ME3 Homosexuality Chapter (meant to be Ironic?)

[Xixikal]

Who cares? It's just a game, Bioware can do what they want and the players can do what they want.
Some people just get so worked up...

 

[kzgonuts63]

I don't know how to feel about this. Why would they dedicate an entire chapter about Shepard gay? I can just picture the final mission, the galaxy is about to be destroyed and they are all having a the last briefing together, and Shepard says 'Okay, so that's what we have to do to save everything, let's move out. Oh yeah, and I am a homosexual'. It just seems not needed is all. Also it would seem weird to the storyline for everyone who decided to stick little Shepard in anything human or alien that moved and was resembling an opposite gender.

 

[Ian Caronia]

Oh for the love of...doesn't anyone recognise [HEADING=2]IRONY[/HEADING] when they see it?

Hepler is obviously poking fun at the tidalwave of homophobia the announcement that ME3 will contain optional s/s romances produced.

I mean, honestly. Read betweent the lines?

THANK YOU! Finally, someone else fucking gets it.

Thank you, good sir, thank you for joining me on the logic train. I swear, this Bioware hate is getting way to out of hand when people take a post like that seriously.

Wait, so this is meant to be ironic? ...Where's the joke? Where's the fact showing that it's a joke?
Doesn't anyone recognize [HEADING=2]TEXT ON THE INTERNET DOESN'T CARRY YOUR VOICE AND MANNERISMS[/HEADING] when they decide to trype "ironically"? Or, in this case, sarcastically?

Besides, with everything Bioware has been retconning and changing, does this really seem out-of-place for them? Considering half the people who read it take it seriously, or rather the majority, I don't think so.

 

[Wuffykins]

I appreciate you taking the time to read my post and reply, but I think you missed my main issue. It's not just that it has nothing to do with the plot, it's that they apparently plan on devoting an entire chapter to this. As I stated, the romances in the prior games were side quests, optional bits you could add to the plot should you play it that way.
_This is literally telling us that no matter how we play the game, we will diverge from the plot (Reapers killing all life and we gotta stop them) to deal with the possible issue of homophobia? Why? Why a whole chapter? Why not just give the option to have a romance that deals with such a thing?

Worse yet, what's with the pseudo "scandalous" idea of having Shepard find out two of his crew mates are gay? What does that have to do with anything?

It just makes the addition of homosexuality in ME all the more awkward when it shouldn't be. It should be natural. It should feel genuine and real, not like a special episode of Mass Effect where Shepard discusses the issues certain homosexuals have to go through.

Make it optional and use it to fuel the drama of the romance. Don't interrupt the story with a pro-gay rights message that has nothing to do with the plot.

Also: Don't be fooled by this. As I said, this is clearly just a marketing ploy to make Bioware seem "edgy" and "revolutionary". In the end, it's more insulting than a stereotypical gay character. They're abusing the fact that gay gamers would love the choice to be gay in ME to make themselves look better and sell more copies. Then again, that's how I see it.

I'm getting the impression you're misinterpreting the use of the word 'chapter' from the post made at Bioware, as to be honest I'm pretty sure that entire storyline that's being thought up isn't going to jump in, interrupt a fight between Shepard and whatever fodder he's shooting at and not let you continue until you decide, as believer258 put it so eloquently above, whether Shep prefers pancake or sausage. I'm sure it'll be more akin to a series of side-stories and quests that you might stumble upon while moving around the Normandy or whatever non-combat area, having the options of choosing to follow them through or give a quick 'STFU! No want!' conversation option to end them there.

As much as I see Bioware aiming to 'move forward' or whatever they would call this addition, they do have to cater to the key demographic of Third-Person Shooter players. And I'm sure the typical one would certainly be against the "Stop! Question your sexuality time!" method of presenting this material.

 

[Mahorfeus]

Jennifer is the most epic troll ever; did anybody actually take that post seriously?

