PC Elitists/Console Fanboys

[Crazyshak48]

I don't care to be honest PC fanboys console fanboys, both the same to me, they need to grow up.

Well said. Now if we could just get some of the COMPANIES to think the same way. I'm talking to the CEO of Activision here

My only preference to consoles vs. PCs is whichever platform the game runs better on and has better content on. I freely admit I enjoy the greater freedom I get with PC games, but I don't look down on console players either. Everyone has their own tastes, and it's silly to ridicule someone for which system they play.

 

[squid5580]

What I can't do is go into a museum and draw the same mustache on it. Regardless how awesome it would look.

How does that metaphor work?

Games are art. You go out and change another persons artwork for the rest of the viewers to see when the curator (AKA the devs) don't want you to.

Doesn't mean you ruin the original that everyone sees however, just the people that want to see your changes do.

Don't get me wrong though some devs treat it like art class. They give you the tools and tell you get as creative as you want. And good on them. That doesn't mean they all should. Or be blackmailed into it.

Yeah I agree, I do see it as a huge shame if they don't though. The best games I'm playing at the moment all started off as mods.

I agree some people will want their games untouched, but I think it is a bad buisness move because whatever anyone makes going to need your game to run, someone makes an amazing mod, word of mouth spreads, you get money from people buying your game to play the mod aswell as seeing what you made.

The only problem with I have with MW2 not having mods is it will destroy the competitive side of gaming, without the PAM mods we had for the other CoDs, leagues are going to be harder to organise fairly. I only ever played a Rifles Only mod in Call of Duty 2, and that ended up getting mixed with PAM and having it's own tournaments. This move will ruin the competitive community, which I used to be a part of and it's another shame as it was so much fun.

Ok but what about the other half of the glass that is empty? For every epic mod how many shit ones are out there? How many potential customers could be turned away because they see a crap mod being played?

Another thing and I know alot of people will be upset that I am going to point it out but it has to be said. Maybe they are trying to remove the extreme competetive tournament mentality. We are entering a new era. "hardcore" or "elitists" are going extinct. We no longer rule the industry. These new mammals called "casual" gamers are taking over. They are much easier to please (meaning cheaper) and frankly they have us outnumbered and outgunned. I think IW knows by now that they can't please everyone. And that sacrifices have to be made. So who do you think they are going to put on the altar? The thousands of hardcore or the millions of casuals? Sooner or later you will have to make a choice. Either you accept and adapt or you become a HARDCORE READER or MOVIEGOER.

 

[DazZ.]

Ok but what about the other half of the glass that is empty? For every epic mod how many shit ones are out there? How many potential customers could be turned away because they see a crap mod being played?

Word of mouth of those mods won't really spread a quarter as far, and even then the person would say this isn't the real game if it is crap compared.

Another thing and I know alot of people will be upset that I am going to point it out but it has to be said. Maybe they are trying to remove the extreme competetive tournament mentality.

I don't see why they would need to remove it, they may be the minority but they cater to themselves with mods once they are allowed to, they play out of sight in private servers, they have their sponsored LAN events that casual gamers most likely won't even hear about. They stick to themselves and don't play pub matches. Matchmaking is going to mean pros and elitists are now mingling with the people that just want a casual game, not the best way to deal with the problem in my opinion, in fact it's quite the opposite.

We are entering a new era. "hardcore" or "elitists" are going extinct. We no longer rule the industry. These new mammals called "casual" gamers are taking over. They are much easier to please (meaning cheaper) and frankly they have us outnumbered and outgunned. I think IW knows by now that they can't please everyone. And that sacrifices have to be made. So who do you think they are going to put on the altar? The thousands of hardcore or the millions of casuals? Sooner or later you will have to make a choice.

I'm hoping eventually they add their own version of a PAM mod, for competitive play. Their older games have been headliners at events for the past few years, and the moves they are making here are seriously harming this. It won't take much more effort to release one mode that is usable in competitive play, I know they won't be readjusting this mode for 2 or 3 years on like the PAM mods were, but something.
It might even be included and the system might be fine already, we haven't played it so who's to know. It can't be as bad as WaW on release for scrims though, being released without a "/record" or even a lagometer/FPS command...

Either you accept and adapt or you become a HARDCORE READER or MOVIEGOER.

I'll buy a rocking chair and a months worth of whiskey, sit in my corner and become a hardcore mutterer, reminiscing about the games back in my day.

 

[Ace of Spades]

My problem with PC gamers is that all the ones I know are elitist pricks who look at me as the scum of the earth for abandoning it. I have nothing against PC gaming, but I am not willing to put up with buying a game and spending a week troubleshooting before it works.

