Most video games star white males.

[Rooster Cogburn]

Let's not blow this out of proportion. Not everything has to be rated either "perfect" or "Klansmen". Jumping straight to unfair extremes is why nothing of value ever gets discussed in threads like this.

Yes, very well stated. Something can be racist or so forth, without being anywhere near to being, say, a klansman.

Thank you. And my comment was meant for both sides. Merely being 'Not Racist' isnt a very high mark to shoot for. I wouldn't call it racism at all, personally. Sometimes racism is present and overt, of course, but I'm just describing the general trend. I don't think 'racist' is fair, but that doesn't mean the way we are doing things can't be improved.

 

[Tohuvabohu]

-snip-

No no, I wasn't pointing the finger to you in particular, sorry if seemed like I was calling YOU a fan of carbon-copied content.
I am quite aware that streamlining due-to publisher pressures is very common in the industry, and there's sometimes not any room for creativity due to the desire to make money instead of taking risks. and yes, it's a huge shame.

But, I also wasn't talking about streamlining as a whole, but just the white-male-protagonist phenomena.

Even in terms of maximizing profits, is having a white-male-protagonist really that meaningful in terms of numbers?
I wonder if less people would've bought Half Life if Gordon Freeman was Mexican or Brazilian. Or if Mass Effect would've gotten less sales if the "canon-shepard" was a black woman instead of white man.

I think we've seen a fair amount of highly successful games which star non-white male characters, enough for it to not be a "risk" anymore. This is why I don't really believe this choice to be a one for the sake of making money, but due to lack of creativity.

 

[SneeringCanuck]

They're fictional games built for entertainment, not fucking buisnesses that need to fill affirmative action quotas.

Most gamers are white males, and so video games are going to primarily feature white males as their figureheads, it's marketing 101, create something your target demographic can identify with.

You wouldn't see hairy Italian men being used in women's perfume commercials, because that's not who their trying to appeal to.

And just because I can't resist pointing it out, not finding women/men of a certain race attractive is not racism, it's personal preference.

 

[Aris Khandr]

You guys are almost there, but just missed the mark. The reason that most video game main characters are white males isn't because of target audience. It's because most video game developers are white males. They write what they know. If you want to change that, then start supporting minority developers, who will then write minority characters since that is what they know.

And anyone who says that physical attraction is based on racism needs to take a look at themselves more deeply. That's just absurd.

 

[Ordinaryundone]

I didn't say changing their race was a solution. Non-whites are pretty much forced into the shadows and made unimportant, discriminated against in the video game industry. White protagonists are chosen over black ones, that is discrimination and privilege. The fact that video game developers may not even notice they're doing that, doesn't lessen the problem.

Non-whites merely need to be allowed to not be invisible. What would change if this started happened less if non-whites weren't being made invisible? The obvious racist fact that non-whites are being discriminated against and being made invisible and whites are being given privilege. Aren't non-whites being treated as not worthy of being a main character a racist problem in it's own?

You are equating a lack of examples with racism, which is not fair. Truth be told, plenty of games feature non-white protagonists, like just about every Japanese game ever made that doesn't explicitly star a white guy. Likewise, non-white side characters are also extremely common. Why is the main protagonist usually white? Well, as the saying goes, "write what you know". Most game designers on this side of the ocean are white, and thus are writing what the feel most comfortable with. It takes an exceptionally good writer to write characters of different race/religion/sexuality than them without making them boring or stereotypes, and there really aren't that many good writers in the video game industry. And the ones they do have? They are too busy making fantasy or sci-fi games where race absolutely does not matter at all. Said games also make up about 70% of all games made, so I really don't see what the big deal is.

Gears of War

Half the main cast is either non-white (Dom, Cole) or Female (Anya). Woo, Marcus is a white guy. Big deal.

Crysis

Prophet is black, and it's never established what race Alcatraz is. Nice job talking out of your ass.

Assassin's Creed

Desmond is half-Arabic, Altair is full on Middle Eastern. Ezio is a white guy, but so what? He's already outnumbered in that regard.

Legend of Zelda

Link isn't a white guy, he's an elf/Hylian/whatever. He has no real life equivalent.

Super Mario Bros.

Really? REALLY?

Mass Effect

Funny, I've made black, asian, and female Shepards. Must have just been your game.

Max Payne

Last time I checked, 70+% of the NYPD is white. Its not really a stretch to believe you'd play a white male in that position.

Hitman

In addition to being a clone, 47 is also a mix of several races including Chinese and Latin American.

Kane & Lynch

Would you be LESS offended if a Black and Hispanic guy where portrayed as crime committing psychopaths?

Devil May Cry

Like Link above, Dante is a demon. He race means nothing, as he has no real-life equivalent

Surely I am not the only one disturbed by this.

Surely you are.

 

[Tuesday Night Fever]

Even in terms of maximizing profits, is having a white-male-protagonist really that meaningful in terms of numbers?
I wonder if less people would've bought Half Life if Gordon Freeman was Mexican or Brazilian. Or if Mass Effect would've gotten less sales if the "canon-shepard" was a black woman instead of white man.