 

[angmoo]

I don't care if some LIs are gay or not, I just want them to have distinct sexualities rather than "we're all bi lawl".

 

[ZeroMachine]

Oh for the love of...doesn't anyone recognise [HEADING=2]IRONY[/HEADING] when they see it?

Hepler is obviously poking fun at the tidalwave of homophobia the announcement that ME3 will contain optional s/s romances produced.

I mean, honestly. Read betweent the lines?

THANK YOU! Finally, someone else fucking gets it.

Thank you, good sir, thank you for joining me on the logic train. I swear, this Bioware hate is getting way to out of hand when people take a post like that seriously.

Wait, so this is meant to be ironic? ...Where's the joke? Where's the fact showing that it's a joke?
Doesn't anyone recognize [HEADING=2]TEXT ON THE INTERNET DOESN'T CARRY YOUR VOICE AND MANNERISMS[/HEADING] when they decide to trype "ironically"? Or, in this case, sarcastically?

Besides, with everything Bioware has been retconning and changing, does this really seem out-of-place for them? Considering half the people who read it take it seriously, or rather the majority, I don't think so.

Majority of people thought it wasn't so out of place for people to think the world was flat.

Yeah, that's right, I'm pulling that card.

Nah, in all seriousness, just read it, seriously read it over and over again, and tell me if a logical company would really pull stuff like that.

I don't buy it for a second.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Well, in real life, you have the option to make flirtatious comments to people of your sex and many people (probably some people you know) are gay.

So, in other words, some people are gay.

Don't lecture me. And besides, you totally missed the point. I don't care that some people are gay. I can totally appreciate BioWare catering to that crowd as well. But it shouldn't be forced down the throats of people who want nothing to do with it.

Ah, and herein lies the double standard. When straight couples/relations are portrayed in media, no one thinks anything of it. When gay couples/relations are portrayed in media suddenly it's (lol Freud) "forcing it down the throats of people who want nothing to do with it."

 

[IBlackKiteI]

Snippage

Agreed man, agreed.
Though theres currently no way of knowing for absolute sure just how much of an impact it will have on the game.

If this is true though then its gunna look fucking ridiculous.

Bioware games are already way too obsessed with fucking, not romance, not deep character interactions in the form of romance, not romance as a way to deepen the game. Its, just, fucking from the beginning till the end. (Seriously, for instance Shep tries to have sex with a girl who could fucking die from it? And no matter what the player does there's no way around that to finish the romance path)
Whatever, its just that 'romance' in Mass Effect is handled in a really immature kinda way. I just hate how its so damn schoolyard and they call it romance and say thats a way to make the game 'deep and immersive', know what I mean?

And, assuming this is true, Bioware is going to force the whole sexual thing on players in a really bizarre way in ME3?

Just...why?

 

[LiquidGrape]

[Double post]

 

[LiquidGrape]

Wait, so this is meant to be ironic? ...Where's the joke? Where's the fact showing that it's a joke?
Doesn't anyone recognize [HEADING=2]TEXT ON THE INTERNET DOESN'T CARRY YOUR VOICE AND MANNERISMS[/HEADING] when they decide to trype "ironically"? Or, in this case, sarcastically?

Hepler wrote Anders in Dragon Age 2.
Hepler was accused of "retconning" the character in order to appease a s/s demographic.
Hepler recognises the ridiculousness of this accusation.
Hepler writes a clearly sardonic post about a franchise in which she has no direct involvement, suggesting more "appeasement" to the s/s demographic.
Profit.

Admittedly good call on the irony/sarcasm thing, though. I do make that mistake. Although, at a stretch, you could label the reaction to the post as comedically ironic.

Besides, with everything Bioware has been retconning and changing, does this really seem out-of-place for them? Considering half the people who read it take it seriously, or rather the majority, I don't think so.

