I'd heard about someone dyeing from chilli's from my Mum, but due after doing some a LITTLE amount of research for some RELIABLE information, I found a guy called Andrew Lee had died after eating chillis for a bet and then suffering what is believed to be a heart attack thought to be due to the chilli. But the amount he ate was probably alot larger and hotter then what was given to the child.
Poll: Mother punishes adopted child by forcing him to drink hot sauce
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I don't think her method of punishment was particularly barbaric or abusive - yeah, maybe a little extreme and unnecessary. But what I object to was the way she was yelling at him, using fear to motivating her child into doing the right thing, rather than actual reasoning, saying "Does it make it better to lie? You get in more trouble when you lie". It's not a natural consequence, is a punishment designed to scare the child into obedience and submission. Then there was the line "You will do as you are told". How is it right to raise a child to blindly follow what they have been told by arbitrary figures of authority? If they take that to the real world after they move out they'll be trampled.
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In short, the mother was being very black and white about the issue of lying, and using an extreme form of punishment to scare the young kid (who was already afraid) to obey her. Which I think is wrong.
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You are right, but you are not right. Discipline is fine. And if this kid was 13, beating up other kids, smashing cars, loudmouthing his mother, and being a genuine fuckhead, then yeah, I have no problem with what she did. But this wasn't the case. The kid was young, and quite obviously genuinely timid and afraid of his mother. Which is why he lied. Now this woman's method of parenting and discipline is manipulation through fear, which not only feeds the problem, especially with a young kid, I think is extreme in itself and unnecessary as better results can be achieved with less cruelty (for lack of a better word). On top of this, he wasn't being a spoilt little brat, and his "crime" was not elaborated on. And I believe the punishment should suit the crime, so we can't really know whether this is justified or not unless we know what he did.Ran.Dom said:
In short, the mother was being very black and white about the issue of lying, and using an extreme form of punishment to scare the young kid (who was already afraid) to obey her. Which I think is wrong.
I'm not a parent, but I had to raise my little brother. So I feel like I can say something about this.
The punishment is not the problem. Hot Sauce, not a big deal, although I don't see why a bar of soap went out of style. The real problem is the way the mother talked to her son. I've been there, i've been so frustrated that i was being lied too and i knew it. So I would take the same tone as that mother and shout at my brother.
All it did was create a bigger problem, and I was doing it to myself. Creating more frustration. I learned a lot, and sometimes it takes seeing how ugly you are behaving to change that behavior. I know that the way the mom reacted to what Phil's wife said she regretted it and she saw how ugly her behavior was. The real abuse wasn't the hotsauce or the cold shower but the anger.
My father never once spanked me angry, not once. If he was angry he would send me too my room, for 20 minutes or an hour, until he had calmed down so that when he went into my room not only did I think about what I had done, but he had too. "do you know why I am spanking you?" is the first thing he would say.
I think i turned out pretty good, although i certainly have my issues but being a spoiled little shit was never one of them.
This kid is going to be okay, the mom isn't beyond correcting her attitude. There is far, far worse child abuse in this country and this world for social workers to go after.
The punishment is not the problem. Hot Sauce, not a big deal, although I don't see why a bar of soap went out of style. The real problem is the way the mother talked to her son. I've been there, i've been so frustrated that i was being lied too and i knew it. So I would take the same tone as that mother and shout at my brother.
All it did was create a bigger problem, and I was doing it to myself. Creating more frustration. I learned a lot, and sometimes it takes seeing how ugly you are behaving to change that behavior. I know that the way the mom reacted to what Phil's wife said she regretted it and she saw how ugly her behavior was. The real abuse wasn't the hotsauce or the cold shower but the anger.
My father never once spanked me angry, not once. If he was angry he would send me too my room, for 20 minutes or an hour, until he had calmed down so that when he went into my room not only did I think about what I had done, but he had too. "do you know why I am spanking you?" is the first thing he would say.
I think i turned out pretty good, although i certainly have my issues but being a spoiled little shit was never one of them.
This kid is going to be okay, the mom isn't beyond correcting her attitude. There is far, far worse child abuse in this country and this world for social workers to go after.
I was originally going to explode after watching the video, but after reading some comments I changed I've calmed down a little. Okay, the boy lied, it can be a problem (I'm 18 and my mother yelled at me TONIGHT for lying), but look at the way he was standing, and how he spoke. Looked like he was going to shit himself. He got some detentions from school; that should be punishment enough for a SEVEN year old. He lied because he was scared of her, and on a young developing body like that, hot sauce can screw his mouth over bad (Did you hear him speak after he spat the sauce out? sounded like his tongue was swollen, although it could have been from the fact that he was crying). Cold water suddenly hitting your body can send you into shock, and that could screw his heart up in an extreme case. Some punishment like a stern talking to and a spank could be necessary, but hot sauce and an ice cold shower? That's too far.
I'm saying this, and I always rant about how protected and spoiled the kids are...
I'm saying this, and I always rant about how protected and spoiled the kids are...
If you fail to establish any kind of dominance on your own, and have to resort to physical violence to force them to do what you want, you have failed as a parent. Beyond that, anything else is irrelevant. So yeah, that woman should be punished.
Fear is not the proper way to raise a child. If the child was less fearful, I would have been fine with the cold shower punishment. (Cold showers are good for you, increased circulation and etc. Water is always slightly heated within the pipes to prevent water FREEZING and destroying pipeworks, so cold water is cold water, wherever you are! Even Alaska, so where you are has no bearing on that.)
