kotor 1 vs kotor 2

[Continuity]

I don't mean to sound like a condescending prick, but I think you need to give KOTOR II's story another chance. It was written by the same guy who wrote Planescape: Torment, and that was a game worthy of best RPG plot ever. No offense, but I doubt that you could have managed to write a story with the same level of satire, deconstruction and thematic depth as what Obsidian managed to produce. There are people who study philosophy who use KOTOR II as an example of philosophical symbolism in videogames. It's a deep, deep story.

Well I played it through twice, lightside and darkside, and beyond the obvious and frankly unbelievable plot going on with Kreia which was uninteresting at best and fully irritating at worst... FFS she's got to have one of the most boring personalities i've come across in a computer game. Add to that that the plot was served up in broken and disjointed quest hubs that did very little to tie into each other in an obvious way that I cared about at all.

The big problem for me, with Kotor 2 is simply the lack of interesting characters, combined with the broken and disjointed, not to mention boring, plot.

If you can get past that then... well frankly even then, there is just nothing there.

Kotor on the other hand was a coherent and flowing space opera with memorable and well characterised characters, and polished quests.

no comparison.

 

[EHKOS]

Thats debatable. KOTOR 2's story is unfinished unless you mod it, and KOTOR 1's story is far superior.

yes because the game in unfinished because it was more or less a cash in, and yet the game developer was able to make a more intertresting story that kinda broke the sw mode, and explained sw repeats itself again and again.

I wouldn't call it a cash in, Obsidian put love into the game. It was the publishers deadline that killed the ending, and even though it was a shit ending, the ride to get there was pretty fucking sweet. Peragus had amazing atmosphere (hahaha)for me.

 

[Namulith]

KoToR 2 sounds like it has a great story. But that opening level was just so boring that I couldn't be bothered to find out. Gonna go with KoToR 1.

 

[Continuity]

KoToR 2 sounds like it has a great story. But that opening level was just so boring that I couldn't be bothered to find out. Gonna go with KoToR 1.

Kotor 1 is the better game IMO but it has an even slower open than Kotor 2. Just FYI.

 

[The Madman]

Well I played it through twice, lightside and darkside, and beyond the obvious and frankly unbelievable plot going on with Kreia which was uninteresting at best and fully irritating at worst... FFS she's got to have one of the most boring personalities i've come across in a computer game. Add to that that the plot was served up in broken and disjointed quest hubs that did very little to tie into each other in an obvious way that I cared about at all.

The big problem for me, with Kotor 2 is simply the lack of interesting characters, combined with the broken and disjointed, not to mention boring, plot.

If you can get past that then... well frankly even then, there is just nothing there.

Kotor on the other hand was a coherent and flowing space opera with memorable and well characterised characters, and polished quests.

no comparison.

I don't think any sane human being is going to argue that Kotor 1 is the more well polished and designed game, but the rest... that's subjective. I honestly have trouble remembering the characters from 1, which I played around the same time as I played the second a few months back. There was Bastilla and... um... HK-47 obviously and... erm... the blue kid and her wookie. Oh, and Kaidan was there too, that guy seems to get everywhere.

For the most part however it was just bland. Awesome twist mind you, but the actual plot beyond that... such boring Star Wars tripe. Oh Noes, sith badguys doing badguy stuff because they're sith. Quickly, assemble my typical cast of mismatched heroes to save the proverbial day. Oh noes, I had amnesia all along, I AM the sith badguy. Guess it's redemption time (Or not, which admittedly I find much more entertaining!).

Kotor 2 however I felt like I understood the motivations behind the companions. I know why they were there and I felt I was having a tangible effect on the characters themselves through dialogue. Not only that but they react believably as well, I was pleasantly surprised when at one point one of the characters in Kotor 2, Mira, stopped to say "What the hell, I'm not a peaceful person but at least I don't kill people... till I met playercharacter anyway. Since we've been cutting people down like crazy, WHAT IS GOING ON? Why hasn't anyone stopped us yet, why am I even okay with this?". It was just a fantastic bit of dialogue that went out of its way to break the proverbial fourth wall by trying to explain what otherwise would have been dismissed as game mechanics, and in so doing making Mira a more believable and sympathetic character.

