonna be my thing (i got my own fantasies, don't need to hear that of others tyvm) but figured I could guess the general point Jim was trying to make with the vid based on the recent gay mass effect threads.

Based on the comments, seems I was mostly right.

 

[Orekoya]

Is it really worth it if it's cheapened? Surely it would be better to finish off this franchise and start a new one with a homosexual character, rather than shoe-horning it in so late. To me it just seems patronising, like 'here's your token gay relationship, now leave us alone.'.

On the issue of resources spent, let's have a look different at what different elements go into a videogame.


Writing - Someone has to write the romance, which characters, how it progresses, how it ends up etc.

Dialogue writing - After that, the dialogue between the characters needs to be written including multiple speech trees and paths for different conversation choices

Voice acting - Then they need to get the voice actors in to record the lines and the sound editors to get it into a fit state

Animation - Someone needs to animate the romance scenes, including a presumably unique sex scene which uses no stock animations

Coding - After that, someone needs to actually put all the different elements into the game and not have it clash with everything else

Quality control - The romance needs to be played through multiple times under different conditions to make sure there are no bugs or errors

So probably quite a bit of time I'd imagine.

This argument is so board it's pointless to even list this. I could take everything you just said and use for any argument from "Here's why they shouldn't allow any romance options" to "Here's why they shouldn't allow moral choices".

In order to have this in, it had to be planned. Back when the game was first starting, and since its elements were planned in the first one it's been in the planning since at least 2006. Nothing about Shepard beyond the actual romance dialogue trees ever seemed to say out loud what his sexual preference was, because it was always left up to the player's choice. Saying that they cheapened it and made it token seems belittling to said choice.

Except moral choices have been a hallmark of the series and it's something all players will experience, while the heterosexual relationships already exist.

Does it matter if they originally wanted to put it in? They didn't and the series has moved on, meaning that a lot of the planned writing from the first game won't make sense. Why bring in something that only a minority of people will see this late?

Because they wanted to? Yes it matters that they originally wanted to put it in, they're the ones making it. And your argument seems to be the equivalent of saying if the relationship isn't firmly established and fulfilled by the first 2/3s of a novel series then it's shallow, cheap, and shoe-horned in. Have you ever done a male Shepard that didn't choose anyone in the first two games? Your argument of "heterosexual relationships" already exist vanishes in an instant because, as I stated, Shepard's sexual preference is not established at all outside the romance options. For anyone who's made such a Shepard (or planning to make such a Shep for the third) the romance choice they make in the third game, straight or gay, will be all the sweeter for their wait.

 

[Reynaert]

Thank you for this video, mister Sterling.
This is a masterpiece, a pinnacle of escapist videos excelling in both form and function.
Maybe I exaggerated a bit, but this is a very, very good episode of the Jimquisition.