I think we've seen a fair amount of highly successful games which star non-white male characters, enough for it to not be a "risk" anymore. This is why I don't really believe this choice to be a one for the sake of making money, but due to lack of creativity.

The problem is that while we may not think it's a "risk" anymore, they probably still do. We judge a game's success by whether or not it's entertaining. It's sad, but these days it seems like in the eyes of publishers a game is only successful if it sells millions of copies in its first week. So while there may be a 'fair' amount of titles with non-white protagonists that did well, the question is whether or not they did well enough. And considering the majority of games that sell millions in the first week seem to have white protagonists, I wouldn't be surprised if they draw a connection there.

It's rather depressing that quite a few of gaming's classics likely wouldn't exist if the industry operated the same way back then as it does now.

 

[hazabaza1]

I think OP just incited a flame-war and skipped town. Sneaky!

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I think you guys are be kind of unfair to the OP. (even though I think Mario and Link were stretching it a little far ) It's true that video games would benefit from a larger diversity of characters from a creative standpoint as long as they aren't shoehorned in. Even in games like Fallout 3, Skyrim and Mass Effect the man is used on the poster. (You should have seen the controversy a female Dovahkiin poster caused on Facebook it was actually kind of horrible.)

It's also kind of disappointing that we finally had a game where you could play as a aborigine woman ((Dead Island) and she was immediately a cause for insult, on the side of the developers no less. On the other hand the nice thing is that some games, like Portal, feel that they can give us a mixed race(?) female character where they could have really just had a robot do it (maybe GlaDos complained )

http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/117/1177659p1.html this is probably the most disturbing example of it (yes I knows it IGN forgive me!) where pictures can actually be superimposed and they look exactly the same.

I'm not entirely sure racism actually comes into it more that it's a ridiculous example of the white male as the universal default. As for the demographic reasoning I can understand that but how do they expect to develop a wider demographic if they don't strike out a little.

No wonder us ''gamer girls'' think we are something special and different even the games tell us that we aren't 'normal!'. ( http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MenAreGenericWomenAreSpecial )

If anything it's less of an issue of racism and sexism and more an issue of game dev's not being very creative which I think is something we, as gamers, should point out and complain about.

Spoiler: hmmm...

 

[dimensional]

er ok this honestly has never occured to me before so I guess you can all see how strongly I feel about the issue but I suppose if you portray your own race you are playing it safe when making a game after all in most games the protagonist goes round killing things not to mention you can make fun of your own race and have a laugh but make fun of another race and your being racist and thats just a nest best left alone most of the time.

I suppose Mario is a racist icon as well Japanese people horribly stereotyping the poor hard working Italian plumber also we dont see enough Italian plumbers in games damn it they really have it in for them.

 

[GrandmaFunk]

I think you guys are be kind of unfair to the OP. (even though I think Mario and Link were stretching it a little far ) It's true that video games would benefit from a larger diversity of characters from a creative standpoint as long as they aren't shoehorned in.

the OP's point is valid on some levels, unfortunately she killed it with hyperbole and vocabulary choices....that's mostly what ppl are reacting to.

 

[SextusMaximus]

Yes, that includes the ones made in Asia.

Uncharted
Gears of War
Crysis
Assassin's Creed
Metal Gear
Legend of Zelda
Super Mario Bros.
Deus Ex
Mass Effect
Max Payne
Hitman
Kane & Lynch
Devil May Cry
ect. x 1000

Surely I am not the only one disturbed by this.

Assassin's Creed features a middle eastern dark skinned guy, Mass Effect you can choose skin colour, and most of these games are made by western developers who live in predominantly white societies. It's not racist, get over yourself.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I think you guys are be kind of unfair to the OP. (even though I think Mario and Link were stretching it a little far ) It's true that video games would benefit from a larger diversity of characters from a creative standpoint as long as they aren't shoehorned in.

the OP's point is valid on some levels, unfortunately she killed it with hyperbole and vocabulary choices....that's mostly what ppl are reacting to.

Yes I think approaching it with the racism and sexist argument (although as a woman I'm hoping thing will move towards Alyx and away from Ivy ) was the wrong way to go.

It's an issue of being creative and to an extent taking risks. Indie games are much better with having interesting protagonists I find (chickens, robots, cthulu!) perhaps it's a money vs risk thing.

There was an argument that Okami marketing had a poor reaction, because you play as a wolf, for example.

I can understand why dev's play it safe but really, come on, I'm sure us gamers can cope better with change than what they are giving us credit for.

 

[hazabaza1]

Spoiler: hmmm...