By contrast in Kotor 1 that blue girl for example is supposed to be like, what, 12? 14? And by the end of the game she'll have killed hundreds of people without a single pang of conscience or the slightest dip in that cheerio street urchin attitude of hers... Right up until I have her best friend kill her, but that's probably just me. The point I'm making is that it doesn't make any sense and I'm glad that Kotor 2 at least tried to explain these things, to make the characters question what's going on and reacting believably. Kotor 1 only scrapes at this *IF* you play Dark Side, confronting the Jedi companions and slaughtering the rest. But Kotor 2 goes the full distance and I appreciate that.

I hope you see what I mean. Not by any stretch saying Kotor 1 is a bad game. Distancing myself from personal tastes Kotor 1 is, objectively, the better game in nearly every sense over Kotor 2. I can see why people would prefer it over the second.

But Kotor 2 has its strengths as well, and I for one enjoy the game much more for them. Plot and characterization I'd say is one of those strengths.

 

[RuralGamer]

KOTOR 1 was way better for me; the second game had some great characters, but I didn't like many of the changes, especially the more randomised loot drop, which kept giving me more double-bladed lightsabers when I wanted a normal one (seriously though, I went through one game, deciding I was going to dual-wield regular lightsabers; I got seven (SEVEN!) double-bladed ones and a short from loot drops (sighs...)) Also there was a ton of cool items I only ever got once in all my playthroughs.
I also prefered KOTOR 1's story, even if there were some cliches (is that the word) with all the ancestors' items for some of the main characters in the trilogies. Still, ignoring its bugs and cut-content state, it was really enjoyable.

 

[BLAHwhatever]

Can't remember specifics, but I remember the first game to be the better one. I think I just liked the story better

 

[Foxpack1]

Kotor 2 by miles because:

Kreia and Hk-47 who has become 50x more homicidal XD
The amazing dialogue, influence and philosophy.
Sion for being a badass with an amazing voice.
The small things, like interaction between party members without the Exile.

 

[MrTub]

I liked both games, but I prefer Kotor 1. I thought the story was better.

 

[Continuity]

Really? Kreia was boring? I found her to be one of the most interesting characters from any Star Wars story ever, and indeed, she's seen as one of the game's absolute highlights. She's an old Force user who readily admits that she's a former Sith Lord (Lady?), who not only trained the Big Bad from the previous game but also the two (quite frankly terrifying) Sith Lords who are hunting you this time around as well. She's one of the only female characters I know of in videogames to combine extreme cynicism with an incredibly well written maternal streak. She is ever ready to point out every flaw you, the Exile make, yet it is quite obvious that she loves you, and she says as much at the game's finale.

And she has the single most interesting relationship with the Force of any EU story written. She views the Force not as a benevolant life-force, but as an omniscient tyrant which readily sacrifices people from both the Light and Dark side in order to pursue its own agenda. She is essentially the only character fighting for free will in a universe enthralled to determinism. That issue alone throws up a whole host of philosophical questions, all of which the game answers in some form or other.

Quite frankly, Kreia shits over any NPC from the original. All the characters from KOTOR are well worn recycled archetypes: the spunky streetwise teen, the jaded soldier with a tragic past, the crusading Jedi with conflicting inner-feelings, the grim mercenary with a hidden sense of honour... None of them offer up anything close to the philosophical insight or ambiguity of Kreia. Compare some of the character motivations from the first game against the second:

"Waah, my family is dead and I am sad. I cannot trust anyone ever again."

"Ha Ha Ha! I am taking over the galaxy because I am evil, and therefore I shall laugh heartily! Ha Ha Ha!"

Compared to:

"The Force is the enemy of free-will, and I am going to humiliate those who wronged me into admitting as much, and in doing so I will destroy everything they ever believed in."

