Poll: PS2 10th anniversary celebration! Top 10 PS2 games to date and more!

[stone0042]

I've only played Jak 3 of that list, and I would contend that at least one game of the Ratchet and Clank series deserves a spot on the list.
But the PS2 will always have a special place in my heart, it was great to me. Remember the days when $20 would get you a relatively new game bought used? Those were great, I got around 30 games that way.

 

[Hiphophippo]

I class games the same way as you do. I won't argue Timesplitters but we'll have to agree to disagree on the hitman franchise. The original on PC was interesting at best but I've just never liked the series. It might surprise you to hear that I'm not sold on ICO being in my own top 10 list. It's an artistically stunning game and was loads of fun but I feel it might have gotten by on art more than it's roots as a game.

I've mentioned earlier in this thread that I'm just really bad at lists. I always forget things. I do feel pretty confident that I would include both Metal Gear Solid 3 and Silent Hill 2 would be on the list. Other possible entries include San Andreas and, no doubt, Okami but it's to my eternal shame that I haven't played it so I don't feel comfortable listing it despite how confident I am it would be there.

This is a good thread though, I've enjoyed the discussion.

Alright then. I wasn't sure where you were going to start with but now I see you're a reasonable type with good taste. I'll tell my troops to stand down. Just one thing: when you said "I won't argue Timesplitters" what did you mean? You do agree with me about its quality or are you unfamiliar with it? Just curious, here.

It's a quality game. Split screen with friends was a blast but I only ever did it a few times. Truth be told my friends and I played split screen perfect dark until near the end of the ps2 years, and only then because several people moved away.

 

[ZaronX]

Can't say I've even *played* half the things on that list as they just don't fall under my appeal much at all, but personally I found Dragon Quest to be really... REALLY boring. And grindy. Just dind't hold my interest at all, and there's a lot of much better RPGs on the system imo...

Disgaea? Odin Sphere? Wild Arms? Hell, I'd take FFX or 12 over DQ8 any day. : |

And where the eff are Sly Cooper and Katamari? Maybe Katamari is asking too much, but that raccoon of Sucker Punch's is probably the only time I've burnt through an entire trilogy in the span of about a month, and Cole will never replace Sly, nor will Zeke ever... stop sucking.

I supposed things like this will never be something everyone settles on, granted...

 

[Vuljatar]

An excellent list and retrospective on an excellent console.

I am surprised, however, that Guitar Hero 2 and Soul Calibur 2 or 3 failed to make your list.

 

[Treblaine]

Just EVERYTHING is significantly better, most particularly the lighting engine, real time lighting on the Gamecube version that means you have a torch that actually illuminates things, monsters hide in shadows to burst out at you, lightening casts striking shadows to really add to the mood of the game. And have you seen the other Resident Evil games on the Gamecube?

RE 4 is a great game and it really does deserve being played as intended on the platform it was developed for, the Gamecube. RE4 truly is a Gamecube game to any gamer who knows his stuff and want to get the most bang for his buck.

I always like to play the best games in their best form, whether on Console or PC, within reason of course.

Nearly all of that seems to be related to visual niceties, which I don't consider a valid rival for better controls. The extra content is just icing on PS2's cake, but frankly my not great fondness for Resi 4 is the result of the core game, and a slightly different version won't change that. I see Resi 4 as a passable action game and a sub-par horror title, so neither genre's criteria are met well. The plot isn't even too gripping, so one can't make the argument of "worth playing for the story". Naturally I'm in the extreme minority here, but I just don't consider Resi 4 as anywhere near the 6th generation's best, regardless of what system you own it on.

"Nearly all of that seems to be related to visual niceties, which I don't consider a valid rival for better controls."

Ah ha, that old cherub "gameplay before graphics", well I'm sorry MATE but that doesn't mean "I can selectively ignore graphics when I want". The problem with that is the controls and overall gameplay are virtually identical on PS2-Gamecube.

Remember it's gameplay BEFORE graphics, not that graphics are IRRELEVANT. Graphics ARE HUGELY relevant, especially if you are trying to create any kind of horror or suspense, which is probably why you found the PS2 version such a sub-par horror game. See a different version WILL change that, answer me honestly here, did you view all the video comparisons on the link I gave you? Stanley Kubric was OBSESSED with the quality of how his films were represented, visual quality DOES matter, it cannot substitute for bad gameplay but RE4 had the gameplay side, the graphics significantly enhance that.
At the very least it should be played the way the developers INTENDED IT, they made the gameplay assuming you could see and not see certain things which are lost in the port.