Row 1:Nathan Hale,Naked Snake,Nathan Drake,Chris Redfield, Michael Thorton(maybe?)
Row 2:???(no clue),Norman Jayden,Sam Fisher,Commander Shepard,???(no clue)
Row 3:cole macgrath,Alex Shepard,Tomas "Sev" Sevchenko,Jason Flemming,Max Payne
Row 4:Alan Wake,Alex Mason,???(no clue),niko bellic,Frank West

if anyone knows the names of the characters I missed I would appreciate the help

Pretty sure that's Ethan Thomas from Condemned 2, not Fisher. Guy you missed on second row is Starkiller as well.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Spoiler: hmmm...

Row 1:Nathan Hale,Naked Snake,Nathan Drake,Chris Redfield, Michael Thorton(maybe?)
Row 2:???(no clue),Norman Jayden,Sam Fisher,Commander Shepard,???(no clue)
Row 3:cole macgrath,Alex Shepard,Tomas "Sev" Sevchenko,Jason Flemming,Max Payne
Row 4:Alan Wake,Alex Mason,???(no clue),niko bellic,Frank West

if anyone knows the names of the characters I missed I would appreciate the help

Pretty sure that's Ethan Thomas from Condemned 2, not Fisher. Guy you missed on second row is Starkiller as well.

Hehe it's cool you guys took that pic and turned it into a game I'm satisfied with this outcome.

 

[GrandmaFunk]

that's a good point regarding risk vs originality, would it then be better to have a female cookie-cutter character of a male one that breaks the mold?

another interesting angle is: should the character's gender have an impact on gameplay/story.

ex: if an RPG lets you pick your gender and you make a female character, but the choices only impact cosmetics/pronouns...are you really playing a female character?

assuming the default character looks male, are you even playing a male character? or is the character effectively genderless and all the gender choice provides is a different faceplate?

compare that to the Mount&Blade system: you can make a female character, but making this choice has a limiting effect on game play(without going in to details, this is based in how the game simulates feudal marriages.)

so playing a female character actually puts you at a disadvantage(though many consider it an extra challenge)..does this make the game more realistic or is it sexist?

 

[McMarbles]

I've noticed that, for people who claim to not give a damn about race in games, you sure are putting in a lot of effort to shout down anyone who raises a question.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

that's a good point regarding risk vs originality, would it then be better to have a female cookie-cutter character of a male one that breaks the mold?

another interesting angle is: should the character's gender have an impact on gameplay/story.

ex: if an RPG lets you pick your gender and you make a female character, but the choices only impact cosmetics/pronouns...are you really playing a female character?

assuming the default character looks male, are you even playing a male character? or is the character effectively genderless and all the gender choice provides is a different faceplate?

compare that to the Mount&Blade system: you can make a female character, but making this choice has a limiting effect on game play(without going in to details, this is based in how the game simulates feudal marriages.)

so playing a female character actually puts you at a disadvantage(though many consider it an extra challenge)..does this make the game more realistic or is it sexist?

It might be an extra challenge tbh Nah, there is some game genres where certain characters don't fit. You can't have a woman in as a front line soldier in a world war 2 game for example although she would be fine as a allied spy. There is instances where you can say 'That guy/girl/chicken/old god/robot wouldn't be there.

Surely the argument of 'does it matter' end the same way. If it's yes then it's valid to try out different races and sexes. If it doesn't matter then why does it matter if it's always a guy if you see what I mean.

I prefer Fallout's approach where to a 'admittedly limited' extent people actually recognise that you are male or female. I'd heard this happens in TOR too. Admittedly according to some 'feminists' in the industry this is a double edged sword as why should they react differently if you are female.

Personally I like someone calling me out on being a lady when they were expecting 30 something brown haired guy, because it's an extra source of amusement

Please don't misunderstand me and think I'm just saying that there should be more women. What about robots or aliens or animals and suchlike. There is such an abundance of things you could be, as Indie games have shown us, that it seems a shame to have all game protaginist be the same dude with a different haircut.

 

[Andy Shandy]

Spoiler: hmmm...

Row 1:Nathan Hale,Naked Snake,Nathan Drake,Chris Redfield, Michael Thorton(maybe?)
Row 2:???(no clue),Norman Jayden,Sam Fisher,Commander Shepard,???(no clue)
Row 3:cole macgrath,Alex Shepard,Tomas "Sev" Sevchenko,Jason Flemming,Max Payne
Row 4:Alan Wake,Alex Mason,???(no clue),niko bellic,Frank West

if anyone knows the names of the characters I missed I would appreciate the help

The end of Row 2 is Starkiller from The Force Unleashed I believe not sure about the other two, although they'll probably be really obvious. Also whoever thought it was Ethan Thomas instead of Sam Fisher, it is actually Fisher, from an early shot of Conviction

Anyway, yes, most of the video game protagonists are white-males but that's because 1. Most of developers are white males and 2. The majority of gamers who are going to be buying the game are white males. I identify more with white males because I am a white male and I hang about with more white males (every time I type that I get closer to putting mite whales). It's simply because the biggest demographic for companies to aim for are white males. The developed world is mainly white. You can't blame the developers for that.