Lack of romance in games ignores the female audience

[Anarien]

Hang on, what generalization are you referring to? If you read it through, I said quite explicitely that not all girls are like that. Yet it's a fact that most gamers are males and for most AAA titles there's more guys buying them than girls.

"Most" if you mean roughly 60%. It's not like gamers are that heavily male these days, but marketing does have an impact on the perception of the market. So there is a lot of generalization in your post. Might also want to be a little less defensive in your responses.

That said, if a game has an actual story reason to have a romance option, fine. I don't really seek them out. I did really enjoy it in Dragon Age: Origins though, but that was in large part due to the story, the writing, and the particular character I chose to get into a romance with.

 

[AnkaraTheFallen]

Yes, romance does make many games good, however if it's just crammed in for the sake of it, then it can also ruin a game.
It isn't necessary in a game, but if it is set up well and has a reason to be in the game it can make the characters seem far more believable.

 

[Wolfram23]

4.It relates to your post because of your "the game must be crap" comment. I'm meerly suggesting that is not true when there are plenty of games that would fit into that category overseas and have an audience for them. I suppose they may or may not be crap, but that would depend who you ask.

I meant if someone didn't have an interest in a game before they discovered the small romantic part, then they must not think of it as very highly, and therefore would be better to make games based entirely around it.

Ok, I can understand that. But let me give you an example: LA Noire. After playing Heavy Rain through with my girlfriend I thought she'd be interested in LA Noire. Yeah it's a bit different but still a very heavily story driven game with lots of mystery and all that. So I told her about it and she was interested for sure. But when we watched the trailer, it was all action and cops and I don't think there was a single woman shown throughout the trailer... she imediately decided she wasn't interested. So it's not that she, at least, would be suddenly interested because there's a romance, but that she becomes uninterested because there isn't a romance.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

Thank you for that. All these guys are replying and calling me sexist and such... I was trying not to be, and I think your post somewhat vindicates my stance that romance is important for girls - but not JUST girls! I totally enjoy a good romance plot! I just don't like the ultra cheesy like a lot of rom-com movies

Also, AC:B has the real romantic plot, AC2 though, like you say, is really fun to just run around and explore and assassinate stuff haha.

I'll have to check out FFX2, and Persona as someone else mentioned. Thanks!

Actually, I'd go with FF X for both good romance and good gameplay. Assuming, of course, that you like a good JRPG of the older "stand in a line" type combat. Which I do. ^^

FF X-2 is... strange. Really strange. But you MUST play FFX first, or FFX-2 is just going to come off as complete gibberish (and probably really annoying). The combat (in X-2 that is)... is about half-way between FF 5 and FF 13. Just FYI.

It also helps if you like J-Pop. Again, I do, so I really liked the musical segments.

 

[Katana314]

As a budding learning game designer, here's my issue with it: I've always defined immersion as how closely the feelings of your protagonist/avatar and the player are aligned.
Character: Oh no! Goblins!
Player: Oh no! Goblins!
Character: Grrr, you stinky sorcerer!
Player: Grrr, you stinky sorcerer!
Character: I'm ready to take on anything!
Player: Why the hell aren't there any health potions here??

That last part would be an immersion break.
That said, forcing the player to "love" another character, or even give the option, strikes many as a bit creepy. They're a mess of polygons with a voice actor/actress. Besides, many of us (myself excluded) have significant others, and what the hell would you say to them while playing that game?

So I don't blame most developers for excluding that sort of thing. It's dangerous territory in the feelings of many players. HOWEVER, I do see one way it can sort of work. Basically, avoiding any emotional attachment of your own character, and having various romances occur among the support characters can have its impact, especially if you helpfully get involved in some way (rescuing a man's wife from a dragon and bringing her home to him, to watch them hug each other and thank you endlessly). Additionally, I played a game called Digital: A Love Story, in which the reciprocated feelings of your own character were never said, or even implied; the girl you meet just kind of admits she developed feelings for you, and calamity prevents a fully-formed reply. Having not expected anything of the protagonist, that one worked well.

