"Greed is the inventor of injustice as well as the current enforcer."
-Julian Casablancas
It's not one side in particular. It's both.
-Julian Casablancas
It's not one side in particular. It's both.
Poll: If you've ever downloaded something illegally, YOU are to blame for SOPA/PIPA.
- Thread starter Kolby Jack
- Start date
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Would it still be consider pirating to download something you already own.
Example:
You own a cd but the cd is setup to run something else when inserted into the computer (let's say a video)which prevent you from being able to get the songs off it so you download them from some filesharing site.
Example:
You own a cd but the cd is setup to run something else when inserted into the computer (let's say a video)which prevent you from being able to get the songs off it so you download them from some filesharing site.
Those are your words and I agreed with them!SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
But I think they defeat your argument.
Yeah, you can annoy people wanting to look stuff up. Maybe hurt a few sources who knows embarrassing stuff. But it can't smother the truth from coming up. It's not an immediate silence button. There are a few loop you need to jump through to get things done, and you have to give a small amount of time to the "target" to correct himself.
I just don't believe that SOPA is a tool for political censorship for the simple reason I don't see it being efficient. Imagine SOPA was active. Would it have stopped the things you mention from happening? No.
If piracy didn't exist, there would be no anti-piracy laws. That's blatantly obvious and not worthy of a topic.
Are the likes of SOPA, PIPA and ACTA understandable or even remotely justifiable due to this cause and effect scenario? Not in the slightest.
Hey! You downloaded Lady Gaga! I hope you liked it because now we're going to censor the web giving corporations free roam to shut down who they want to "investigate" whenever they want with zero consequence and without evidence!
SOUNDS LIKE CAUSE AND EFFECT TO ME!
Are the likes of SOPA, PIPA and ACTA understandable or even remotely justifiable due to this cause and effect scenario? Not in the slightest.
Hey! You downloaded Lady Gaga! I hope you liked it because now we're going to censor the web giving corporations free roam to shut down who they want to "investigate" whenever they want with zero consequence and without evidence!
SOUNDS LIKE CAUSE AND EFFECT TO ME!
Saying that "We wouldn't have SOPA if piracy didn't exist" is a bit like saying "We would haven't a police state if crime didn't exist."
Not only is it an example of a solution to a problem being so overreaching and all-encompassing that it becomes a problem in itself, but it is also a completely pointless statement because you cannot ever have a world in which there is no crime. So, to speculate on what would or would not be true in such a fictional universe is simply a hypothetical question with no real answer.
Similarly, piracy will always exist, and even if global communications had developed in some other major way (other than the internet as we know it today), piracy would always have existed in some form in any other iteration of technological development. Saying that piracy is to blame for SOPA is meaningless, since you'll just as soon get a world without piracy as you'll get a world without murder.
It's all a red herring, anyway, because the people to blame for SOPA are the ones who authored it, the lawmakers who supported it, and the companies and organizations that endorsed it. No one else is to blame. Pirates are not to blame for poorly written laws.
Not only is it an example of a solution to a problem being so overreaching and all-encompassing that it becomes a problem in itself, but it is also a completely pointless statement because you cannot ever have a world in which there is no crime. So, to speculate on what would or would not be true in such a fictional universe is simply a hypothetical question with no real answer.
Similarly, piracy will always exist, and even if global communications had developed in some other major way (other than the internet as we know it today), piracy would always have existed in some form in any other iteration of technological development. Saying that piracy is to blame for SOPA is meaningless, since you'll just as soon get a world without piracy as you'll get a world without murder.
It's all a red herring, anyway, because the people to blame for SOPA are the ones who authored it, the lawmakers who supported it, and the companies and organizations that endorsed it. No one else is to blame. Pirates are not to blame for poorly written laws.
Pretty much this. Although at this point, so many people pirate, YOU pirating as an individual has about the same effect as an individual voting for public offices.Phlakes said:
No, the reason SOPA/PIPA exist is because a few politicians and entertainment executives doesn't understand how the Internet works and that historical precedent has already proven that these "War Against Entertainment" scares never pan out to them not making money. All the places where piracy and copyright infringement exist have been around for quite a while now, and yet the entertainment industry has remained stable. Even despite the recession. The music industry has had a steady increase in revenue even. And as for "ANYONE WHO HAS EVER PIRATED" that's inaccurate as well, since the bill also targets those who simply VIEW material on things like YouTube, let alone post them. That isn't piracy and in many cases isn't even copyright protected. And it wouldn't be difficult for these companies to disclude that type of "infringement".
All they want is to limit access to creative materials as much as possible, to force people to pay ungodly amounts of money for materials that, unlike other things, you have to pay $20 for then find out it wasn't worth it. You can't get a refund on an MP3 because it's bad. Sometimes you can get a refund for seeing a bad movie at the theater, but that is typically only if several people are demanding refunds and that effects the theater more than the production company. Piracy on a large scale, meaning downloading and selling for personal profit, is bad, because when it comes to creative works THAT is real theft. Piracy for personal use happens for a number of reasons. Some people lose a CD, and download to avoid repurchasing. Some people want to see a movie before they buy a copy. When it comes to software, it's usually a matter of keeping up with the price of constantly updated software (not games, things like Photoshop which comes up with a new product every year and always upwards of $200) which many people need for their jobs.