 

[squid5580]

Ok but what about the other half of the glass that is empty? For every epic mod how many shit ones are out there? How many potential customers could be turned away because they see a crap mod being played?

Word of mouth of those mods won't really spread a quarter as far, and even then the person would say this isn't the real game if it is crap compared.

Another thing and I know alot of people will be upset that I am going to point it out but it has to be said. Maybe they are trying to remove the extreme competetive tournament mentality.

I don't see why they would need to remove it, they may be the minority but they cater to themselves with mods once they are allowed to, they play out of sight in private servers, they have their sponsored LAN events that casual gamers most likely won't even hear about. They stick to themselves and don't play pub matches. Matchmaking is going to mean pros and elitists are now mingling with the people that just want a casual game, not the best way to deal with the problem in my opinion, in fact it's quite the opposite.

We are entering a new era. "hardcore" or "elitists" are going extinct. We no longer rule the industry. These new mammals called "casual" gamers are taking over. They are much easier to please (meaning cheaper) and frankly they have us outnumbered and outgunned. I think IW knows by now that they can't please everyone. And that sacrifices have to be made. So who do you think they are going to put on the altar? The thousands of hardcore or the millions of casuals? Sooner or later you will have to make a choice.

I'm hoping eventually they add their own version of a PAM mod, for competitive play. Their older games have been headliners at events for the past few years, and the moves they are making here are seriously harming this. It won't take much more effort to release one mode that is usable in competitive play, I know they won't be readjusting this mode for 2 or 3 years on like the PAM mods were, but something.
It might even be included and the system might be fine already, we haven't played it so who's to know. It can't be as bad as WaW on release for scrims though, being released without a "/record" or even a lagometer/FPS command...

Either you accept and adapt or you become a HARDCORE READER or MOVIEGOER.

I'll buy a rocking chair and a months worth of whiskey, sit in my corner and become a hardcore mutterer, reminiscing about the games back in my day.

It is all speculation and no one knows if it will work or bomb completely. They have to try though. The casual market is athe Holy Grail right now. For it to work perfectly there has to be some comprimise. And that is something no one is willing to concede on the elitist side yet.

Me I am gonna be a HARDCORE WHITTLER. Take away my games and I'll take away your oxygen.

 

[Woe Is You]

Modding is the power of Awesome.

Modding is for those who don't like the original game. So why buy it?!

Good on IW, may other developers follow suit.

This is a nonsense claim. I love Max Payne but one of the reasons it's in my top 10 games of all time is because it came with a set of tools that enabled easy modding. Kung-Fu, Katana, The Family and lots of other mods made sure that it didn't last just the week I spent on it playing through the game with every difficulty. Instead, my interest in the game was extended by years.

Also, I'm pretty sure the guys who got Counter-Strike for Half-Life before Valve hired the team that made the mod didn't hate the original game.

As for why PC players are pissed about no dedicated servers, fix-the-spade [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/jump/9.151144.3569594] lists all the reasons pretty well there. In short, you're going to have much less control over who you're playing with and what you're playing. They're basically exchanging functionality for perceived ease-of-use.

It's as if developers are increasingly forgetting that the PC isn't a console and there are just some things you have to do differently for the platform.

Ok but what about the other half of the glass that is empty? For every epic mod how many shit ones are out there? How many potential customers could be turned away because they see a crap mod being played?

Here's the question, though. How often has that happened? I mean, I could make Woe Is You's Crappy Mod 1.2 for a game and I'm pretty sure that:

1) The guys that are going to play the mod are guys that already have the game and know how to install mods for it. Affected sales: probably zero.
2) That I have to get people interested for them to even download the mod. That means impressive looking screenshots, since the fact is that nobody downloads mods without knowing what they're getting. Affected sales: zero again.
3) To get to a point where it affects the sales of any game at all it'd have to be really popular, hence it would also have to be really good.

Not to mention the game still has to be good to have mods. Very few games (if any) have had absolutely crappy campaigns and then had a booming mod community surrounding them. MUGEN maybe the sole exception here. Not to mention there are tons of crap games out there, so crappy mods are expected. Sturgeon's law and all. It's not like we get dozens of really spectacular games every year. That doesn't mean there haven't been spectacular mods and there is no worth to having tools for that.

But yeah, the game's a pretty sure no buy for me now.

 

[Rath709]

Please make the tired and irrelevant threads stop.

 

[DazZ.]

-snip-

Whilst I agree with alot of what you have said, the way you have said it is just going to aggravate console gamers as you have insulted them at least 5 times with your rant. Read your post from a console gamers perspective, and they are still gamers, contrary to what you believe, and you see anything you said is not going to be listened to at all.
There is no point in explaining all of that to PC gamers as we already know about it, so the people you want to read that is console gamers. Don't insult them whilst you are trying to tell them why we are annoyed that our games are degrading in quality, that's why we can't say anything slightly negative without having "Elitist!" sprayed in our face.

