Poll: Rushing and you
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You hate it because it's a cheap tactic, but say you don't care to anyone that will tell you it's easy to defend against it.
If you're gonna go on about something that you dislike and then say you don't care to those who can properly tell you how to counter it then all I can say is enjoy losing.
It's very easy to hold off against an early rush, but with your attitude, I don't feel you're ready to learn a bit about the game to turn that frown upside down.
Every cheesy strategy has a counter, but if you're unwilling to listen then there's not much anyone can do to help you. So instead of trying to protect yourself "I know this, and I know that." Why not ask... "Hey, whats a good way as said race to keep this from happening?"
Because if you "do know" that they're easy to counter, then it wouldn't be that much of a problem for you, right?
If you're gonna go on about something that you dislike and then say you don't care to those who can properly tell you how to counter it then all I can say is enjoy losing.
It's very easy to hold off against an early rush, but with your attitude, I don't feel you're ready to learn a bit about the game to turn that frown upside down.
Every cheesy strategy has a counter, but if you're unwilling to listen then there's not much anyone can do to help you. So instead of trying to protect yourself "I know this, and I know that." Why not ask... "Hey, whats a good way as said race to keep this from happening?"
Because if you "do know" that they're easy to counter, then it wouldn't be that much of a problem for you, right?
ShadowKatt said:
Not possible. Literally.
It took 80 seconds to build a spawning pool in Starcraft/BW, which you couldn't even do right away without mining with your initial workers for at least 30 seconds.
It takes 65 seconds in SCII to build a spawning pool, again needing to mine with the initial workers.
I'm not gonna run the numbers, but I'm fairly sure marines in 3 minutes is impossible as well, though zealots in 4 seems reasonable, though you would probably only have 1 or two at the expense of any semblance of an economy.
36 carriers in 10 is definately impossible on anything that is not a Fastest map, even then I doubt it.
Scout early, if he's got 2 gates before a cybernetics core, he's gonna rush. build a queen and a couple of spine crawlers and place them near your mineral line, That will scare him off and leave him vulnerable because he now has to build up his base. Good luck and happy swarming!IxionIndustries said:
I say it's meh. I agree with the sentiment of the post, but I wouldn't call it barbaric. Rudimentary and desperate, yes. But is seems if you can just endure it the first couple times, you should have enough to make a serious push back. RTSs are all about knowing when to push, and knowing when to hold, then if you've held well enough,knowing when to push back massively. I don't play starcraft, but i do thoroughly enjoy Dawn of War and it's expansions, and I find that's usually the case. So stop whining already and expand your skills so you can crush these rushers you hate so much.=)
It's a virtual guarantee that the rusher will lose, since I'm a defensive-minded player and when I know I've got a rusher up against me he will win once---the first time.
Rare indeed is the rusher who can actually vary up his rushing tactics enough to throw me.
Rare indeed is the rusher who can actually vary up his rushing tactics enough to throw me.
Since you said to specify here: It's war, you ever heard of blitzkrieg? Overwhelming an enemy quickly is always an option. In games I try to win quick because I know my late game sucks a big fat one, I like short quick battles because that's where I excel. And like many have said their on counters to everything...just have to learn em
Oh please you can do it in EVERY RTS, and for that to be turn you will have to have built plenty of units to count the guy who builds 100 of something else.snowfox said:
Rushing is good. It's a legitimate tactic that can be countered. Stop complaining and be better.
Oh sure, you CAN do it, but before then it's going to leave you vulnerable and most people will see it coming that it won't matter anyway, because they already have something ready for it. I have never lost against a mass top tier attack in a 1v1 match up.KoreyGM said:
Rushing is a double edged sword on one hand you can knock your opponent back enough that they can't recover or if it fails you just dumped resources and knocked yourself back.
Rushing should be one trick in an RTS players bag of Strategies
Personally, i tend to play defensively and send out small raids to hinder my opponent then finish em off while they are trying to rebuild.
Rushing should be one trick in an RTS players bag of Strategies
Personally, i tend to play defensively and send out small raids to hinder my opponent then finish em off while they are trying to rebuild.
/facepalm AGAIN. I *know* that it's a strategy. I'm not whining because I think it's OP, going "all in" is a fairly stupid move. I'm not trying to shift the zeitgeist and start an anti-rushing revolution like some kind of Starcraft Che Guevara in a feeble attempt to change the game. I'm just making an observation about the dissonance between what RTSes claim to be and what they actually are.
All righty then. Interestingly enough, we seem to be split 50/50-ish on the poll... I guess it's one of those things. Well, that's that, I suppose.
All righty then. Interestingly enough, we seem to be split 50/50-ish on the poll... I guess it's one of those things. Well, that's that, I suppose.
The goal of the game is to win. If your opponent is using a dumb brute-force strategy that works, then it is a good strategy.