I wasn't too fond of the full mouth of hot sauce (the bottle didn't look like tobasco, actually looked like Frank's Red Hot, but NO ONE KNOWS what kind of hot sauce it really was). And swishing hot sauce around in your mouth and holding it in is NASTY. I can see a bit on the tongue, and use different sauce depending on how well your child takes the sauce (some will need hotter stuff than others!). But a mouthful for a kid? No thanks. The fear and the way the child acted showed he wasn't going to properly learn from the way she was acting. It was a controlling environment that didn't instruct, and desired only compliance with orders, no independent thought.
Teach your children that lying to you is wrong, and make sure that when they lie they get punished worse than for being honest, but don't go overboard and create a child that fears you.
I wasn't too fond of the full mouth of hot sauce (the bottle didn't look like tobasco, actually looked like Frank's Red Hot, but NO ONE KNOWS what kind of hot sauce it really was). And swishing hot sauce around in your mouth and holding it in is NASTY. I can see a bit on the tongue, and use different sauce depending on how well your child takes the sauce (some will need hotter stuff than others!). But a mouthful for a kid? No thanks. The fear and the way the child acted showed he wasn't going to properly learn from the way she was acting. It was a controlling environment that didn't instruct, and desired only compliance with orders, no independent thought.
Teach your children that lying to you is wrong, and make sure that when they lie they get punished worse than for being honest, but don't go overboard and create a child that fears you.
It's still not fine with me. Pain should never be used to discipline a child, it's just lazy/bad parenting and the negative outcomes outweigh the positives.CrazyMedic said:
The parent in question actually didn't seem that bad, she made damn sure her kid knew what he did was wrong. But then she overdid it by pretty much telling him he's a worthless piece of crap, something a parent should NEVER tell their child, and then took it a step further by causing him physical pain.
It doesn't work, by her own admission.Chibz said:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/mom-on-dr-phil-episode-charged-with-child-abuse-12789618
Seeing as this is considered to be torture already, I don't think that getting more harsh is going to help. Presumably the problem lies elsewhere.
Oh God, I couldn't even make it through the whole clip, too many flashbacks.
I'm a summer camp counselor, and I frequently work with younger kids like that. Even if they do something wrong, there is absolutely no excuse for putting the child through physical pain. And even worse, belittling him when he's already emotionally distraught. I've been there. When you already feel terrible, and just want to curl up and cry, but your mom won't stop screaming. It's not pleasant.
Whatever happened to just talking to the kid about what happened? When one of my campers does something wrong, we just tell them in a calm tone that it's against the rules which are there for their own safety. We explain the situation to them like they're an actual person. The only "punishment" (and you have to really screw up, like punch another kid, or set fire to something) is losing five minutes of time in the swimming pool. And you know what? It works. Moderate, sensible punishments for truly bad misbehavior, and talking things out for everything else works 99.9% of the time. There's no excuse otherwise.
/rant
Sorry for the rage, but as some one who works with kids, and some one who has experienced this first hand, this really hit a personal chord with me.
Also, the whole time I was watching, I kept thinking that little boy needs a hug, some cookies, a big glass of chocolate milk and an Xbox for all that crap.
Also, maybe a puppy.
I'm a summer camp counselor, and I frequently work with younger kids like that. Even if they do something wrong, there is absolutely no excuse for putting the child through physical pain. And even worse, belittling him when he's already emotionally distraught. I've been there. When you already feel terrible, and just want to curl up and cry, but your mom won't stop screaming. It's not pleasant.
Whatever happened to just talking to the kid about what happened? When one of my campers does something wrong, we just tell them in a calm tone that it's against the rules which are there for their own safety. We explain the situation to them like they're an actual person. The only "punishment" (and you have to really screw up, like punch another kid, or set fire to something) is losing five minutes of time in the swimming pool. And you know what? It works. Moderate, sensible punishments for truly bad misbehavior, and talking things out for everything else works 99.9% of the time. There's no excuse otherwise.
/rant
Sorry for the rage, but as some one who works with kids, and some one who has experienced this first hand, this really hit a personal chord with me.
Also, the whole time I was watching, I kept thinking that little boy needs a hug, some cookies, a big glass of chocolate milk and an Xbox for all that crap.
Also, maybe a puppy.
I find it alarming that it's frequent enough for her to have kept the hot sauce in the bathroom shelf.Ren3004 said:
I will not watch the videos. I hate stuff like that.
Reading through some of the comments, I have enough of an idea as to what it was like.
She shouldn't be allowed to take care of children in my opinion. Stuff like what is being described is quite frankly sickening.
Thing is:
I don't know much about Russia to be honest, this isn't a shot at the country.
Its more a matter of: how old were these kids when they were adopted?
Do they even speak the language?
(Sorry if these facts are mentioned somewhere, don't feel like going through 10 pages at the moment)
Reading through some of the comments, I have enough of an idea as to what it was like.
She shouldn't be allowed to take care of children in my opinion. Stuff like what is being described is quite frankly sickening.
Thing is:
Is that wise?The Article said:
I don't know much about Russia to be honest, this isn't a shot at the country.
Its more a matter of: how old were these kids when they were adopted?
Do they even speak the language?
(Sorry if these facts are mentioned somewhere, don't feel like going through 10 pages at the moment)