Now the extra content that PS2 gets is just not worth it, an extra novelty costume and Ada Wong's Separate Ways. The problem with Separate Ways is it is 90% recycled levels that play almost the same and it is quite redundant considering even the Gamecube had the Assignment Ada side missions. That is just in no way worth sacrificing all the MOOD and the FEEL of the game which you get with the graphics cut on PS2. I've played the PS2 version and the Gamecube much later know it's not worth it.

The contrast is startling at times, a good lighting engine can really make the scene have depth, the way you walk past a fire and it lights the front and then the back of your character with the warms rippling orange glow.
Also VERY FEW 6th gen games had real-time lighting, this was a real treat that so many people skipped on. I mean at the time a Gamecube went for only $99 but most people flocked to the PS2 version. Nintendo tried so hard to give the best graphics and hardcore gameplay... but this... no wonder we ended up with the Wii.

I'm a fanboy for one thing: GOOD GAMES, wherever they are. The reason at the moment I'm a fanboy for PS3 now is it generally has the best console graphics but that is NOT going to make me buy Bayonetta for PS3 over Xbox 360 when the 360 version is so obviously significantly better.

If you're desperate for the extra content as seen on the PS2 version the best path is to get the Wii version which retains the Gamecube graphics, real-time cutscenes, introduces new controls, and the extra mission/weapon/costume. That would be the ideal path, get RE4 in Jan 2005 for Gamecube, then Wii in mid 2007.

 

[CheckD3]

And anyone who loves TimeSplitters 2 is an automatical friend for life in my book. What a gift to receive! I hope you gave the giver something of comparable value, like a gold brick. What's your opinion on Future Perfect, may I ask? Overall do you prefer it to #2 or not?

Actually, haven't ever played Future Perfect, my copy of TS2 has been lost sadly, so I've had to move on and play other games. I remember all those good times, and I'm sure I eventually find my lost disc or another, but right now I haven't the time to pick up Future Perfect. I've got games I haven't finished, plus a job at Blockbuster where I can rent games for free...so you can see a dilema with that

But I will get a new GC (mine died after 8-9 hard years of play time) and secure copies of good GC games and re-run through ALL my old games someday, and TS2 along with any other TS games I can pick up are on the top of my list, once I've saved up money that is...

 

[secretsantaone]

WAIT WAIT WAIT.

No Ratchet and Clank?
No Devil May Cry?
No Beyond Good and Evil?

I hope to hear good explanations why these were not included.

Prepare to be at least partially sated:

-Ratchet and Clank is dear to me, but I feel Jak comes out as the better of the two.
-Devil May Cry has always felt too slow and awkward for me, and ever since God of War anything less doesn't do it.
-I've barely played Beyond Good and Evil (though I do own it), and as the mention of my two hundred-plus PS2 games indicates, I have many many many titles that need my attention, not to mention probably another hundred or more non-PS2 games. I have to prioritise and somehow Beyond Good and Evil has fallen out of my gaze. Sad but true. Besides, from what I've played it feels like an intriguing if slighty iffy to control platformer. I hear many things though, and I definitely HAVEN'T given the game a fair chance yet, so I make no claims at being the definitive opinion.

Fair enough, each to their own.

I would reccomend BGaE, the level design alone is fantastic.

 

[Tryzon]

The contrast is startling at times, a good lighting engine can really make the scene have depth, the way you walk past a fire and it lights the front and then the back of your character with the warms rippling orange glow.
Also VERY FEW 6th gen games had real-time lighting, this was a real treat that so many people skipped on. I mean at the time a Gamecube went for only $99 but most people flocked to the PS2 version. Nintendo tried so hard to give the best graphics and hardcore gameplay... but this... no wonder we ended up with the Wii.

I'm a fanboy for one thing: GOOD GAMES, wherever they are. The reason at the moment I'm a fanboy for PS3 now is it generally has the best console graphics but that is NOT going to make me buy Bayonetta for PS3 over Xbox 360 when the 360 version is so obviously significantly better.

If you're desperate for the extra content as seen on the PS2 version the best path is to get the Wii version which retains the Gamecube graphics, real-time cutscenes, introduces new controls, and the extra mission/weapon/costume. That would be the ideal path, get RE4 in Jan 2005 for Gamecube, then Wii in mid 2007.

I think we're beginning to get overly competitive now. I don't see graphics as irrelevant, but definitely among the lest importance factors that I use to judge a game in the long run. I'm also a big believer in playing games in their intended format: if you look, I make various cruel comments about the God of War Collection, calling it "inferior" and highly advising that one should play the PS2 versions "as nature intended". Even TimeSplitters was originally PS2 exclusive, and even once the series went multiplatform the PS2 got the best deal.