Fine, except I don't really recall caring about any of this when I played the game (admittedly several years ago when it first came out), starwars is about light and dark, that is the quintessential essence of starwars.. exploring the grey in-between just left me cold.

When I play a game like kotor i'm going to focus on being the ultimate paragon of the lightside or the very epitome of a darkside sith lord. Anyone who falls into the grey in-between is just going to earn my scorn and disinterest as I roleplay one of the two typical starwars role I describe above... and to base the whole plot around a character that from a typical starwars perspective make no sense at all is just a horrible waste.

 

[Spider RedNight]

I liked each one for different reasons. The first KOTOR had a good story, pretty environments(I love Manaan and Taris), and Carth while the second KOTOR had an easier menu and controls and I Disciple.

I DIDN'T like KOTOR II better, however, than the first one because the first one had options and side-quests that had to do with getting to know your partners. I also hated the last boss of the second one.

Each game is good in their own right, even though I liked the first one a bit more. :3

 

[Continuity]

...

Well first, i'm not really sure starwars should have a gritty make over, its a fairytale story of uber good vs uber evil, if you take that away from it there isn't an awful lot left.

That said I guess my main problem with kotor 2 was that it didn't really work for me... for example I'm trying to roleplay a sithlord and i'm all like: POWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH... UNLIMITED POWAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpAcanUJX7s] and Kreia is there sitting on my shoulder rolling her eyes and heaping me with scorn... how does that picture make any sense?

 

[Bobbity]

Best Thing about KotOR 2? The awesome cloaks that move when you walk. Well, that, and being able to train half your companions as Jedi.

 

[KingofMadCows]

They're two very different games. KOTOR1 was all about fulfilling your fantasies of being a Jedi Master/Sith Lord. KOTOR2 was more about challenging your beliefs and deconstructing the Star Wars setting. It's like comparing Raiders of the Lost Ark with Blade Runner.

 

[KingofMadCows]

The thing with KOTOR2 is that it actually asks you to justify your actions. You're constantly challenged on your decisions. They bring up what the Exile did during the Mandalorian War all the time. You actually have to deal with the reasons and consequences for your actions. In contrast, Revan never really has to answer for anything he did when he was a Sith Lord. If you go light side, you basically just act like you're a completely different person than Revan. If you go dark side, you just go back to being Revan without knowing or even caring about what Revan's original motivation was. I guess you're just supposed to assume that Revan was a stereotypical power hungry Sith. With KOTOR2, you can't just go, "I'm a Jedi Knight so I'm going to do this simply because it's what Jedi Knights do" or "I'm Sith Lord so I'm going to do this because that's what Sith Lords do."

 

[AD-Stu]

So here's the thing: I've spent the past few days reading through the KOTOR 2 LP (many thanks to Avatar Roku for the link) and I've got to admit, I've been hooked. There was definitely stuff I missed, despite playing the game through both in its original format and with the restoration mod...

Spoiler: like...

...the implication that Kreia is Handmaiden's mother (my second playthrough was female, so instead of having Handmaiden in my party I was stuck with Disciple constantly shouting "you have left me an opening" but still, I doubt I would have caught the subtlety)

...and I agree with a lot of the other posters in this thread, when you get to read the complete thing it's a subtle and well-crafted story with some incredibly deep content. It's very cool stuff and my hat goes off to the writers.

BUT:

The various bugs, cuts and very nature of the game ensure that for the vast majority of players, the story will be broken at best and in many cases it can become a largely unintelligible mess. As the LP demonstrates, a lot of the cool content is only available if you know in advance to have companion X with you on world A (or worse, companion X and Y), or if you micro-manage the influence system in the correct way to give you access to all the different dialog trees (again, as the LP notes, for Mandalore it was actually impossible to do so without modding, and I managed to screw Bao-Dur's up all by myself through poor planning once).

Plus with an ending handled that badly, you've really got to cut people some slack - it's only natural for your final experience with a story to colour your perception of everything that came before it.

Anywho, my point is that I'll agree, KOTOR 2's complete story was fantastic, but with all the problems the developers had I think it would have made better novel than it did a video game.