Wait, allowing the sexually ambiguous Shepard to pursue a homosexual relationship with an equally sexually ambiguous squad member is "retcon" now?
Seriously?

I think we're done here.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Bioware games are already way too obsessed with fucking, not romance, not deep character interactions in the form of romance, not romance as a way to deepen the game. Its, just, fucking from the beginning till the end. (Seriously, for instance Shep tries to have sex with a girl who could fucking die from it? And no matter what the player does there's no way around that to finish the romance path)
?

I think that this is a good point, but it's more a point about bioware's general failure to portray convincing romances than a specific issue with gay romances in particular. Honestly, potentially-lethal sex with your top engineer/hacker makes a lot less sense than garden-variety sex with someone who shares your pair of X and/or Y chromosomes or an alien analogue.

 

[Undead Dragon King]

Well, in real life, you have the option to make flirtatious comments to people of your sex and many people (probably some people you know) are gay.

So, in other words, some people are gay.

Don't lecture me. And besides, you totally missed the point. I don't care that some people are gay. I can totally appreciate BioWare catering to that crowd as well. But it shouldn't be forced down the throats of people who want nothing to do with it.

Ah, and herein lies the double standard. When straight couples/relations are portrayed in media, no one thinks anything of it. When gay couples/relations are portrayed in media suddenly it's (lol Freud) "forcing it down the throats of people who want nothing to do with it."

Your nose is so far in the air that an angel would probably trip on it. Your logic is also fallacious. A double standard implies a view that is shared by a society. But a game like Mass Effect is a personal experience. People are quite free to have double standards (or none at all) in their own personal lives. The game like that is merely an extension of those same personal decisions. Or it can go opposite of them. Regardless, a game should not force an ideology on someone who doesn't want to hear it.

 

[Wuffykins]

Majority of people thought it wasn't so out of place for people to think the world was flat.

Yeah, that's right, I'm pulling that card.

Nah, in all seriousness, just read it, seriously read it over and over again, and tell me if a logical company would really pull stuff like that.

I don't buy it for a second.

Well sonuva... I will admit I skimmed the second paragraph on the first read, but reading it alone definitely make it seem more than a little exaggerated.

Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to go murder my roommate for finishing my coffee and replacing it with instant. Wuffy no likey fake coffee before graveyard shifts.

 

[ZeroMachine]

Wait, so this is meant to be ironic? ...Where's the joke? Where's the fact showing that it's a joke?
Doesn't anyone recognize [HEADING=2]TEXT ON THE INTERNET DOESN'T CARRY YOUR VOICE AND MANNERISMS[/HEADING] when they decide to trype "ironically"? Or, in this case, sarcastically?

Hepler wrote Anders in Dragon Age 2.
Hepler was accused of "retconning" the character in order to appease a s/s demographic.
Hepler recognises the ridiculousness of this accusation.
Hepler writes a clearly sardonic post about a franchise in which she has no direct involvement, suggesting more "appeasement" to the s/s demographic.
Profit.

Admittedly good call on the irony/sarcasm thing, though. I do make that mistake. Although, at a stretch, you could label the reaction to the post as comedically ironic.

Besides, with everything Bioware has been retconning and changing, does this really seem out-of-place for them? Considering half the people who read it take it seriously, or rather the majority, I don't think so.

Wait, allowing the sexually ambiguous Shepard to pursue a homosexual relationship with an equally sexually ambiguous squad member is "retcon" now?
Seriously?

I think we're done here.

Your logic is undeniable.

Also, just for kicks, I just messaged Miss Hepler on the Bioware forums in order to clear this all up. She's on maternity leave so I may not get a response for a while (or at all) but I'm sick and tired of all the unwarranted hate for Bioware, so I figured it'd be worth a try.

 

[barash]

NOTE: I found this in another thread and instead of derailing the thread I decided to make a new one devoted to this topic.

Whatever they make, will be 'streamlined to be even more accessible to the fans and when you press a button something awesome will happen! Twice!'.

