Poll: School District about to Get Sued

[Small Waves]

I'm not saying that majority makes it right for them to do that, I'm saying that majority makes it impracticable to stop having the pray. He said that he knows of three atheist people in town (or was it his class?). If he is in such a small minority the better option is to, instead of changing the ceremony, simply let him leave and return after the prayer. It takes two second to set him up in location where he can simply slip out when he's uncomfortable and come back in, noone gets sued and the whole mess is solved. Instead we have to have a big debate about it and have incendiary arguments over the whole thing. (I looked through some of those comments on that web page and my god its like rednecks praising religion but in reverse). There is no reason to make a big mess out of this when the administrations could have easily fixed the situation.

He only knows two people who are atheists. There could very well be many more who kept their mouths shut (and who can blame them since the ONE person who did speak up is now skipping town due to the backlash).

He shouldn't have to leave because a PUBLIC school is ILLEGALLY incorporating religion (separation of church and state, the latter which funds the public schools). If they want to introduce prayer, they better be prepared to say "bye-bye" to their public funding. The majority opinion is irrelevant if they oppress or harm small groups (tyranny of the majority). It's why the gay marriage ban in California was overturned.

 

[AndyFromMonday]

This is a graduation ceremony people! It's illegal to have a mass prayer. If those students and teachers felt the need to hold a prayer they had every right to do so AFTER the ceremony by holding a private one somewhere else. Graduation ceremonies are strictly non religious and there's a reason why prayer is not allowed in school. What this guy is doing is upholding federal law, basically. I'm glad he threatened to contact the ACLU. Prayer and religion should not be encouraged nor discouraged by any school. Remember, schools are supposed to be neutral on things that have nothing to do with learning.

 

[Pat8u]

My school has morning announcement prayers but it is a catholic school
Ot: I don't really understand what this is about

 

[NightHawk21]

I think The reason most people disagree with it is because when you dont believe something but everyone around you is doing something like praying but you dont it feels incredibly awkward and uncomfortable. Imagine being a devout christian graduating from a school where they do a Muslim prayer at the end of it. That and its a Public school paid for by the Federal Government which has deemed Prayer in School is illegal because the Government is supposed to be secular and the education system is part of the Government.

Edit: Also the bible itself says that you should pray in private rather than public. Matthew 6.6

So I'm running under the assumption that prayer is illegal in your US public school system, based on the comments on this board. If that's the case than a Religious prayer has no place in a public school. That being said if its a prayer that doesn't cater to any one religion, well than the kid is being a dick.

As for your edit on Matthew 6.6, its taken extremely out of context.

 

[PinochetIsMyBro]

I have no problem with it as long as they aren't trying to force other people to do it.

 

[Volkov]

The OP's poll is very poorly phrased.

Is it OK to do so in a school, but privately? Sure.
Is it OK to do so in a school, but in something along the lines of a prayer club? Sure.
Are both of the above still "in a school"? Yes.

Is it OK to conduct a prayer at a school-wide event (in a public school)? No, it's against the law.

So I voted "yes", but only because of how the question was phrased.

I say this as a Christian by the way. I wholeheartedly support people like this kid, and other atheists and religious people who advocate for a stricter enforcement of the separation of church and state, and very much dislike people like this kid's schoolteacher who bashed him for speaking out. And my being a Christian is in no way at odds with this. Then again, I am not from the bible belt.

 

[Nurb]

Schools are not the place for "official" spirituality, but can have after-school student led religious groups. Parents can teach religious views if they want.

Prayer at graduation is pretty much the same as an atheist getting up there and saying how great it was kids could graduate from school without the need for a god before handing out diplomas.

It's not a time to push beliefs, just celebrate an achievement.

 

[SvenSirupSon]

Lets see...
I think i heard somewhere I was against the American Constitution somehow :3
But since I am luckily NOT American (smiles with glee)
then Lets see if it would actually be smart thing to do?

Now, giving a country with many religious members...
Then it would not be equal to cheer one religion over the other by the state.
That would be a problem, I assume it was a Christian Prayer, because Its America!
So no, dont make inequality between your citizens and you made a good choice

 

[Torrasque]

Well, if its illegal in his state, then its a pretty easy decision: it should have been removed from his grad.
Personally, I went to a Catholic school, but none of us gave a damn about any of the pomp and religious ceremony. Yes, I am an atheist, and yes I went to a church for my grad, but I don't really care. It didn't really offend me, so /shrug.

But this kid didn't want a prayer at his grad. Whatever his reasoning, thats fine. He shouldn't have to have a prayer at his grad if he didn't want one, and if it is fucking illegal in his state, to have one. The fact that everyone around him makes such an insanely big deal about this all, is not surprising, but really really fucked up.