It's a pretty tricky subject, overall. It's not the same way as you'd develop a romance in a movie.

 

[Eldarion]

I fail to see sexism. I pointedly state that most of my favorite books have romances in them and that I appreciate it. I also like games with romance, but I have not played many at all.

I was mostly poking fun at you

Saying that the lack of romance options in games is is ignoring just the female audience still seems a little crass, but no one is taking it seriously.

I don't think I can play Persona... isn't that PS2? However we are looking forward to trying Catherine. That said, sounds like she'd really like Persona. Thanks!

No problem. Have fun.

 

[VaudevillianVeteran]

...Really? The only way to get girls to play a game is to promise them that they can woo characters? ...Wow. In my opinion, romancing should be just...there, if a game is an action/shooter/fantasy game, I'd rather be playing for that, not because I can get a pretend kiss from some pixels and go 'D'aww, they wuv each other'. It just feels silly when I could be slaying dragons, killing aliens and I don't know? Saving the day?
Of course I won't knock romance sub plots, sometimes they can be interesting and sweet, but they shouldn't be the main reason to buy a game.

 

[Anarien]

Ok, I can understand that. But let me give you an example: LA Noire. After playing Heavy Rain through with my girlfriend I thought she'd be interested in LA Noire. Yeah it's a bit different but still a very heavily story driven game with lots of mystery and all that. So I told her about it and she was interested for sure. But when we watched the trailer, it was all action and cops and I don't think there was a single woman shown throughout the trailer... she imediately decided she wasn't interested. So it's not that she, at least, would be suddenly interested because there's a romance, but that she becomes uninterested because there isn't a romance.

Try some other trailers. There are ones that have women in them. Sometimes as corpses though. But there seems to be a strong story there, with interpersonal relationships playing a role.

 

[Palademon]

2. Pointless to play a game only for a slight bit of romance that happens in it.

That's, like, your opinion.

I've played games just for the romantic subplots before. I already mentioned Final Fantasy X-2. It isn't the only one, just the one with the largest contrast between unpleasant gameplay and interesting romantic plotline.

Well, it sounds reasonable there since you seem to descirbe it as the only good part of the game, and therefore would be the thing people would most focus on.

EDIT: Also, by my point I meant if it's only a small bit that you focus on or care about then the game as a whole can't be very good, but then again that's a massive opinion I must have that I assume is based on logic since it seems like the game must be bad if for say you only played a Bioware game purely because you heard a character from a previous game would be in it, but you hated all the other characters and how they had changed the game in that sequel, but you'd like to romace with that character again. This is probably a bad example though.

 

[Ailia]

The older BioWare games made you work for the romances. The ones in Shadows of Amn were easy to destroy if you weren't invested in them or paying attention, and didn't involve around bribing them with objects and gifts.
'Part from that, my favorite romances were in Persona 3 & 4 (already mentioned). And I guess the Harvest Moon romances too, if you're really desperate.

 

[ZtH]

Romance games?

Well...Balder's Gate has a few romance based Mods, the Final Fantasy series, GTA IV (sort of), ICO, Prince of Persia, Vampire:Bloodlines, ..the Witcher...

Ok, I'm clutching at straws now.

Wait what? Bloodlines?

Spoiler

Are you referring to Jeanette? VV? I don't see that as being a main plot in the game.

I second Prince of Persia, and ICO. I'm not really a big fan of the romance in the Final Fantasies I've played, but it is present at least. Also there's always the Kingdom Hearts series if she's a fan of Bromances.

Spoiler

Just saying that Kairi gets like a five second greeting and Rikku gets like a five minute cutscene even though its heavily implied they both like kairi.

 

[BlackIvory]

Anyway, if she hasn't yet, give her a copy of Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time to play.

Also, POP from 2008 and Enslaved had great bonding between your character and the female one

 

[Woodsey]

Anyway, if she hasn't yet, give her a copy of Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time to play.

Also, POP from 2008 and Enslaved had great bonding between your character and the female one

Alternatively: POP 2008 had some college students in funny costumes, and Enslaved decided to leave its character-based plot pissing in the wind 3/4 of the way through the game.