I don't want to get into a proper argument here, but my feelings on Resident Evil 4 are final. I found Silent Hill on PS1 terrifying, and what little I played of it I did after the PS3 had been out, let alone the PS2. Graphics are not essential for a scary experience, and even Code: Veronica, which I again didn't play much, this time due to those damn bloody tank controls, was significantly more scary than Resi 4. Resi 4 is at best unnerving, and the moments of panic can be terrifying in a different sense, but those few scenes weren't worth controls that make otherwise highly entertaining shooting irritating.

I think Resi 4 would have worked better had they called it something different, forgotten all the horror malarky and gone full shooter. A very similar game to Resi 4 that works much better in my opinion is Cold Fear, also on PS2. Give that one a go: it's more tense, the tanker-ship setting seems predictable at first but allows for some clever environmental hazards, and the creatures you encounter are downright freakish.

Resi 4 does get more things right than wrong, and had it not suffered an identity crisis I think it could have been in my Top 10, at least with some stretching. But the clunky gameplay and lackluster scares that cannot just be explained away by inferior visuals due to Silent Hill 1's far greater effect on me means that in my book, the game is competent but very clumsy. Even if you could move while shooting, I'd think better of it.

To me it's simply a strangely overrated game that for some reason everyone else loves. I don't mind being the odd one out, but please understand that the game is fundamentally flawed in my opinion, and some better lighting effects would not help.

Now can we please just accept that Resident Evil 4 is not my cup of tea regardless of the format and move on? I appreciate just how much effort you put into several big responses, and clearly you're passionate about it, but my mind is made up and unless an radically different version of the game is released, it will forever be not my kind of thing.

Besides, surely the Wii version would have inferior controls to any previous console versions?

 

[Treblaine]

*basically, RE4 is over-rated*

Hmm, I see where you are coming from but the Resident Evil franchise was never trying to be as un-nerving and terrifying as Silent Hill and to be honest I think the comparison is unfair, even as early as Resident Evil 2 it was described as an action-adventure title and the series has been steadily moving further and further in that direction. And Resident Evil 4 I think really EVOLVED the series to it's ultimate peak of action-adventure with horror elements, I see it as a lot like Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom.

We've got our hero, alone on an adventure through a strange land, fighting hoards of monstrous people, to save the girl. Hell it even has a tense fight on a runaway mine cart and you fighting against zealots murmuring evil hyms, and then of course the villains, all straight out of a 1930's serial, very Fu Manchu without actually being.
In fact I'd go as far as to recommend RE4 more to fans of Uncharted than to fans of Silent Hill, but that doesn't mean the game has an "identity crisis" just because it tries to have a new and original approach rather than just remaking Resident Evil 2.

And RE4 does have the horror side, I mean when Doctor Salvador turns up for the first time revving that chainsaw, you can hear it, you can tell it is getting closer, but WHERE is he! And then when he corners you and panicking you fumble your shots and he SAWS YOUR HEAD CLEAN OFF. My heart was racing like hell, the only other time the Resident Evil series got that response out of me was when I first encountered the Hunters in Resident Evil 1, such a shock to move from the slow lumbering zombies to those fast leaping and decapitating monsters.

it's also a bit simplistic with your silent hill comparison again as if "Silent Hill had low graphics, but was scary, therefore graphics are irrelevant for scares". No they ARE relevant because even Silent Hill had a crude but actual real-time lighting system, there was light areas and pitch blackness but could be illuminated by your torch. When RE4 moved from Gamecube to PS2 all the lighting went out the window and everything just retained a flat dull, illumination.

"I think Resi 4 would have worked better had they called it something different, forgotten all the horror malarky and gone full shooter."

That's... a PRETTY tall order, remove all the key elements and make it something completely different. I think you are completely missing the point of the game that may be shaped too much by your pre-misconceptions from the Resident Evil name. I liked, even loved the game for what it was, a fun and tense adventure romp.

While I will accept that RE4 is "not your cup of tea" I however cannot accept your criticisms as valid.

 

[silver wolf009]

That is one big ass wall of text...
OT: never been a fan but i do remember playing the orgional Jack and Daxter a while back.

 

[Samurai Goomba]

Blood Money absolutely belonged up there, but the PS2 version of Chaos Theory is VASTLY inferior to the Xbox version. It looks much worse, has way more loading breaks, the colors and shading are REALLY messed up compared to the Xbox version and the package as a whole... There's not a thing the PS2 version has the Xbox version doesn't have, plus more.