 

[VastShadowz41]

Well this topic may or may not end in flames.

 

[Ristoril]

i believe the argument continues simply because it is something to argue about. I for one enjoy arguing therefore I argue. Also I'm a console fanboy

 

[Croaker42]

This.
I am a champion of the light. With PC in my heart. I know the path before me will be beset by the decievers and lost souls but I will overcome, neverswaying from a true way of glory.
*smite*

I think that I'd rather be stabbed than have someone preach at me smugly.
Not pointing that comment at you, obviously.
Just something that came to mind when I read it.

It would be less preachy more biblical style wrath.

 

[Sven und EIN HUND]

I'm just pissed off that now that IW has fucked over their loyal PC fanbase, their loyal console fanbase are looking all smug. I mean, I know there are probably some people out there who are PC elitists and that would be major dicks to consolers, but I'm not one of them. Most of the console users have jumped right on top of the high horses that some elitist PC users have just been kicked off of; they're generalizing the PC community. It's annoying.

 

[Clashero]

Having a hissy fit and/or whining about the decision is stupid. If it pisses you off all that much, just don't buy the bloody game. If you're taking it THIS seriously, you aren't treating gaming like a hobby/enjoyable pastime.

As far as I'm concerned, you shouldn't get any benefits from playing a game depending on what platform you buy it on. A game is a game - you should get near enough the same content no matter what you play it on.

I'll have to disagree with your second paragraph. The PC is, in fact, superior from a technical point of view. It has the capacity to include a server browser in its games, which would then allow us to form communities, have clan servers, modded servers, special rules servers, tournaments, filters, servers with "regulars", etc.

Saying we should just "suck it up" since console gamers have always handled matchmaking fine is ridiculous. A group of people eats nothing but shit for every single day. Another group of people eats delicious, moist cake for every single day. One day, the cake people are told they are going to be given shit. Does it make sense for the shit-eating people to tell the cake people to suck it up, since they've never had a problem with eating shit?

 

[IckleMissMayhem]

As far as I'm concerned, (and as far as I know, I am actually entitled to my opinions, thank you so much, oh gods of gaming...

If you're modding a game, you're basically saying it isn't good enough for your own standards. Which seems like a huge slap in the face for the production team who've spent x amount of time making it. It's their work, they should be allowed to protect it as such, keeping it in it's original format. If you don't like playing by their rules, design and manufacture your own sodding game. From scratch.

Anyway, aside from you lot having a hissy fit about MW2, what difference do you really think there is between gamers of different platforms? I could choose to play games on PC... would that make me a better person? Doubt it. I play games on consoles because I choose to. What right have you got to criticize me or others, or label us as retards just because we made a choice that's different to yours'?

Jesus christ, you lot make the people I have breathing heavily down my 360 earpiece as soon as they find out I'm female seem mature. So much for the bloody so-called 'elite.'

 

[Woe Is You]

If you're modding a game, you're basically saying it isn't good enough for your own standards. Which seems like a huge slap in the face for the production team who've spent x amount of time making it. It's their work, they should be allowed to protect it as such, keeping it in it's original format. If you don't like playing by their rules, design and manufacture your own sodding game. From scratch.

Errrr, no? Is writing fanfic saying that the story the fanfic is based on isn't good enough for your standards? And with most cases, like with games like Half-Life, Quake, Aquaria, Max Payne and boatload of others, the developers themselves provide the tools that people use for modding. Where does the modder's disrespect for come into picture there? And the other more interesting question: why is experiencing a game your own way a slap in the face of the person who made it?

For the record, I'm not saying Infinity Ward must give us the tools but what I am saying is that for a lot of games, such tools help foster a community that exists long after the game disappears from the retail shelf space.

Anyway, aside from you lot having a hissy fit about MW2, what difference do you really think there is between gamers of different platforms?

Ah, but there obviously is a difference between a PC gamer and a console gamer. As we've seen on this thread, a PC gamer is often more open to the idea of a game being much more than just the initial experience and more a platform for variants and total conversions of the game, as opposed to the idea that a game is just that single experience.

Besides, if you basically start the conversation by telling people they're assholes for expecting features they've had for a good 15-20 years, you shouldn't be surprised that you get insulted back.

 

[Celestialum]

Modding is the power of Awesome.

Modding is for those who don't like the original game. So why buy it?!

Good on IW, may other developers follow suit.

Not to be judgmental, but, ah, it looks like you completely miss the point of modding. Modding is often done because the player loves the game, not because they abhor it. This is a pretty simple concept that I thought everyone had accepted.