Sands of Time is one the best examples of how to write character relationships in gaming. Its subtle, its paced, and it feels genuine.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Wait what? Bloodlines?

Spoiler

Are you referring to Jeanette? VV? I don't see that as being a main plot in the game.

Spoiler

Well, it all depends on whether you have the Animus Constupro, Blood Dolls and others from the Companion Mod. Or whether you can get it on with Tourette.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

EDIT: Also, by my point I meant if it's only a small bit that you focus on or care about then the game as a whole can't be very good, but then again that's a massive opinion I must have that I assume is based on logic since it seems like the game must be bad if for say you only played a Bioware game purely because you heard a character from a previous game would be in it, but you hated all the other characters and how they had changed the game in that sequel, but you'd like to romace with that character again. This is probably a bad example though.

I get what you're saying. And, in the case of FF X-2, the romance pretty much WAS the plot. Which is one reason why so many people hated the crap out of it. Some of that hate was for some very... strange and often unsatisfying game play though.

But I digress. On your Bioware example, technically speaking I bought ME1 after enjoying ME2, even though I don't like gaming on PC and found the combat less interesting in ME1. Why? For the chance to romance Liara (and to meet Tali and Garrus, my romantic interests from ME2, before they were romancable). For me, that was 20 bucks well spent. ^^ Even if I had to play ME1 on its lowest graphic settings to avoid overheating my laptop.

 

[veloper]

Here's a good recommendation for you:

get her chick lit and romantic comedies instead of games.

Requiring a romance in your videogame is the worst checkbox criterium I've ever heared. All of them are embarrasingly bad, even compared to crap hollywood shits out. There's no game to recommend.

 

[Dorian6]

yes, because all girls love romance in games and the only way that any female will enjoy anything is if you force a romantic sub-plot in

 

[CheesyGrin1992]

Female Escapist here, and while the romance side plots in games can be quite fun, it doesn't make or break it for me. I played Mass Effect for the guns and the killing things. I play the Assassin's Creed franchise because I love the freedom of the game, along with the whole stabbing people in interesting ways part. Point is, as a female gamer, I play these games to have some fun, for some escapism. I didn't pick up Dragon Age and think, "ooh, romances". I picked it up thinking "ooh, RPG from a company I know makes good games".

That's not to say that romance in games isn't entertaining. I enjoyed flirting with Garrus as much as the next girl, but because of the characterisation. The romancing wouldn't have been anywhere near as interesting if Garrus wasn't such a good character. And because romancing him gave my Shep and Garrus a little more fleshing out as characters (not that that's necessary with a Bioware game really)

On another point, all mainstream games with romances in have a predominantly male audience anyway. What makes you think it's for our benefit? What's to say that no romance is "ignoring female audience" when it could just be that developers don't want to risk a media storm over some side boob (as we've all seen happen many a time)? I go into a game for the same reason most guys do (I would imagine anyway); to blow shit up and/or stab something and/or have some fricking fun killing stuff (with most games anyway). I play the game for the game, not because I may be able to flirt with a bunch of pixels or watch a romance develop. At the end of the day, I play games for the gameplay. If I want romance, I'll just pick up a book.

As for whether I feel ignored as a female playing games... not at all. In fact, I feel that as a female I can experience much more of a spread of the gaming spectrum than most guys. I'm happy enough to play Gears of War with my partner one moment then Professor Layton the next. I can easily swing from a blood and guts hack and slash like Devil May Cry or Ninety Nine Nights to typically girly games like Nintendogs or Cooking Mama (always in short bursts though. Casual games tend to fill spare 5 or 10 minutes between lectures, nothing more). I'm just as happy to hunt on games like the Monster Hunter franchise as I am to strum away on Guitar Hero. About the only gaming genres I won't play are Racing, Sport, or RTS. Anything else is fair play to me.

Ignored? If anything, I feel spoilt that I can enjoy such a variety of what gaming has to offer.

(Sorry this ended up so long winded guys.)