North Korea threatens the US with a Nuclear War.
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We should start copyrighting this shit, sounds like the Korean war II: The Americans strike back with tactical nukes is going to be where gaming is at in 5 years.Hallow said:
Also, when looking at images online it turns out the war might be closer to Red Alert than I had previously thought:
Kollega said:
I have an esteemed friend who has spent several months in NK and says it's a very nice place to be; he detected no hostility from anyone there. And no, his movement within the country was not restricted. To give you some background, he's been to loads of countries, mainly in the third world, including lots of African countries and also Iraq during the first Gulf War (he became a de facto hostage there), so he has a standard to compare it against. He used to advise governments on modern agricultural methods.Mantonio said:
We keeping speaking as though Kim Jong-Il is crazy, and that's just not the case. He has perpetuated the cultivation of an ideology that is opposed to our own here across most of the West, but it's not as though that happened for no reason whatsoever.
The economic disparity between North and South Korea is mind-numbing. The only reason for this is their respective allies. South Korea has a posse, the greatest contributor of which is the United States, which dumps enough trade into their country on top of any other assistance that South Korea can enjoy a fine way of life. That's not to say that South Korea isn't responsible for its own prosperity. The people there do their work. But without someone to work for--that is to say, without global trade partners--a country like South Korea would become...well, a country like North Korea.
North Korea has a population that is loyal. Each of them is more than willing to pull their weight on behalf of the state, their local territories, their families, themselves and anything in between. That is a state to be lauded. The unfortunate reality, however, is that the nation's leaders have cultivated that loyalty and work ethic by focusing their population's collective gaze on an enemy. Us. Or U.S. Read it how you like. The reasons for this are extensive and historic, as has been brought up several times in this very forum. There's nothing we can do about that at this point, but we can take it into account when considering North Korea's perspective in this matter. Their twin brother to the South enjoys unparalleled prosperity when compared to most of the other nations in its region of the world, while the people of North Korea continue to struggle for the sins of past generations. Wouldn't you be pissed?
Now, I'm not saying any of this makes their leadership, governing practices or foreign policy all right. I am saying that at this point, it makes sense. All they have to show for nearly a century of cultivating a single political ideology (which is the reason for their alienation in the first place) as America and other industrialized nations have purportedly attempted to do for generations is a list of allies as long as one of my tooth. The options laid before the politicians in North Korea at this point are as follows:
1.) Step out and tell their nation that they're calling the last century a mulligan and attempting to reverse the indoctrination they've become so good at for all this time;
OR
2.) Use the backing of a readied, angry nation to make threats that they can only hope will intimidate some part of the world into participating in North Korea's economy so that one day the people of that country can have a meal that doesn't consist entirely of rice, oysters and hate.
Will it work? Probably not. As has been pointed out elsewhere in this forum, the legitimate weapons capability of North Korea is questionable at best. When presented with a traditional land war and forced to defend their own territory, it is more than likely that they'd fight to the last dozen or so citizens and start from scratch. In today's military landscape, however, their abilities are somewhat more limited, and at worst they could rouse the ire of several of their neighbors simultaneously.
Which brings me back to my original point. They may be different from us in a number of ideological ways, but they're not crazy. They're tactically sound enough to realized that further alienating themselves from the world before they've had a chance to insinuate themselves into it is not going to help their long term goals in the slightest. Still, a bit of prayer never hurt anything, right?
The economic disparity between North and South Korea is mind-numbing. The only reason for this is their respective allies. South Korea has a posse, the greatest contributor of which is the United States, which dumps enough trade into their country on top of any other assistance that South Korea can enjoy a fine way of life. That's not to say that South Korea isn't responsible for its own prosperity. The people there do their work. But without someone to work for--that is to say, without global trade partners--a country like South Korea would become...well, a country like North Korea.
North Korea has a population that is loyal. Each of them is more than willing to pull their weight on behalf of the state, their local territories, their families, themselves and anything in between. That is a state to be lauded. The unfortunate reality, however, is that the nation's leaders have cultivated that loyalty and work ethic by focusing their population's collective gaze on an enemy. Us. Or U.S. Read it how you like. The reasons for this are extensive and historic, as has been brought up several times in this very forum. There's nothing we can do about that at this point, but we can take it into account when considering North Korea's perspective in this matter. Their twin brother to the South enjoys unparalleled prosperity when compared to most of the other nations in its region of the world, while the people of North Korea continue to struggle for the sins of past generations. Wouldn't you be pissed?
Now, I'm not saying any of this makes their leadership, governing practices or foreign policy all right. I am saying that at this point, it makes sense. All they have to show for nearly a century of cultivating a single political ideology (which is the reason for their alienation in the first place) as America and other industrialized nations have purportedly attempted to do for generations is a list of allies as long as one of my tooth. The options laid before the politicians in North Korea at this point are as follows:
1.) Step out and tell their nation that they're calling the last century a mulligan and attempting to reverse the indoctrination they've become so good at for all this time;
OR
2.) Use the backing of a readied, angry nation to make threats that they can only hope will intimidate some part of the world into participating in North Korea's economy so that one day the people of that country can have a meal that doesn't consist entirely of rice, oysters and hate.
