Pissed at my English teacher, justified?
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Ahem, this little Argument isn't about the Videogame. It's about the Artwork that got you into that Videogame. The pretty Picture, which is called "Artwork" or "Coverart".
People can debate what they think is art till they're red in the face, I honestly could not care less.Darthbawls77 said:
But is potentially antagonizing someone who's got a hand in your entire future worth the self-righteousness? It's 15% of one project we're talking here, and not even that, maybe 5-10% at the most considering I very much doubt it was a perfect project to begin with.
NOT WORTH IT!
I made a mistake like that when I was in school, I let my personal opinion get in the way of just shutting up and doing my work. It was stupid of me and I've regretted it ever since, and I had a much, much, MUCH better topic to be argumentative about than whether bloody Pokemon red is art or not. Who bloody cares, it's a video game. It's not worth starting arguments or brewing antagonism over a tiny percentage of some relatively inconsequential project. Ultimately it's only a fraction of a percentage, it might sting, but it's not a big deal at all.
Just let it pass. If the teacher gives an honest opportunity to speak your mind in private and seems open to ideas, by all means debate your point. Be courteous and succinct, give refined examples and explain your view and maybe she'll end up agreeing, maybe not. But it's not worth starting a fight over. It just isn't.
Probably the best response that could've happened in this thread. Just like any media, not all games are art, but if you can give examples and calmly debate with your teacher, go for it.crudus said:
WOW you got 85%! Best teacher ever!
I wrote an opinionative essay on 'Why is To Kill a Mockingbird considered one of Australia's best-selling and most beloved books?'...I hated the book and because it was an opinionative essay I wrote my opinion on why To Kill a Mockingbird is so successful...I thought my essay was great and the points were valid.
Anyway, I get back a 6/20 with the teacher (biggest ***** in Australia) comment saying "this essay was just your opinion and doesn't explain why it is one of Australia's most beloved books...(yada yada yada more bullshit and stuff)". It was an OPINIONATIVE essay FFS!
So to answer your question, no you shouldn't be angry at your teacher because you got 85% and even though she may disagree with you with 'games are art' the topic is still disputed between no and yes.
I believe games will eventually (in the next 10 years or so) be universally defined as an art...just not yet. Do you think film and movies were considered 'art' from day 1? Probably not.
I wrote an opinionative essay on 'Why is To Kill a Mockingbird considered one of Australia's best-selling and most beloved books?'...I hated the book and because it was an opinionative essay I wrote my opinion on why To Kill a Mockingbird is so successful...I thought my essay was great and the points were valid.
Anyway, I get back a 6/20 with the teacher (biggest ***** in Australia) comment saying "this essay was just your opinion and doesn't explain why it is one of Australia's most beloved books...(yada yada yada more bullshit and stuff)". It was an OPINIONATIVE essay FFS!
So to answer your question, no you shouldn't be angry at your teacher because you got 85% and even though she may disagree with you with 'games are art' the topic is still disputed between no and yes.
I believe games will eventually (in the next 10 years or so) be universally defined as an art...just not yet. Do you think film and movies were considered 'art' from day 1? Probably not.
Surpreme court ruled that games are considered art earlier this year. You can't deny Surpreme Court, man.Ixnay1111 said:
Pretty much this. You have to be pretty naive to think that everyone is going to agree with your perceptions of video games when even on the Escapist it's such a controversial topic.Dags90 said:
The core purpose of this assignment is to develop and polish writing skills, if I'm not mistaken. Your English teacher seems intent on you obeying her like the Nazi Gustapo, an issue I've experienced time and again. She's wrong, but she sounds like the type of bull-headed **** who thinks that they're always right because they're the teacher.
Rant: But this is the 21st century. Schools are no longer training grounds for the next batch of factory workers. That's how the system was designed at the denouement of the Industrial Revolution, and unfortunately it hasn't changed much. That's why a preparatory school is a better place for the college/university bound. (I fell somewhere in the upper-middle class, but I never understood how one could hope to go to a college, yet not have enough money to attend ANY prep school. Some of them are affordable.) Therefore, schools should be 3 tiered like they are some places (1-5, 6-9, 10-12/13), with a gradual increasing tendency toward a free-flowing, adapted timetable of classes and activities. The problem with that is, most parents just want their child out of the house because they have to work, but if your child isn't independent enough to look after themselves by age 12 (8/9th grade) then you have failed as a parent.
That is my opinion on the matter. I'm sharing it because it seems to fit here. If you feel I'm incorrect then feel free to pm me rather than take up space with quotes. If I'm incorrect factually, then quote me.
