Poll: Is abortion murder?

[zehydra]

I personally think it is murder. Lumps of flesh don't have ears and eyes, and they don't swallow and have the ability to kick you while in the womb.

yeah I pretty much have to agree with you here. Once it reaches a certain stage, there is little difference between a sleeping baby and a fetus.

 

[ShadowKatt]

Is it cold? Yes. Is it cruel? Well, I don't know. We certainly wouldn't put an animal through all that, and why do we spare the animal and make the human suffer?(And to be honest, isn't this side tracking from the topic?)

Certainly not, its a delving into your humanity. To see why you hold such a cold, utilitarian approach to living.

I can fully understand the stone cold machinery of your logic. And why, ultimately, its the best policy. But my evolutionarily developed compassion distorts my take on the situation; and makes me feel terrible bad for you.

I think sometimes compassion requires you to put your feelings aside and do what you don't want to for the betterment of another, and if that includes ending them to spare them a lifetime of hardship they can never overcome, then it's what needs to be done.

Cold, yes. Utiitarian, you better believe it. I'm proud to be one. When I get dress, I walk out the door with all the tools I need to survive should I end up somewhere and can't get home. I also think it gives me a different perspective. And don't feel bad for me, I certainly don't. Compassion is a wonderful thing, and a terrible vice that can lead to both great pleasure and terrible pain.

 

[Oomii]

No, it isn't consciences, just a bunch of cells.

 

[RMcD94]

100% yes.

Just as living is murder. (Cells die in your body all the time)

tl;dr

Any cell is alive. Yes.

tl;didread

However, I don't want to vote yes, because that'll seem like I'm against abortions, which I'm not. I'm pro brutally slaughtering the cells up until the umbilical cord is cut (that's right, even at 9 months outside the mother). Then that's murder too. But for some reason that's unlawful murder.

Let's just say I'm for abortions before I get into killing independent multicellular organisms.

 

[soapyshooter]

Technically, it's not alive, so no.

How is it now alive? Did you know that by week 4 the baby already has a heart and a circulatory system? And the heart starts beating by week 5?

If it was taken out of the mother it would die. So technically it isn't human or anything viable for that matter. It is not murder. Once the baby can survive outside of the mother it becomes illegal to abort or kill because that point it does become murder.

 

[Loop Stricken]

Lump of cells. Rip it out as one would a cancer.

Edit: Amusingly the poll results look like a penis.

 

[ShadowKatt]

Until it becomes sentient I don't class it as a human. It is most definetely not murder in my opinion.

I've heard several people throw around the term sentience, and I'm not picking on you, just using you as an example. But we don't have a clear cut definition for sentience. As of yet it is a purely philosophical entity, open to interpretation of the person at the moment. You can't base an arguement on an ever changing basis of evalutation.

 

[Elephant Walker19]

i think a abortion is ok IF the woman was raped so she won't have a child to look at and remember that time.

ITS NOT RIGHT FOR A WOMAN WHO GOES CLUBING EVERY DAY TO FUCK EVERY MAN IN PLAIN SIGHT TO GET ONE JUST BECAUSE SHE IS A IRRESPONSIBLE WHORE,WHO WON'T FACE THE CONSEQUENCES OF HER ACTIONS.

So you'd punish the child by allowing it to be born to an irresponsible mother?

1.she can put it up for adoption

2.killing it is more punishment

yes i've considered that the child might turn out its mom or learn the mistakes of living like its mom like i did and be a better man/woman for it.

 

[RMcD94]

Lump of cells. Rip it out as one would a cancer.

Edit: Amusingly the poll results look like a penis.

I voted simply to see if it did. (See: my last post) Voted no simply because I'm for legalising abortion.

 

[Felated Show Pony]

Technically, it's not alive, so no.

How is it now alive? Did you know that by week 4 the baby already has a heart and a circulatory system?

Yes, but it's not "complete." Also, some could probably get an abortion before week 4.

But that's not the point, the point is that it is a person in development. As for the argument made before about putting animals down. They're animals. Not people. There is a HUGE difference. A fetus is a person in the making.

honestly, this is the biggest problem with christians. they have a completely naive belief in the importance of human beings. humans are animals. you are not different, you are not fucking special, you are not a magic star child.

and by your own reckoning, differing definitions of life make this argument pointless. and people are not just going to cede their argument to some different definition of life, on either side, ever.

 

[RMcD94]

Technically, it's not alive, so no.

How is it now alive? Did you know that by week 4 the baby already has a heart and a circulatory system? And the heart starts beating by week 5?

If it was taken out of the mother it would die. So technically it isn't human or anything viable for that matter. It is not murder. Once the baby can survive outside of the mother it becomes illegal to abort or kill because that point it does become murder.

I assume you are pro-murdering people who are in comas then? Since they are not independent and require other people to survive. Actually, pro killing anyone who couldn't survive independently?

 

[Eldarion]

You could give me some argument about weather or not a fetus is "alive" at what stage, but since that is a matter of opinion rather than scientific fact and my opinion is that its alive from the start then abortion is in my view of the concept murder.

Because you'd have to show how something lacking sentience or consciousness is 'alive'.

Prove to me that it in fact lacks sentience or consciousness(you can't). Thats assuming I accept those as qualifications for life.

Here you go [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_debate#Fetal_pain_debate].

The foetus can't even feel pain until the third trimester. I think a large part of the problem here is that anti-abortionists are seeing 'consciousness' as a meta-physical thing, like the soul, which it isn't. Consciousness requires a well-formed brain and since pain receptors aren't even formed by 24 weeks we can presume complex reasoning isn't either.

Weather or not it can feel pain isn't proof for or against consciousness. I never said it had to have consciousness for me to consider it alive either, so your arguing something totally irrelevant to this conversation. I'm not having that argument.

The fact is that a fetus in any stage is a person in development. Terminating a persons life at any stage is murder in my book. Thats how I feel about it.

Why exactly do you all feel so strongly for a womans right to abort a fetus anyway? What gives anyone that right? A woman has a right to choose weather or not she has a baby, but I say she made that choice when she had sex. Even with birth control you are still risking pregnancy, even if by less than 1% chance. Why have sex if you can't accept the consequences of your actions? Thats what the pro abortion stance is. Its just enabling bad judgement. After all why should you have to deal with the consequences of your decisions right?

There are a few exceptions, rape or if the birth threatens the life of the mother I can understand. But if you are gonna have sex you need to accept the very real possibility that you are gonna have a baby on your hands. Aborting a potential life because of the mothers poor judgement isn't something I can get behind.

 

[Ham_authority95]

Edit: Amusingly the poll results look like a penis.

Ha, Nice one.

 

[Yoshemo]

Late term abortion is murder. But before that, it isn't

 

[TehCookie]

If it could live outside the mother it's murder, otherwise it's just removing a parasite.

 

[Arcane Azmadi]

I personally think it is murder. Lumps of flesh don't have ears and eyes, and they don't swallow and have the ability to kick you while in the womb.

If they have eyes and ears and can kick the foetus is too far along for abortion to be legal unless the mother's life is in danger. That argument does not hold water. Elaborate.

 

[SL33TBL1ND]

No.