You don't like it? Too bad. Counter, then counterattack.
There may be no art in the rush, but there is the possibility of victory. That's why your opponent does it, because they think they can win using it.
Does the most artful player win? No.
Does the most intelligent player win? No.
Does the most considerate, thoughtful and deep tactical player win? No.
The winning player wins.
No points for style.
You don't like it? Too bad. Counter, then counterattack.
There may be no art in the rush, but there is the possibility of victory. That's why your opponent does it, because they think they can win using it.
Does the most artful player win? No.
Does the most intelligent player win? No.
Does the most considerate, thoughtful and deep tactical player win? No.
The winning player wins.
No points for style.
In most RTS games, there is a Rock-Paper-Scissors relationship. It's Rush/Tower/Economy.
A "Tower", a very defensive person, will focus very quickly on defensive structures, stationary defenses, and powerful, slow moving units. When a rush person attacks full force, the defense person has an advantage. Defense is naturally easier, because its on your terms. There strategy is tailor made to defeat rushes. After the battle, the rusher has nothing, but the tower has most of his defenses left. Pack up those slow moving defensive units, move them to the enemy base, unhindered thanks top the previous defeated rush, and the rusher is destroyed.
An Economy person is ready for the long haul. They build a lot of gatherers, research a lot of tech, and will be building the top tier unit in as little time as possible. A tower person prepares for an attack from the economy that never comes. Then, the tower players defenses don't look so fancy when the economy comes in with units tiers above the towers.
A Rusher builds the basic unit as fast as humanly possible, to catch the other by surprise. An economy player will have an impressive number of SCVs that don't mean anything against the endless hoard of zerglings. The economy players measly defenses might fend off the rush, but not without a crippling blow to the players base and resources. Meaning the second attack will be like taking candy from a baby.
If you have a problem with rushes, focus more on defenses. Look for slow moving units, stationary units, and AoE units, as well as whatever best counters your opponents base unit. If your just not good at that strategy, which may be likely if your having a problem, try a Rush strategy of your own. Maybe try to harass more, or look for other defensive options or weak spots to exploit. If the problem is ground only units, get fliers and harass. There is a solution. Worst case scenario, play the side you have problems with against the race you usually play, and figure out what works against you.
A "Tower", a very defensive person, will focus very quickly on defensive structures, stationary defenses, and powerful, slow moving units. When a rush person attacks full force, the defense person has an advantage. Defense is naturally easier, because its on your terms. There strategy is tailor made to defeat rushes. After the battle, the rusher has nothing, but the tower has most of his defenses left. Pack up those slow moving defensive units, move them to the enemy base, unhindered thanks top the previous defeated rush, and the rusher is destroyed.
An Economy person is ready for the long haul. They build a lot of gatherers, research a lot of tech, and will be building the top tier unit in as little time as possible. A tower person prepares for an attack from the economy that never comes. Then, the tower players defenses don't look so fancy when the economy comes in with units tiers above the towers.
A Rusher builds the basic unit as fast as humanly possible, to catch the other by surprise. An economy player will have an impressive number of SCVs that don't mean anything against the endless hoard of zerglings. The economy players measly defenses might fend off the rush, but not without a crippling blow to the players base and resources. Meaning the second attack will be like taking candy from a baby.
If you have a problem with rushes, focus more on defenses. Look for slow moving units, stationary units, and AoE units, as well as whatever best counters your opponents base unit. If your just not good at that strategy, which may be likely if your having a problem, try a Rush strategy of your own. Maybe try to harass more, or look for other defensive options or weak spots to exploit. If the problem is ground only units, get fliers and harass. There is a solution. Worst case scenario, play the side you have problems with against the race you usually play, and figure out what works against you.
It depends on what side of the rush you are on of course.
But I do believe that they are a completely legitimate strategy. If someone is skilled enough that they can create an opponent-defeating force before their opponent can, then it says something about how they play the game. Especially if their opponent was seriously trying and was unable to stop them.
Then it becomes exceptionally fun whenever two expert 'Rushers' play each other.
But I do believe that they are a completely legitimate strategy. If someone is skilled enough that they can create an opponent-defeating force before their opponent can, then it says something about how they play the game. Especially if their opponent was seriously trying and was unable to stop them.
Then it becomes exceptionally fun whenever two expert 'Rushers' play each other.
I think it's a necessary evil-- the possibility of a rush keeps you on your toes.
BTW, what that Toss player did to you in the beta (gateway proxy) is just as all-in as a rush. Had you noticed his gate he woulda been toast.
A well timed rush is an art. But rushing in absence of a legit strategy is annoying--but necessary.
BTW, what that Toss player did to you in the beta (gateway proxy) is just as all-in as a rush. Had you noticed his gate he woulda been toast.
A well timed rush is an art. But rushing in absence of a legit strategy is annoying--but necessary.