Screw Bioware, they're cutting to many corners in the name of a quicker buck. And the corners they cut are all from the RPG-part of the equation.

Whatever it is it'll be super gay.

I mean that literally. They are forcing the topic so hard. Good lord, I'm as pro sexuality of any natural nature as you can get without becoming a point singularity for it, but even I'm thinking "Alright guys...that's a little bit forced."

I imagine their next game will be like heavy rain but the plot twist will be that everyone is gay.

I wouldn't mind it if it was canon, but the hardcore retconning is just really jarring.

Again, in no way anti-gay, just think Bioware is going about it very tacky and ruining an oppurtunity.

Found this in the deep currents of teh interwebz - gave me the lolsies ^_^

--

Meanwhile, at Bioware..

:trollface

--

Not to sound like a downer...but isn't this exactly what theultimateend was talking about? I mean, you know, not to derail the thread, just want to respond to this.

It's very good to see them put so much work into this and to be so conscious about it too, and for those planning on having a homosexual turn in ME3 I'm sure this is very interesting...
...But why? Even for a gay Shepard playthrough it's...out of place. And what's with the "accidentally discovers" bit? Why does a straight gamer's playthrough have to grind to a halt to turn into a "defend gay preferences" story for a whole chapter? Why does a gay gamer's for that matter?

Look, in Persona 4 Kanji's homosexuality had to do with the story. The Kanji arc is part of the plot because the plot involved what society thinks of people, and how people think of themselves. It was literally about the inner lies we tell ourselves and the rejection of our true selves. It was actually very intimately woven into the main story.

What does this have to do with the Reapers? What's this have to do with...anything?

As a great friend (one who knows more about homosexuality in story telling than I do) told me in response:
"I think it's a dumb idea.
Why make a whole section that the character has to play though? Making your character homosexual should be a choice in the game that you can seek out- like a side quest or just make it that you can woo any of the partner choices male or female.
You shouldn't have to be forced into a section to 'test your reactions to make your character gay/what they think of another character being gay'
That's dumb.
Just make the game. And then make it so that no matter what gender you are, you can chase after anyone.

Its not 'revolutionary' or 'insipring' to make it a requirement to answer if you're gay or not or what you think of another character being gay. It's insulting and degrading. And it will most likely cause a lot of people to have longwinded homophobic discussions."

Basically, making an entire section devoted to homosexuality is pointless and kind of insulting. If you want to make homosexuality natural in your story, don't put it under a spotlight and force everyone to stare at it. Set it amongst everything else in the story. Homophobia has never been an issue in ME before...so why now that the universe is under attack would anyone suddenly grimace at two dudes or two women?

It's blatant pandering, which is what set everyone off about the Garrus and Tali romances to begin with. However at least those were side quests. Optional. They affected the story, yes, but the story didn't stop for the romance to ensue. It was part of it.
_More importantly, this is just another ploy from Bioware to make people talk about the game in a pseudo "revolutionary" light and say "Bioware is changing things in the gaming industry". Sorry everyone, but it's not right.
Shepard being gay or having a gay couple in the cast should be natural. Devoting an entire chapter to it is as awkward and ridiculous as those classic anime titles with insultingly flamboyant gay characters.
Pulling the game over to stop the plot and take a break at the "what do you think of homosexuality" rest stop is just as stupid.

EDIT:

Spoiler: Supposedly this was meant to be ironic

Oh for the love of...doesn't anyone recognise [HEADING=2]IRONY[/HEADING] when they see it?

Hepler is obviously poking fun at the tidalwave of homophobia the announcement that ME3 will contain optional s/s romances produced.

I mean, honestly. Read betweent the lines?

THANK YOU! Finally, someone else fucking gets it.

Thank you, good sir, thank you for joining me on the logic train. I swear, this Bioware hate is getting way to out of hand when people take a post like that seriously.