Also, I'm noticing a severe lack of God Hand, ZoE 2, BoF: Dragon Quarter, KoF XI/KoF '98: UM, DMC3: Special Edition, Shadow of the Colossus, Vice City and the Scarface game.

I hated Jak 3 and DQ8, too. But Urban Chaos IS pretty sweet.

Speaking of which, any advice for the subway train car level? My innocents always get wrecked by dual uzi-wielding nutjobs before I can reach them.

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

Star Wars Battlefront II? That was a marvellous game, truly awesome. I have fond memories of the space battles, engaging in dogfights... definitely a game best played on a home cinema with a friend.

 

[Anticitizen_Two]

Jak and Daxter: The Precursor Legacy

 

[saejox]

i played ratchet&clank trilogy recently. i had a blast. go get 'em.

 

[WickedBoy6]

I have yet to jump ship to the newer consoles, mainly due to money, so the PS2 is still my most current system, but even if I get a PS3, I'll still be playing the PS2 for a long, LONG time.I have my own personal Top Ten, as well, and I'll try to use the same guidelines as Tryzon.

Devil May Cry 3
Final Fantasy X
God of War II
Grand Theft Auto III
Kingdom Hearts
Marvel vs. Capcom 2
Odin Sphere
Resident Evil 4
Rock Band
Soul Calibur II

I admire your decision to follow my example, and I would delay getting a 7th gen console for some time. The PS2 beats them all hands-down, I say. Quality list, too.

Thank you. I figure that the best way to get my opinion across would be to follow the bar set prior. I only plan on getting a PS3 when it drops a bit more - $299 i this economy is still a bit pricey - and once God of War III AND Kingdom Hearts 3 hit, the two titles I'm really looking forward to this gen. Even with a PS3, though, I'm still going to play the hell out of these ten games.

One more thing...

Ever since God of War anything less doesn't do it.

This is probably the truest statement I've ever heard.

 

[ineedscissors]

I agree, the Subsistence version of MGS3 is more enjoyable than the original, mainly because of the better camera (and also the fact that they include the original two Metal Gears from the MSX2).

My PS2 Top ten (no order):

-Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
-Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
-Final Fantasy X
-Kingdom Hearts
-Kingdom Hearts 2
-Resident Evil 4
-Timesplitters: Future Perfect
-Grand Theft Auto 3
-Jak and Daxter: The Precursor Legacy (yes the first one is still the nearest and dearest to me)
-007: Nightfire

 

[Tryzon]

Blood Money absolutely belonged up there, but the PS2 version of Chaos Theory is VASTLY inferior to the Xbox version. It looks much worse, has way more loading breaks, the colors and shading are REALLY messed up compared to the Xbox version and the package as a whole... There's not a thing the PS2 version has the Xbox version doesn't have, plus more.

Speaking of which, any advice for the subway train car level? My innocents always get wrecked by dual uzi-wielding nutjobs before I can reach them.

As ever, I point towards superior controls as my explanation for prefering the PS2 version of something. I know I'm repeating myself by saying that, but it's true. I find that FPSs which require a lot of zooming in don't fare brilliantly on the Xbox in general, because I can never get used to clicking the right stick in for precision aiming. Halo works so well partly because zooming isn't too important, but in something like Urban Chaos, where the "pop shot" is an essential skill to survive, the slower means of zooming in isn't my preference.

Having four shoulder buttons is the single way in which the DualShock 2 beats the Xbox controller, in my opinion.

As for tips, if you're having trouble on a level the cheap way to succeed is to go back to earlier missions and earn every medal you can, thereby improving your equipment. Beating Terror mode without the good upgrades is a daunting task indeed. Also, Urban Chaos relies a lot on memorisation, so replaying the same bit over and over until you know what happens where helps hugely. Of course that forfeits the Survivor medals, but you can always come back later for that.

 

[Tryzon]

*basically, RE4 is over-rated*

While I will accept that RE4 is "not your cup of tea" I however cannot accept your criticisms as valid.

Fair enough, although some slight acknowledgement would be nice.

Can I just say this one last thing: I do not see graphics as irrelevant, particularly in horror games and other things which rely on building an atmosphere, but 9/10 a game's visual prowness does not even cross my mind. Something insanely pretty like God of War or SoulCalibur gets the appropriate praise from me, but were those series not endowed with spectacular gameplay then the pretty pictures would not stop me from dismissing them. Grahphics have their place, but I say that they need to be seen as a bonus, not a requirement for quality.

Now I'm satisfied.

 

[Tryzon]

Ever since God of War anything less doesn't do it.

This is probably the truest statement I've ever heard.

I would have to agree.