Good luck kid.

 

[Yopaz]

If he was forced to pray, well that wouldn't be okay, but seriously... complaining about that the school prays. It's no big deal. I am an atheist and I promise you, I am a respectful one as long as no-one tries to convert me or "save" me, but I am a rigid one. I don't believe in anything that hasn't been proved to be real, I say there's a possibility that it's real, but I currently have no proof to confirm it thus I don't believe in it. I find nothing wrong with prayers. Let people pray all they want as long as they don't force it on you. By making sure this didn't happen he actually took away their freedom of religion. So in the big context he's just a big a douche as the ones who want creationism taught in biology.

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

It's okay to pray in school. It is not, however, okay to require or organize prayers in school.

This. They can pray during graduation all they want. But don't organize a school wide prayer. And teachers should never badmouth students like that.

 

[Ithos]

In a country where they still salute their flag in grammar school like there is some evil totalitarian regime, this doesn't really seem like a big deal. If they wan't to praise their one nation under God, let them.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

I think anyone should be allowed to pray anywhere they wish, that includes school. If you refuse their right to prayer, you are taking away their right to their own religious beliefs. They should be able to pray anytime anywhere they wish. It should also be the right of anyone to choose not to.

No one should force their beliefs upon others, those wishing to pray, and those wishing not to.

 

[Twilight_guy]

I'm not saying that majority makes it right for them to do that, I'm saying that majority makes it impracticable to stop having the pray. He said that he knows of three atheist people in town (or was it his class?). If he is in such a small minority the better option is to, instead of changing the ceremony, simply let him leave and return after the prayer. It takes two second to set him up in location where he can simply slip out when he's uncomfortable and come back in, noone gets sued and the whole mess is solved. Instead we have to have a big debate about it and have incendiary arguments over the whole thing. (I looked through some of those comments on that web page and my god its like rednecks praising religion but in reverse). There is no reason to make a big mess out of this when the administrations could have easily fixed the situation.

He only knows two people who are atheists. There could very well be many more who kept their mouths shut (and who can blame them since the ONE person who did speak up is now skipping town due to the backlash).

He shouldn't have to leave because a PUBLIC school is ILLEGALLY incorporating religion (separation of church and state, the latter which funds the public schools). If they want to introduce prayer, they better be prepared to say "bye-bye" to their public funding. The majority opinion is irrelevant if they oppress or harm small groups (tyranny of the majority). It's why the gay marriage ban in California was overturned.

Then why can't they make special accommodations for him then, why is there a big stink over changing the whole ceremony. I guarantee you if they just gave him the option to not participate and not be int he room or be forced to not do anything he doesn't want to while maintaining there current traditions then people wouldn't be calling for his hide and this wouldn't be an issue. Jehovah's witness kids are allowed to not participate in events and special accommodations are made for them. The same thing would work here and there wouldn't be a need for suing. This whole thing has turned into a mess when it didn't need to be. The way this wound up going over is like trying to provide for the disabled by, rather then installing ramps, bulldozing the stairs and ensuring that there are only ramps in their place because the disabled people feel uncomfortable otherwise. This whole thing has become a murky quagmire of religious poo fling rather then a simply accommodation measure.

 

[teebeeohh]

separation of state and church.
meaning absolutely NO organised prayers in public institutions, if people want to they can pray in the broom closet during their lunch break.

 

[Gaiseric]

The kid has balls. I approve.

Yes, but only in a Religion group or something like that(before/after school, during lunch, etc). Enough people get upset as is with just having "God" in the Pledge. I'm open to religions but having religion be a major part of school for such an important day would have made me feel extremely awkward and out of place.

edit: Should he sue? No. Should he move, when possible, to a more open community? Yes.

 

[SenseOfTumour]

Yeah, I'm going to add another voice to 'prayer in school is fine, so long as it's not organised and taking the place of it's opposite, education.'

I'm also entirely in favour of religious education, there's far too many 'anti-religion' atheists out there, and maybe if they learned about the various religions, they'd see that, in the majority, its the people at fault, not the religions.

Sure, there's contradictions and unpleasant sections full of hate in most holy books, however, here's my theory.

'So it states both "Love thy Neighbour" and "Smite the unbeliever", choose. If you chose the smiting, grats, you fail at religion. It's a TEST, dummy!'

 

[Lord_Nemesis]

What. A. Baw.

Who gives a fuck if people are praying around him? It would be a different story if someone or some people were foricng HIM to pray. God, really, some people must just be born douche bags. And the fact America is a Christian country, well maybe, who knows anymore but seriosuly, this lad needs to get a life.