Wait, so this is meant to be ironic? ...Where's the joke? Where's the fact showing that it's a joke?
Doesn't anyone recognize [HEADING=2]TEXT ON THE INTERNET DOESN'T CARRY YOUR VOICE AND MANNERISMS[/HEADING] when they decide to trype "ironically"? Or, in this case, sarcastically?

Besides, with everything Bioware has been retconning and changing, does this really seem out-of-place for them? Considering half the people who read it take it seriously, or rather the majority, I don't think so.

Dude, look riiiight below the picture of the 'Bioware' post. Yea, it was kinda obivous wasn't it

Good job on trolling the boards though *tipofthehatandsauntersoffagain*

 

[Kahunaburger]

Well, in real life, you have the option to make flirtatious comments to people of your sex and many people (probably some people you know) are gay.

So, in other words, some people are gay.

Don't lecture me. And besides, you totally missed the point. I don't care that some people are gay. I can totally appreciate BioWare catering to that crowd as well. But it shouldn't be forced down the throats of people who want nothing to do with it.

Ah, and herein lies the double standard. When straight couples/relations are portrayed in media, no one thinks anything of it. When gay couples/relations are portrayed in media suddenly it's (lol Freud) "forcing it down the throats of people who want nothing to do with it."

Your nose is so far in the air that an angel would probably trip on it. Your logic is also fallacious. A double standard implies a view that is shared by a society. But a game like Mass Effect is a personal experience. People are quite free to have double standards (or none at all) in their own personal lives. The game like that is merely an extension of those same personal decisions. Or it can go opposite of them. Regardless, a game should not force an ideology on someone who doesn't want to hear it.

You're choosing to play the game, you know. If for some reason I am mortally offended by artificial intelligence, I don't have a right to whine about Portal 2 "forcing A.I. down my throat" because I always have the option to not play Portal 2 if it offends me so much.

 

[Ian Caronia]

Majority of people thought it wasn't so out of place for people to think the world was flat.

Yeah, that's right, I'm pulling that card.

Nah, in all seriousness, just read it, seriously read it over and over again, and tell me if a logical company would really pull stuff like that.

I don't buy it for a second.

With the idea that it could be trolling (from a representative of Bioware...nice job ass (not you, them)) I can see how this could and likely is fake. However, let's be honest here, that post was written with no signs of sarcasm aside from the stupidity it would be if it was actually implemented. And the "we're working very hard" bit as well as their place in Bioware makes the post seem all that more genuine.
That and the aforementioned rectons and changes constantly being implemented...
I think more people need to learn how to be sarcastic, because you don't get credit for fooling someone if you did it wrong.
Like you with the "world is flat" bit. You almost had me until I saw the italics. That made me laugh. XD
Especially since you have no idea how many real trolls actually try to use those kinds of examples @ __ @

No hard feelings all around then

 

[LiquidGrape]

Also, just for kicks, I just messaged Miss Hepler on the Bioware forums in order to clear this all up. She's on maternity leave so I may not get a response for a while (or at all) but I'm sick and tired of all the unwarranted hate for Bioware, so I figured it'd be worth a try.

Like you say, Jennifer Hepler hasn't been active on the BioWare boards for over a month. [http://social.bioware.com/141649/]

Also, comparing that rather conspicuous image with the actual board format, I think there's also a definite possibility that this is a shoop.

Regardless, go go Gay Shepard!

P.S

Oh bloody hell. Looking at the post the OP quoted more closely.
[HEADING=1]There's even the traces of a "trollface" beneath it.[/HEADING]
Even though I never bought the alleged sincerity of its sentiment, now I feel stupid for ever thinking the post was made by Hepler at all.

D.S

 

[fulano]

Whaaaat? So, no special gay chapter, then? Bummer. I wanted to Lesbian my Shepard up and then proceed to make a bid deal out of it. I derive great joy from playing an aggressive lesbian Shepard.