Poll: Best War Leader

[emeraldrafael]

I would say Lincoln was a great war leader (you know, whole commander in chief thing), considering everything.

Other then that... the guy that was the main naval head of World War 2 for the Americans (I know, thats really sad I dont know his name and I'm American). Considering he was up against Japan with little and managed to turn that all around, its rather impressive.

I'd also throw my hat in for Joan of Arc since she was a chick (in a time where if you had any success as a girl, you were thought to be a witch), cause of what she was able to accomplish.

And of course General Robert E. Lee. Cant talk about great war leaders/heros without him raising his Southern Gentlemanly Head.

 

[mikespoff]

Mine answer would have to be.....Stone Wall Jackson! The greatest military general in United States history!

That's a pretty tiny subset of the possible options, though. Don't limit yourself to the US - that way you can include some real military superstars...

 

[Valkaris]

Me, in Rome Total War.

Seriously though, Napolion is somewhat overrated, his decision to invade Russia was a disaster repeated many times in history, but never by a commander as great as he.

Perhaps Tecumseh, overlook by many he was a superb commander and tactician.

 

[Alon Shechter]

'Nuff said.

 

[MrLumber]

Topic picks in random order;

Hannibal the Great of Carthage
Julius Caesar of Rome
Chairman Mao Zedong of China

 

[BlumiereBleck]

Mine answer would have to be.....Stone Wall Jackson! The greatest military general in United States history!

That's a pretty tiny subset of the possible options, though. Don't limit yourself to the US - that way you can include some real military superstars...

HE is the best of the best, actually Hitler might have been a bit better.

 

[ilion]

I go with Alexander the Great, Scipio Africanus, Hannibal, Cyrus the Great, Tokugawa Ieyasu, Genghis Khan, Sun Tzu ( the book is very simple, and with much mature military and political wisdom), Saladin, Napoleon, Erwin Rommel, Georgy Zhukov. and others

 

[Dr Snakeman]

So all it boils down to is: Bernard Montgomery was a fucking twat. (I will qualify that opinion on request.)

Could you, please?

Anyway, my uneducated vote goes to Feldmarschell Erwin Rommel.

Yeah, as far as I know, Montgomery was a badass; I don't really see how he's deserving of such an insult. And as for the Fieldmarshal, he was probably history's coolest Nazi.

Hmmm...

Who are we missing?

Oh, yes... Gen. George S. Patton. Ol' Blood and Guts was the textbook definition of "crazy bastard". Really, the entire north African campaign in WWII was full of awesome people. Between Patton, Rommel, and Montgomery, it's a miracle the whole region didn't explode due to volatile amounts of coolness.

First that comes to mind would be Admiral Ackbar, I mean after all he saw that the rebel alliance was about to enter a trap.

I've gotta say, he takes the cake. If it weren't for the admiral, the internet would be devoid of one of its most precious memes.

 

[Boba Frag]

Now, recently, I came across a military forum that ran a poll of the best war leaders in history. I quickly perused it to see what they went for: number one was Alexander the Great. I was like... OK: tactician, one of the best; strategist, could've been better; statesman, uh, well not particularly good; administrator, absolute shit. So I shrugged and continued down the list, that was, until I reached number five: Otto von Bismarck?!

*rant time* 'He wasn't a war leader, you ponces!' was my first thought, for the simple reason that he was merely a very clever and opportunistic trouble maker (and that's supposed to be a compliment, by the way). He wasn't a soldier (that was Albrecht von Roon), he wasn't a leader (that was Wilhelm I/Kronprinz Friedrich/Prinz Friedrich Karl/Herwarth von Bittenfeld - apologies, I've got the Austro-Prussian War in my head at the moment), he wasn't a strategist (that was the awesomeness that was Helmuth von Moltke Sr) and he wasn't a tactician (again, nod to von Moltke Sr). So WTF (for about ten minutes). *rant time over*

So all it boils down to is: Bernard Montgomery was a fucking twat. (I will qualify that opinion on request.)

BTW: you may have gathered from this and other posts that as far as grand history is concerned, I am a Teutonophile (go Friedrich der Grosse!) so please don't hold that against me!

Discuss as you see appropriate... (i.e. basically pick at anything I said...)

If memory serves... Frederick ran away from his first battle, which he had lost.

And Bismarck was the power behind the throne of Wilhelm I- the unification of Germany would not have been possible without Bismarck, nor would France have burned for revenge if Bismarck's advice not to march down the Champs Elysee had been heeded after the Franco-Prussian war.

Bismarck was far more than a military leader could ever aspire to- his Realpolitick catapulted Germany into becoming the dominant force in European power politics in the late 19th century. His careful balancing of the powers in Europe and his achievements were squandered by Wilhelm II's rabid militarism, though to be fair, France, Britain, Austria-Hungary and Russia are all guilty of dragging Europe into the horrors of the First World War.