Will it work? Probably not. As has been pointed out elsewhere in this forum, the legitimate weapons capability of North Korea is questionable at best. When presented with a traditional land war and forced to defend their own territory, it is more than likely that they'd fight to the last dozen or so citizens and start from scratch. In today's military landscape, however, their abilities are somewhat more limited, and at worst they could rouse the ire of several of their neighbors simultaneously.
Which brings me back to my original point. They may be different from us in a number of ideological ways, but they're not crazy. They're tactically sound enough to realized that further alienating themselves from the world before they've had a chance to insinuate themselves into it is not going to help their long term goals in the slightest. Still, a bit of prayer never hurt anything, right?
That's because governments have been doing it for thousands of years. Read between the lines and you can see it happening B.C. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if we didn't need to do it and still did just for the Hell of it. Wouldn't be the first time.Littlee300 said:
Wait, America is South Korea's ally. If America won't come to the aid of its ally what are the chances of and ally of its ally coming to South Korea's aid? It just looks bad if America's military says "hmm, coud be dangerous with those nukes, lets send the Brits in first", it doesn't work like that. Russia doesn't give a hoot about North or South Korea, it is not a global power, it is a HUGE regional power though the entire People's Republic of China is in the way. Same with the EU. They will talk about if for 12 years and maybe then they will decide what they SHOULD HAVE done. Don't count on the UK either, we can barley afford our own battleships for the very limited mission we have at the moment.Ultratwinkie said:
"North korea's military isnt good enough to take on all multiple military attacks at once."
but Russia, America, EU, etc aren't going to attack all at once. Nuclear weapons are like a one-on-one confrontation where someone has a gun, one shot and you are dead/dying so no one wants to step forward first. You try to bum rush a guy with a gun the first person to step close gets shot, and then usually everyone else runs away. Hell they could be armed but they don't want to shoot as North Korea has a big brother called China they don't want to piss off.
They are the wild card here, they will simultaneously protect North Korea from invasion and aggression, but at the same time they are the only ones that can reign them in. I wouldn't say China is thirsty for North Korean blood. Remember, North Korea is China's oldest and historically it's closest military ally.
IF North Korea is allowed to amass a potent nuclear arsenal and IF they invade South Korea then the people to save the day will - like it or not- be China. But will they even have that much of a problem with South Korea falling under totalitarian communist rule, that which it is finally shaking itself free of the last remnants? Any war with North Korea will be very costly, even for the Chinese and will be a bitter pill to swallow considering their past relationship.
That is the big question I cannot answer but I don't know how NK's nuclear program can be stopped. The onus is on the PRC to reign in their ally, stop their nuclear ambitions as their intentions are clear but can they and even would they?
If they are loyal out of fear, control, ignorance, propaganda and lies... that is NOT any loyalty to be proud of. Any talk of "willingness" in terms of contribution is a fallacy as all those who object suffer incredibly and publicly.Daselthechaz said:
If the choice is submission or death... that is no choice at all.
It feels like we do this every year. We do something in the region, Kim threatens to kill us all, and then nothing happens. We even skip part one on many occasions. If it did come to war however, Kim would be facing the US backed South Koreans, the US itself, and China. China may have trade with North Korea, but they know Kim will stand no chance and would sooner break off ties with the pitifully poor North Korea before cutting off ties with at least one of their largest business partners. There is also the fact that China is having a population problem, and will want nothing to do with the inevitable refugees flooding in from North Korea should they side with them. China also has a stake in regional stability, they want to see war no more than any side does, seeing as it would mean US troops probably on or near their border. The long and short of it is, Kim will get pissy but not do anything, the US will do their show of force, and everything will go back to the way it was until next year when Kim feels the need to remind the world he exists once again. At least that's what I think will happen.
Fun fact: The Korean War never officially ended, it has been in cease fire for around 60 years.
Fun fact: The Korean War never officially ended, it has been in cease fire for around 60 years.
Doesn't the UN also have to allow the US to fire nukes as well? I dunno, so don't quote me on that. Seriously, don't. Also wouldn't the resulting blast from either nuke affect a large portion of the world rather than just the US. Chernobyl affected sheep in Wales, North Korea could ruin the world.somelameshite said:
Fuck, if this goes down then Albino Radscorpions are gonna be more of a problem than just hard to kill on Fallout.
Also, apologies on quoting you... 10 pages in, but I'm backing you up here.
Knowing it, Australia will be dragged in if America goes to war w/ N.Korea. Damn the infernal form thingy we signed.