Rant: But this is the 21st century. Schools are no longer training grounds for the next batch of factory workers. That's how the system was designed at the denouement of the Industrial Revolution, and unfortunately it hasn't changed much. That's why a preparatory school is a better place for the college/university bound. (I fell somewhere in the upper-middle class, but I never understood how one could hope to go to a college, yet not have enough money to attend ANY prep school. Some of them are affordable.) Therefore, schools should be 3 tiered like they are some places (1-5, 6-9, 10-12/13), with a gradual increasing tendency toward a free-flowing, adapted timetable of classes and activities. The problem with that is, most parents just want their child out of the house because they have to work, but if your child isn't independent enough to look after themselves by age 12 (8/9th grade) then you have failed as a parent.
That is my opinion on the matter. I'm sharing it because it seems to fit here. If you feel I'm incorrect then feel free to pm me rather than take up space with quotes. If I'm incorrect factually, then quote me.
If the prompt was "artwork" and she didn't give you a list of what acceptable topics were then I really don't see how she could possibly have a case. The front of the Pokemon BOX has a drawn/rendered picture on it, which is art in its own right... the idea that many more such pictures masterfully woven together into an interactive story doesn't count is kind of insane.
Art is, by its very nature, subjective, and a video game is far from the craziest thing you could have picked. In addition, I guarantee you that this game had more of an impact on your life than any one of a hundred paintings you've seen, looked at for 15 seconds, and then forgotten about. You enjoyed this thing for HOURS, and unless you are an artist yourself or found a painting that summed up your life things don't get more significant than that.
Perhaps more to the point, you wrote this paper. For this class, and for this assignment. You wrote eloquently, on the issue she wanted you to write about... if it doesn't fit the assignment for some reason, it's at least an equivalent amount of work. Her job is to teach you to express your opinions through the written word, and you have done so, but she is marking you down because she does not approve of what affected your life? She marked you down 15 points because the art you wrote about isn't what she considers art?
You absolutely have the right to fight this. However, keep in mind that you still have to take her class, and that making her life difficult may not be worth your while. Don't burn the bridge you're standing on right now, is what I'm saying.
Art is, by its very nature, subjective, and a video game is far from the craziest thing you could have picked. In addition, I guarantee you that this game had more of an impact on your life than any one of a hundred paintings you've seen, looked at for 15 seconds, and then forgotten about. You enjoyed this thing for HOURS, and unless you are an artist yourself or found a painting that summed up your life things don't get more significant than that.
Perhaps more to the point, you wrote this paper. For this class, and for this assignment. You wrote eloquently, on the issue she wanted you to write about... if it doesn't fit the assignment for some reason, it's at least an equivalent amount of work. Her job is to teach you to express your opinions through the written word, and you have done so, but she is marking you down because she does not approve of what affected your life? She marked you down 15 points because the art you wrote about isn't what she considers art?
You absolutely have the right to fight this. However, keep in mind that you still have to take her class, and that making her life difficult may not be worth your while. Don't burn the bridge you're standing on right now, is what I'm saying.
Completely justified, sounds like the director of my old school.
The government considers videogames art and the government trumps a teacher. Hell in public schools, the government is the one who pays the schools.
You're completely in the right. Fight this one to the death.
The government considers videogames art and the government trumps a teacher. Hell in public schools, the government is the one who pays the schools.
You're completely in the right. Fight this one to the death.
Funny how i didnt touch on what he should do with his teacher and thats all your response to me really is. Remember just cause you type alot doesnt mean your really saying anything. O and Pokemon is a form of art and/or rather has forms of art in it so its not debatable till we are red in the face its a fact.The Madman said:
The National Endowment recognizes some games as arts, and that art goes into video game production.[footnote]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/19/national-endowment-for-th_n_863950.html[/footnote] Which is a fairly explicit ambiguity given by them that not all video games are art. The Escapists own article on this ruling also clearly states that this single decision does not entail a broad cultural change.[footnote]http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/109835-Games-Now-Legally-Considered-an-Art-Form-in-the-USA[/footnote]FelixG said:
The OP is egoistic for failing to account that the NEA and his own aren't the only widespread and valid positions, and failing to clarify the issue beforehand was myopic. I figured that was quite clear.
And who said I agreed with the teacher?
Well ignoring all the "it's subjective so if you think its art then its art" bullshit that this forum is so fond of it's still infact true that video games are art.
Videogames follow the basic elements of design that help shape art and thus can be considered art in the same way that movies and book can be. I assumed you would of decontructed Pokemon Red using the elements of design at least a little in your assignment (I don't seem to do anything but that in my Art theory) so you would of shown justification for why it's got artistic merit.
Seems she's just a bint with her head up her arse or you didn't explain it well enough. In neither cases are you in the wrong.
Videogames follow the basic elements of design that help shape art and thus can be considered art in the same way that movies and book can be. I assumed you would of decontructed Pokemon Red using the elements of design at least a little in your assignment (I don't seem to do anything but that in my Art theory) so you would of shown justification for why it's got artistic merit.
Seems she's just a bint with her head up her arse or you didn't explain it well enough. In neither cases are you in the wrong.