Poll: American?s disillusion with WW2
- Thread starter Battenbergcake
- Start date
Recommended Videos
America has alot of dillusions. According to every Call of Duty and Medal of Honor game, Americans single handedly won every battle ever fought. The Soviets where the ones who won the war, if Germany hadnt turned on them they wouldnt have even come close to losing. Americans helped out, but if masses of German troops wernt being beaten back by the Russians we wouldnt have gotten far at all into France
This does have the underpinnings of an American hate thread, what with the gross generalization and all. Yet, I can see the OP's motivation behind the thread (or I think I do, at least).
Disclaimer, I'm an American and used to be in the military. I also run in several circles, a large portion of the people in those circles don't have any advanced schooling, relying mostly on what public education can bestow and what movies have undoubtedly re-focused.
I do believe that Americans' opinion of their influence, or more importantly the downplaying of other countries' sacrifices, is exaggerated. Yes, the US was a huge influence in terms of resources and manpower, and I wonder if the Russians would have been able to win a war fought on two large fronts (Germans and Japanese). The Russians were able to kick a ton of ass, but only because the average Russian soldier was as afraid of their own government as they were of the German soldiers. I'm postulating here, but I don't think the Russians could have continued the huge losses indefinitely when coupled with the fear of their own superiors.
Likewise, the French and Brits are often depicted as being rolled over by the Germans. Yes, they were fought off mainland Europe, but they never stopped resisting and fighting in one form or another.
I personally hate the image given to the French soldiers. Any soldier, with the proper leadership, can kick ass. The major problem with the French army, especially around the time of the German invasion, was an abundance of incapable leadership. The fact that the French Resistance never stopped fighting cements in my mind, the steadfastness and undying rebellion that is not only the French people, but of any people who are invaded. History has taught us that any people, when invaded and oppressed, will continue to struggle, no matter the cost.
In general, I think the OP's message was lost in generalizing all Americans as uneducated or without world view.
Disclaimer, I'm an American and used to be in the military. I also run in several circles, a large portion of the people in those circles don't have any advanced schooling, relying mostly on what public education can bestow and what movies have undoubtedly re-focused.
I do believe that Americans' opinion of their influence, or more importantly the downplaying of other countries' sacrifices, is exaggerated. Yes, the US was a huge influence in terms of resources and manpower, and I wonder if the Russians would have been able to win a war fought on two large fronts (Germans and Japanese). The Russians were able to kick a ton of ass, but only because the average Russian soldier was as afraid of their own government as they were of the German soldiers. I'm postulating here, but I don't think the Russians could have continued the huge losses indefinitely when coupled with the fear of their own superiors.
Likewise, the French and Brits are often depicted as being rolled over by the Germans. Yes, they were fought off mainland Europe, but they never stopped resisting and fighting in one form or another.
I personally hate the image given to the French soldiers. Any soldier, with the proper leadership, can kick ass. The major problem with the French army, especially around the time of the German invasion, was an abundance of incapable leadership. The fact that the French Resistance never stopped fighting cements in my mind, the steadfastness and undying rebellion that is not only the French people, but of any people who are invaded. History has taught us that any people, when invaded and oppressed, will continue to struggle, no matter the cost.
In general, I think the OP's message was lost in generalizing all Americans as uneducated or without world view.
To all those interested in england, there is a great docmentry on 4od called apocalypse ww2 (or something similar) which is very informative on the russian side of things. Also, the've digitally coloured in all the black and white footage which somehow makes have a lot more of an impact.
Actually they would eventually take on Russia instead preventing them from using their troops on the Asian front to bear against Hitler.Judgement101 said:
In the Pacific maybe, but Japan would be too pre-occupied with Russia.
The Japanese had an equivalent to Project Manhattan but they abandoned it. Besides the Manhattan Project was also being worked on woth the british so they would have transferred the research to the UK if the US was attacked.
It would make a good premise for a Game. What if Italy assisted the conquest of britain instead of going into North Africa?
Actually, when the French Government surrendered it absolved most Frenchmen of their responsibility to fight. As a result they mostly gave up. The French Resistance was hardly a mass movement, and really only gains credit because France is more 'western' and therefore we are exposed to it, and the stories from other countries are not known about.PoliceBox63 said:
If you want to see real resistance see the fighting in Greece and in Poland. The Polish never surrendered!
I agree, to a point. every war game set in WW2 I have played starts at d-day (06/06/1944) now the war had been going on for 6 YEARS! prior to this, where's the events of these years? did we twiddle our thumbs waiting for the super hero americans to arrive?
now this is not a complaint at the real events, its a complaint at the games industry selling to the large American market. there are probably more people in America who buy the games than the entire population of the UK. The industry seems to think the gamers will not care if they aren't playing as the winning side (i.e Americans).
now this is not a complaint at the real events, its a complaint at the games industry selling to the large American market. there are probably more people in America who buy the games than the entire population of the UK. The industry seems to think the gamers will not care if they aren't playing as the winning side (i.e Americans).
True. The Russians sustained a ridiculously higher number of casualties than did the British, French, and English COMBINED. And on top of that, it was during an invasion of Russian troops into Hitler's private bunker that he killed himself, effectively ending the war. There are parts of Russia that are STILL suffering as a result of their losses in that war.10zack986 said:
And by every call of duty game, you mean none of them? COD1, you play as Brits, Americans and Russians. COD2, I think it's the same thing. COD3 sucked, so let's not discuss it. COD4, main American character dies, play as a Brit for the rest of the game. WAW, russians. MW2, Brits.ninja51 said:
The truth of the matter is, That while The United States was instrumental in beating the Germans in WWII, we served more as a distraction to keep Germany fighting on two fronts, while most of the heavy lifting was done by the Soviets.
Not to make light of American involvement. Had we not intervened, Britain would have been fighting alone on the western front and wouldn't have lasted very much longer. This would have allowed Germany to focus all of it's forces on the invasion of the USSR.
Not to make light of American involvement. Had we not intervened, Britain would have been fighting alone on the western front and wouldn't have lasted very much longer. This would have allowed Germany to focus all of it's forces on the invasion of the USSR.
Even though just a thought, would have NEVER happened.Judgement101 said:
EDIT: I wish that in COD games we would be able to play as the Japs and/or Nazis. But that would be "insensitive" or "politically incorrect"
are you sure your not talking about ww1 with the french? also, it was clearly the Russians who fought the hardest.Battenbergcake said:
