I think a year or two long "basic training" and get a 10-20 round rifle once completed, unless they decide to join an active military; but I wouldn't want this done with any country right now (save maybe the Scandinavian countries).
Poll: Do you support compulsory military service?
- Thread starter awesomeClaw
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Im not good at explaining such complex concepts, especially since English is not my native language.Togs said:
So I will recommend you book called "Rescue Plan for Planet Earth: Democratic World Government through a Global Referendum" by Jim Stark. It should answer all your questions.
Speaking as a former Naval Officer (LT), this is a terrible idea. Today's military needs motivated, sharp candidates, not someone "just doing their time". That said, I think a few years of service is a great start on life-- but you should do it voluntarily.
This is actually a very good argument.Karma168 said:
I was pretty neutral about the subject before entering this thread, but you raised some interesting points.
After all, the US got out of the Great Depression mainly because of WWII. Mandatory military service COULD help out our current economic and high-unemployment situation. The problem is legality and morality, etc etc. It's funny how much complicated the law grows as civilization progresses.
The US Army would never take me anyway (hemophilia) so I've never worried about it. Hurray for genetic disorders?
Yeah i think the biggest problem in the US is that people still remember the draft for Vietnam; forcing people to go off into a deadly shitstorm to fight for something most people don't agree with just doesn't sit right.Cheery Lunatic said:
That's why i mentioned the non frontline posts, since most NATO countries have peacekeeping forces dotted around the globe this makes an ideal place to send NS troops to serve as there's not the high danger factor associated with active warzones. As long as a rule was in place that meant that NS troops couldn't be forced to serve in active theatres (they could still volunteer) then i think most people would agree to national service being implemented.
Never, in any case. Then again I'm strongly against any sort of killing. I think it says volumes of our culture that it's still around. Sure, if people wish to attend, be my guest. But force it on me and I'll fight it.
Besides I don't see the whole point of serving your country of birth. It is law that they serve us, not the other way around. I don't feel any duty towards my country of birth. I could have easily been born anywhere else.
(Besides Irelands is in a pretty bad way. That and it's St.Patrick's day, so it's pretty damned hellish over here.)
Besides I don't see the whole point of serving your country of birth. It is law that they serve us, not the other way around. I don't feel any duty towards my country of birth. I could have easily been born anywhere else.
(Besides Irelands is in a pretty bad way. That and it's St.Patrick's day, so it's pretty damned hellish over here.)
A state shouldn't force someone into military service "for there own good", like how a state shouldn't force people to eat five portions of fruit and vege a day and jog round the block once a week. The state has no right in regulating individual social behavior unless such behavior could or does harm others.
Most of the arguments for conscription are "for your own good" arguments, and for the reasons above i don't buy them. I am glad that i don't live in a country which practices conscription. I am an educated law-abiding individual like millions of other young adults- i don't need to learn "discipline" or become a "more rounded individual" and i already have life skills through education. Why should i sacrifice two years of my life for the sake of other people who are not like me?
Most of the arguments for conscription are "for your own good" arguments, and for the reasons above i don't buy them. I am glad that i don't live in a country which practices conscription. I am an educated law-abiding individual like millions of other young adults- i don't need to learn "discipline" or become a "more rounded individual" and i already have life skills through education. Why should i sacrifice two years of my life for the sake of other people who are not like me?
I chose "Other", not because I feel that it's wrong, but because that it depends on the country. I'm an American living in Singapore, and Singapore has CMS for all males, except those who go off to university in other countries, and I think that it makes sense to do that. It has to do with the size of the pool that you have to draw from. When Singapore's CMS gets the forms, they send the ones who are physically able to the military, while others are sent to things like Immigration, the Postal Service, and stuff like that. Singapore HAS to do that to maintain a military of any size (respective to the size of the island), because they have a much smaller group of people, and now even a fraction of them would sign up if they didn't have to.
No. CMS is basically a prison sentence for those who have committed no crime. If you want to join the military, you do it voluntarily. No man who wishes to avoid serving should ever be forced to, period.
I don't give a damn if Hitler's ghost has come back with an army of zombies to kill everyone. It is NEVER okay to force someone to serve when they do not want to do so by their own free will.
Then again, I am opposed to all military action of any kind except directly defending yourself when you are attacked. If we are invaded, I'd probably join up, or at least sit on the front porch with a rifle. Otherwise, I wouldn't so much as look at the military for any reason.