So maybe the issue is piracy. But if we're going down THAT slippery slope, piracy wouldn't be a huge issue if the entertainment industry didn't take advantage of the complications of creative property in the modern age.
All they want is to limit access to creative materials as much as possible, to force people to pay ungodly amounts of money for materials that, unlike other things, you have to pay $20 for then find out it wasn't worth it. You can't get a refund on an MP3 because it's bad. Sometimes you can get a refund for seeing a bad movie at the theater, but that is typically only if several people are demanding refunds and that effects the theater more than the production company. Piracy on a large scale, meaning downloading and selling for personal profit, is bad, because when it comes to creative works THAT is real theft. Piracy for personal use happens for a number of reasons. Some people lose a CD, and download to avoid repurchasing. Some people want to see a movie before they buy a copy. When it comes to software, it's usually a matter of keeping up with the price of constantly updated software (not games, things like Photoshop which comes up with a new product every year and always upwards of $200) which many people need for their jobs.
So maybe the issue is piracy. But if we're going down THAT slippery slope, piracy wouldn't be a huge issue if the entertainment industry didn't take advantage of the complications of creative property in the modern age.
Weird Al himself said not to download that song. WHY DIDN'T YOU LISTEN?!Regnes said:
OT: Kinda have to agree. If so many people didn't pirate we probably wouldn't be in this kind of situation.
EDIT: Of course the dumb people in our government aren't exactly helping either.
I don't really get what you're saying. I mean obviously pirates would bring about anti-piracy laws. Like how littering calls for anti-littering laws.
Though if you're implying that pirates are causing ludicrous legislation, then I don't follow you.
If the penalty for littering was death, I wouldn't blame litterers.
Though if you're implying that pirates are causing ludicrous legislation, then I don't follow you.
If the penalty for littering was death, I wouldn't blame litterers.
People can wah all they want but it is the majority of people who pirate, not the minority. I know the Escapist is full of pretentious people who lie about never having downloaded a song, but everyone pirates, even baby boomers, all around the world.
Companies need to adapt to fix the problem, telling people to stop downloading wont do anything.
Companies need to adapt to fix the problem, telling people to stop downloading wont do anything.
Since most money a movie or even a piece of music makes are usually from the first 3 or so weeks from release, the amount of money publishers and the like lose is insubstantial IMO. I may be wrong about this since I don't know how the sistem really works. I pirate games only when they are too old to find on the shelves or a movie when I have already seen it or rented it to see it once.
You cannot have a statement such broad as 'you pirated, SOPA is your fault' because you simply cannot put yourself to everyone's shoes, this including people who are gonna lose their jobs because of SOPA and not piracy and of individuals that have pirated because they simply lack the resources to cough up 25 bucks per movie with all the price increases due to the economical crisis plus the 3D Mcguffin.
If they have made gaming and movies that much of a fucking luxury but at the same time forced them to be part of our culture, they better start bashing their heads against the wall cause they only have themselves to blame.
You can't blame pirates for the fact that the law that was made to oppose them was made by people who completely generilzed it and was put to be approved by politicians who don't even know what a proxy is.
You cannot have a statement such broad as 'you pirated, SOPA is your fault' because you simply cannot put yourself to everyone's shoes, this including people who are gonna lose their jobs because of SOPA and not piracy and of individuals that have pirated because they simply lack the resources to cough up 25 bucks per movie with all the price increases due to the economical crisis plus the 3D Mcguffin.
If they have made gaming and movies that much of a fucking luxury but at the same time forced them to be part of our culture, they better start bashing their heads against the wall cause they only have themselves to blame.
You can't blame pirates for the fact that the law that was made to oppose them was made by people who completely generilzed it and was put to be approved by politicians who don't even know what a proxy is.
Lots of people completely missing the point here.
The question is NOT "Is SOPA justified?"
It's not, we all agree on that. The question is "Is piracy the reason SOPA was created?"
Yes, it is.
The question is NOT "Is SOPA justified?"
It's not, we all agree on that. The question is "Is piracy the reason SOPA was created?"
Yes, it is.
SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
agreed, piracy is just the issue they are using to scapegoat further control/corporate greed onto the internet. this isn't even mentioning all the gray areas that are involved on downloading things, there are tons of times where i have downloaded items in the past because my legitimate copy had become corrupt or the company no longer existed and the item couldn't be found.
Nope. It's the fault of Cnet, CNBC, and many other larger companies that sponsored Limewire, taught people how to pirate, how to find these things then sued them.
SOPA/PIPA/ACTA aren't about stopping piracy, they're about corporations wanting to control the internet. Nothing more, nothing less.
So would these bills exist without piracy? Yes, they would. They'd simply have another name. Like that child pornography bill.
So would these bills exist without piracy? Yes, they would. They'd simply have another name. Like that child pornography bill.