But I totally agree with you about Monty. Horrendously pompous and difficult to work with, arrogant and possibly qualifying as a war criminal considering his involvement in the brutal oppression the British Army orchestrated in Ireland during the Irish War of Independence.

The Western allies lacked the strategic foresight and tactical genius the Wehrmacht displayed time and time again on the battle field. The brilliance displayed by the Red Army's Zhukov on the eastern front makes Eisenhower, though revered by his own people in his time, Patton and the like pale in comparison.

 

[Dr Snakeman]

Mine answer would have to be.....Stone Wall Jackson! The greatest military general in United States history!

That's a pretty tiny subset of the possible options, though. Don't limit yourself to the US - that way you can include some real military superstars...

HE is the best of the best, actually Hitler might have been a bit better.

Actually, Hitler was a moron. Germany had some of the best military minds, the best equipment, and the finest soldiers in the world. However, due to "Der Fuhrer's" gross incompetence as a leader, and his insistence that he be the final authority on military strategy, the German army made all kinds of mistakes. Hitler's only strength was as an orator; he got an entire nation to follow a genocidal failed artist who had no idea what he was doing.

And while Jackson was pretty cool, my vote has to go to his boss: Gen. Robert E. Lee. Intensely patriotic, a brilliant military mind, and beloved by his men. He made exactly one mistake during the Civil War, and it's called Gettysburg; when he screwed up, he did so magnificently. Possibly the best commander in U.S. history, and he wasn't even fighting for the United States.

 

[Boba Frag]

I would say Lincoln was a great war leader (you know, whole commander in chief thing), considering everything.

Other then that... the guy that was the main naval head of World War 2 for the Americans (I know, thats really sad I dont know his name and I'm American). Considering he was up against Japan with little and managed to turn that all around, its rather impressive.

I'd also throw my hat in for Joan of Arc since she was a chick (in a time where if you had any success as a girl, you were thought to be a witch), cause of what she was able to accomplish.

And of course General Robert E. Lee. Cant talk about great war leaders/heros without him raising his Southern Gentlemanly Head.

The overall head of the Pacific theater of operations was General Douglas MacArthur, though I'm afraid I don't the US Navy's commander either!

 

[Eldarion]

Alexander the great is my personal favorite.

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

Spoiler: Best commander

Horatio Nelson.

Trafalgar. Brilliant, inspiring and fucking braver than any admiral after his time.

Spoiler: Best war leader

Genghis Khan

Don't mess with steppe people. They'll fuck you up.

 

[Kryzantine]

The best war leaders in history?

Well, Gaius Marius simply has to be up there. He reformed the army to save Rome, paving the way for an empire in the process, and was elected consul 7 times. He wasn't much of a peacetime leader, but then he didn't need to be. War was his friend.

Genghis Khan, I would have to nominate. All the complaints that he couldn't rule his areas are simply absurd. He didn't have to. There was no point in doing so. The Mongols, an inherently nomadic people, could not spread their culture to sedentary areas. All Genghis Khan did was bring about an age of prosperity for Asia, by destroying the bandits plaguing the Silk Road and preventing conflict between regions.

One of the most unknown military leaders was Sonni Ali. You'd have to look him up to know that he ruled over the Songhai, and he captured Timbuktu and Djenne. He also stabilized the empire. A river police force and acceptance of both Islam and local animist traditions lent a ton of credibility to the Songhai as the major West African rulers.

 

[TheRundownRabbit]

Whats wrong with you people?

It's Sun Tzu

He invented war, most modern and historical military personnel study and use his techniques.
Its called The Art of War, look it up

 

[moose_man]

SUN TZU.

He wrote the Art of War, that immediately puts him high in my books.

 

[Carlston]

Church Hill. Man who won ww2

Churchill, 'nuff said

Churchill was a politician during World War II. In World War 1 as an Admiral he fucked up nearly everything he touched. His awful ability to adapt to change during the Dardanelles campaign lead to him being stripped of his position and put on the front lines, and to thousands upon thousands of needless deaths. He also poorly mapped the Middle East and was responsible for a huge portion of conflict there. The man had great spirit and created moral during World War 2, but that's about it.

And honestly that is what was needed at the time. A time when just need one crotchity old bastard to stand up to Hitler. And last I checked he wasn't the only chap mapping the middle east.

He had his limited but very specific purpose in life and he managed that far better than the other parts of his life.

 

[Carlston]

Church Hill. Man who won ww2

That's a tad myopic, there. WW2 involved an awful lot of the entire world, you can't give credit to any one person.


True but if you look at the time lines, it was his delaying Hitler that kept German from doing exactly what it wanted, and gave enough time for the rest of the world to grow some balls and pick a side. But that is how I view it from what I studied in military history.