If there is ever a draft, or a non-wartime form of conscription is ever instated in my country, I will not serve. If they send men to my place of residence to force me to go, I will not answer the door for them. If they break it down to try and take me, I will treat them like any other intruder- I will defend myself, with lethal force if needed. That is the extent to which I oppose any form of conscription.
I don't give a damn if Hitler's ghost has come back with an army of zombies to kill everyone. It is NEVER okay to force someone to serve when they do not want to do so by their own free will.
Then again, I am opposed to all military action of any kind except directly defending yourself when you are attacked. If we are invaded, I'd probably join up, or at least sit on the front porch with a rifle. Otherwise, I wouldn't so much as look at the military for any reason.
If there is ever a draft, or a non-wartime form of conscription is ever instated in my country, I will not serve. If they send men to my place of residence to force me to go, I will not answer the door for them. If they break it down to try and take me, I will treat them like any other intruder- I will defend myself, with lethal force if needed. That is the extent to which I oppose any form of conscription.
I don't think regular army conscription is a good idea, it should be made up of the volunteers to keep it professional.
However, having people serve in reservist armies would be a good idea. The TA in the UK for example, basically gives you weekend training and you only get deployed for about 30 days. It is still a voluntary service, but it would be good if everyone got a chance to learn these essential basic skills.
However, having people serve in reservist armies would be a good idea. The TA in the UK for example, basically gives you weekend training and you only get deployed for about 30 days. It is still a voluntary service, but it would be good if everyone got a chance to learn these essential basic skills.
My country practices conscription, in which all males above 18 have to serve in the military for a period of two years called National Service. I can tell you that i am STRONGLY against conscription. Why?
a) Its a goddamn waste of time. You learn little or no skills that are relevant to your studies or career. In fact, you probably grow out of touch with your studies and come out of national service at a disadvantage to females who pursue a higher level of education during the 2 years. I am serving in the Navy as a clerk for medical reasons and already, i feel like i have forgotten everything i have learnt in school.
b) No pay. Seriously. They force you to serve for 2 years with no pay. Instead they give you an 'allowance' I am currently given the equivalent of 382.65 US dollars per month. Others in combat roles earn about 500 per month. The pathetic amount of money they give is easily surpassed by just about any job in existence.
c) Risk. By conscripting people into military service, you put them in unnecessary risk. I have lost count of the number of friends in service that have had old injuries aggravated into permanent disabilities or have sustained new ones that will affect them through out their lives. Deaths due to training are not uncommon in my country either. They just go unreported.
Conscription is a foolish concept. How do you ensure the loyalty and dedication of one who is forced to fight? How is one to feel proud of their vocation or their country when they earn less than a roadside sweeper?
a) Its a goddamn waste of time. You learn little or no skills that are relevant to your studies or career. In fact, you probably grow out of touch with your studies and come out of national service at a disadvantage to females who pursue a higher level of education during the 2 years. I am serving in the Navy as a clerk for medical reasons and already, i feel like i have forgotten everything i have learnt in school.
b) No pay. Seriously. They force you to serve for 2 years with no pay. Instead they give you an 'allowance' I am currently given the equivalent of 382.65 US dollars per month. Others in combat roles earn about 500 per month. The pathetic amount of money they give is easily surpassed by just about any job in existence.
c) Risk. By conscripting people into military service, you put them in unnecessary risk. I have lost count of the number of friends in service that have had old injuries aggravated into permanent disabilities or have sustained new ones that will affect them through out their lives. Deaths due to training are not uncommon in my country either. They just go unreported.
Conscription is a foolish concept. How do you ensure the loyalty and dedication of one who is forced to fight? How is one to feel proud of their vocation or their country when they earn less than a roadside sweeper?
For repeat youth offenders yes, like we are trying out here in New Zealand.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1010/S00228/military-activity-camps-for-youth-offenders.htm
http://www.army.mil.nz/at-a-glance/news/army-news/407/nzdfptdydp.htm
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1010/S00228/military-activity-camps-for-youth-offenders.htm
http://www.army.mil.nz/at-a-glance/news/army-news/407/nzdfptdydp.htm
Agreed. Where I live, in the UK, there's a culture of "don't get a job, just live off benefits", partly because the welfare system is so easy to milk you can make more money than a low-end job.benzooka said:
As I see things- and others will undoubtedly disagree- If they don't want to get a job and want to just leech off society, by all means give them something to do, either in the armed forces of in some civilian application. So I'd say yes to conscription, but give them a choice of an available career first.
Sounds absolutely horrible. Was there no way to avoid getting drafted? Something like a health problem or something like that? Hell, maybe even bribe a doctor to find something just enough to get you out of it?Leviathansteak said: