Poll: Porn.

[milskidasith]

I think you are a victim of pseudoscience. Tell you what, you present scientific papers supporting your argument and I will give them more than dismissive glance.

There is, of course, debate on this subject. To present the full debate, I offer these four links:
http://men.webmd.com/guide/is-pornography-addictive
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2004/11/65772
http://www.myaddiction.com/porn_addiction.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_addiction

Wikipedia is neutral on the issue. Wired has one of the experts speaking on the negatives of pornography being somebody who is from an organization that promotes therapy to "cure" homosexuality. The other two are also neutral.

Even aside from compulsion, porn ruins our ability to see each other as human beings:
http://nsrc.sfsu.edu/article/empathy_choices_pornography_debate
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/1030-26.htm
http://sociologyindex.com/etiological.htm

These seem to be only about certain types of pornography where the woman is either unwilling or pretends to be unwilling, besides the third, which only mentions pornography in a correlative, not causative, sense.

If you really believe that shit, fine, I can't change your mind. But to put things into your terms:

Stimulus: Geldonyetich is intentionally insulting (by continuing to post things you know will insult people, it is intentional).

Response: Even if he has valid points, nobody cares about the argument because it's being told by somebody who shows no respect for other posters or their opinions.

Very well. I shall leave you with the word for the day:

Fascism

"A political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition."

So good you could share with me my views of how I should or should not express myself today.

Y'know, if I were telling you how to act, this would be fascist, sure. But I'm not.

I'm just telling you that by being intentionally insulting, nobody will give a shit about your argument, no matter if you are 100% correct and have the most compelling argument in the world hidden between the implied insults. If you want to continue being insulting, as I've already said you can, fine. It just won't help your argument out at all.

 

[Riven Armor]

Pointing out you are expressing yourself wrongly is not fascist. Repressing that expression might be fascist.

The fascist seed is in the bold-faced expression. The attempted repression is the pointing out.

You can't say I'm expressing myself wrongly because you are lacking an important component: being a true authority of right or wrong.

Simply pointing out something doesn't count as repression.

 

[Normalgamer]

I like porn, I quite like it alot. I had an ex-girlfriend who enjoyed porn also, more so then me or my guy friends combined, I was perplexed. She liked it for the art she said, I just liked it for the TandA.

Why is prostitution illegal anyway?

 

[geldonyetich]

Y'know, if I were telling you how to act, this would be fascist, sure. But I'm not.

I'm just telling you that by being intentionally insulting, nobody will give a shit about your argument, no matter if you are 100% correct and have the most compelling argument in the world hidden between the implied insults. If you want to continue being insulting, as I've already said you can, fine. It just won't help your argument out at all.

Because doing that isn't telling me how to act, right.

I'll say it one last time: I'm not being intentionally insulting.

Here's a hint: you're being played for a fool right now by the people who find feigning that they've been insulted because is easier than winning an argument. They see that I put too much energy into my replies as an opportunity to save face by saying I'm being arrogant, a very subtle ad-hominem, but they know that they've lost the argument.

 

[Lizmichi]

Meh I don't watch it. Just not my thing. Hell but I have no issue with it.

 

[pwnzerstick]

Boobies!!!!... Your argument is invalid.

 

[geldonyetich]

Pointing out you are expressing yourself wrongly is not fascist. Repressing that expression might be fascist.

The fascist seed is in the bold-faced expression. The attempted repression is the pointing out.

Simply pointing out something doesn't count as repression.

But it does count as attempted repression.

b : to prevent the natural or normal expression, activity, or development of

You point out to somebody you want them to change their natural or normal expression, activity, or development then you are attempting to repress that behavior.

Maybe you'll feel better if I downgrade it to attempted fascism?

 

[pwnzerstick]

Porn probably wouldn't even have as much of an industry if there hadn't been so much contoversy about it anyways.

 

[milskidasith]

Y'know, if I were telling you how to act, this would be fascist, sure. But I'm not.

I'm just telling you that by being intentionally insulting, nobody will give a shit about your argument, no matter if you are 100% correct and have the most compelling argument in the world hidden between the implied insults. If you want to continue being insulting, as I've already said you can, fine. It just won't help your argument out at all.

Because doing that isn't telling me how to act, right.

I'll say it one last time: I'm not being intentionally insulting.

Here's a hint: you're being played for a fool right now by the people who find feigning that they've been insulted because is easier than winning an argument.

Yes, you're being intentionally insulting. You have been told you are insulting and are doing nothing to change that. That is being intentionally insulting.

But feel free to ignore the main point of my argument, that being insulting isn't helping convince anybody, just to score points and "win" the argument by offending everybody so much they don't listen to what you have to say.

Read the book Thank You For Arguing if you want to learn how to actually convince people to see things your way; you don't "win" an argument by being "more right" or by not caring what people think, you win arguments by making other people think the way you do or getting what you want.

Anyway, I'm out. Feel free to pretend you've won because I've ignored you and you made me stop posting, but just try to remember why you were posting; was it to make me stop, or was it to convince others that porn is a horrible industry? Do you really feel you've accomplished your goal by making everybody ignore what you say?

 

[fenrizz]

I have no problem with porn.

 

[Riven Armor]

Pointing out you are expressing yourself wrongly is not fascist. Repressing that expression might be fascist.

The fascist seed is in the bold-faced expression. The attempted repression is the pointing out.

Simply pointing out something doesn't count as repression.

But it does count as attempted repression.

b : to prevent the natural or normal expression, activity, or development of

You point out to somebody you want them to change their natural or normal expression, activity, or development then you are attempting to repress that behavior.

Maybe you'll feel better if I downgrade it to attempted fascism?

Simplified more, pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is attempted "forcible repression of opposition..."

Fascist. (Attempted fascist.)

 

[lodo_bear]

I think you are a victim of pseudoscience. Tell you what, you present scientific papers supporting your argument and I will give them more than dismissive glance.

There is, of course, debate on this subject. To present the full debate, I offer these four links:
http://men.webmd.com/guide/is-pornography-addictive
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2004/11/65772
http://www.myaddiction.com/porn_addiction.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_addiction

Wikipedia is neutral on the issue. Wired has one of the experts speaking on the negatives of pornography being somebody who is from an organization that promotes therapy to "cure" homosexuality. The other two are also neutral.

Even aside from compulsion, porn ruins our ability to see each other as human beings:
http://nsrc.sfsu.edu/article/empathy_choices_pornography_debate
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/1030-26.htm
http://sociologyindex.com/etiological.htm

These seem to be only about certain types of pornography where the woman is either unwilling or pretends to be unwilling, besides the third, which only mentions pornography in a correlative, not causative, sense.

I think that you and I must agree to disagree. The pages did their best to be neutral (and good on them for striving to be impartial) but I felt that the sum total evidence they presented was in favor of my position. As for the second group of links, I see a common demeaning thread through all porn where you don't. I feel that porn portrays the view that all people exist only for sex, and I regard that as an extremely wrong and dangerous viewpoint.

As for correlative versus causative... it's really hard to get proper data on what goes on in people's heads, so correlative data is sometimes the best we can get. Check the Wired article for more on how hard it can be to get proper causative data on porn.

 

[milskidasith]

I think you are a victim of pseudoscience. Tell you what, you present scientific papers supporting your argument and I will give them more than dismissive glance.

There is, of course, debate on this subject. To present the full debate, I offer these four links:
http://men.webmd.com/guide/is-pornography-addictive
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2004/11/65772
http://www.myaddiction.com/porn_addiction.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_addiction

Wikipedia is neutral on the issue. Wired has one of the experts speaking on the negatives of pornography being somebody who is from an organization that promotes therapy to "cure" homosexuality. The other two are also neutral.

Even aside from compulsion, porn ruins our ability to see each other as human beings:
http://nsrc.sfsu.edu/article/empathy_choices_pornography_debate
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/1030-26.htm
http://sociologyindex.com/etiological.htm

These seem to be only about certain types of pornography where the woman is either unwilling or pretends to be unwilling, besides the third, which only mentions pornography in a correlative, not causative, sense.

I think that you and I must agree to disagree. The pages did their best to be neutral (and good on them for striving to be impartial) but I felt that the sum total evidence they presented was in favor of my position. As for the second group of links, I see a common demeaning thread through all porn where you don't. I feel that porn portrays the view that all people exist only for sex, and I regard that as an extremely wrong and dangerous viewpoint.

As for correlative versus causative... it's really hard to get proper data on what goes on in people's heads, so correlative data is sometimes the best we can get. Check the Wired article for more on how hard it can be to get proper causative data on porn.

Your side was supported by people who want to cure homosexuality. Excuse me for not believing they are the most neutral on the issue and came in with preconceptions about how porn is harmful.

As for correlative versus causative: Correlative means nothing. I could have also hazarded a guess that all the child abusers they pointed out watched television, ate fast food at least once, probably fell and scraped their knee, probably got yelled at by an adult at some point, ate hot dogs, were exposed to mustard, drank carbonated drinks, and wet the bed at least once. Without proof of causation, I can slap all of those on the article and it would be absolutely meaningless.

 

[lodo_bear]

Boobies!!!!... Your argument is invalid.

http://yourargumentisinvalid.com/user/305

 

[geldonyetich]

Y'know, if I were telling you how to act, this would be fascist, sure. But I'm not.

I'm just telling you that by being intentionally insulting, nobody will give a shit about your argument, no matter if you are 100% correct and have the most compelling argument in the world hidden between the implied insults. If you want to continue being insulting, as I've already said you can, fine. It just won't help your argument out at all.

Because doing that isn't telling me how to act, right.

I'll say it one last time: I'm not being intentionally insulting.

Here's a hint: you're being played for a fool right now by the people who find feigning that they've been insulted because is easier than winning an argument.

Yes, you're being intentionally insulting. You have been told you are insulting and are doing nothing to change that. That is being intentionally insulting.

No, being told I am insulting and doing nothing to change that is being myself instead of being a sycophant to anyone who tells me to do something.

Being intentionally insulting is insulting with an intent to do so.

Here's what you're doing here:

Oh, hey, I think you should agree with me.
Holy crap, you're not?
You're being intentionally wrong!

Seriously, I've already explained to you that it was their choice to interpret me as insulting, that has nothing to do with me. If you can't wrap your head around that, that's your problem, not mine.

Read the book Thank You For Arguing if you want to learn how to actually convince people to see things your way; you don't "win" an argument by being "more right" or by not caring what people think, you win arguments by making other people think the way you do or getting what you want.

Thank you for the book advice.

Anyway, I'm out. Feel free to pretend you've won because I've ignored you and you made me stop posting, but just try to remember why you were posting; was it to make me stop, or was it to convince others that porn is a horrible industry? Do you really feel you've accomplished your goal by making everybody ignore what you say?

I've long since outgrown believing this or any other forum thread buried on an imperceptibly small niche on the Internet has a chance of invoking social change in any capacity. Consequently, the very first post I made here was made with a goal to waste time on a thread about the merits of porn (that probably shouldn't be posted on a forum largely visited by kids to begin with)... which is probably the same goal as any other poster here.

A separate goal comes about whenever somebody relies to me in disagreement, and it's usually to clarify for them where they misinterpreted me. I've a bit of an agenda of being a sounding board for thick-headed Sophomores to understand why their conclusions are lacking in adequate critical thinking.

It was a goal that is rarely ever met, they're just too proud to acknowledge any point, but I'm comfortable with knowing that the mental exercise I provided has edged them slightly closer to true maturity, a goal many never reach.

 

[geldonyetich]

Simplified more, pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is attempted "forcible repression of opposition..."

Fascist. (Attempted fascist.)

Pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is a lot more forgivable than trying to fundamentally change their character.

 

[Riven Armor]

Simplified more, pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is attempted "forcible repression of opposition..."

Fascist. (Attempted fascist.)

Pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is a lot more forgivable than trying to fundamentally change their character.

Forgivable fascism is still fascism.

 

[geldonyetich]

Simplified more, pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is attempted "forcible repression of opposition..."

Fascist. (Attempted fascist.)

Pointing out your opponent's view is wrong is a lot more forgivable than trying to fundamentally change their character.

Forgivable fascism is still fascism.

Well, if you're going to put me into "forgiven" territory while you languish over on "unforgiven" territory, there's something I can deal with.

Listen, my stance is a stance hard learned. I understand that people decide what they want to interpret as insulting, and this will very from person to person. Consequently, I cannot be beholden to their decision on what they find insulting. I'm not going to throw away that progress just because you have yet to come to this realization.