Poll: Suicide - Your opinion
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Meh, the level of cowrdice involved varies. If someone comes back from a war with no legs and a disturbed mind or are in some vegetative and don't want to live anymore I wouldn't think they where a coward for doing it. If it's one of those "I live in an upper middle class family and I'm so dark and abysmal inside" things then they're just a pussy in general. Though I guess regardless of the situation when it all comes down to it, if someone truly hates their life I'm not going to tell them they aren't allowed to end it.
I think that it is wrong because even if times are rough, you can make things better. I would think the only time suicide would be acceptable is if you were gonna be tortured till you die or something similar. Otherwise I think it is just a waste of life.
Funnily enough, your first sentiment more or less tells people to "go out with a bang" while your second worries about fueling ideas like a jihad.Kingsman said:
Aside from that though - it depends on what the 'risk' is. You can easily be down so far that you're mentally broken without having physical pain (though I guess small physical pains automatically come with severe mental pain due to an overkill of stress), and the 'risk' you're talking about is extremely likely not to change anything except add physical pain to your already horrible mental condition. Why is it cowardly to just end it instead of beating the guard in question to have him end it for you? Specifically if you know in advance that your attempt isn't going to change anything.
The point is, modern society has given people the illusion that they have (nearly) full control over their life. They do not. There are some things of which you can know with a 100% certainty rate that they are never going to change for you. Technically, I'm a pessimist like that as well; I know our modern society sucks, and that whatever I'm going to attempt is probably not going to change it, but the difference between me and somebody who'd commit suicide is that I try anyway - basically, the story you pointed out in your last post. I just don't think this makes the other person in question less 'cowardly' than me or anything. I just think he's being more realistic and makes a different choice than me. Not necessarily a bad one. While I don't 'belief' in an afterlife, who knows what might be around.
Also, this all is assuming somebody that far down is even thinking straight, which often, they aren't. Somebody suicidal isn't rationally going to weigh the pros and cons of his life to make a solid decision. Would this make him cowardly? I don't know. It makes his vision clouded, of course - but a peculiar thing called love does exactly the same thing and rarely do we call the lovers of this world cowards for having a clouded judgement.
This an area deep in my heart. I am a rare case, where I have carried out the act of suicide, but been found later/survived. Since age 15 I have been contemplating it. I experimented with drowning and hanging, but found so many problems. People really notice and stop you. (That is how the twisted thinking went.)
From that I ruled out the ones that were impossible to me. No access to guns (Yay... Canada?). I didn't want to involve anyone else, so no jumping in front of things. That left overdoses and jumping.
My first serious attempt involved jumping. Unfortunately (Or fortunately), a family member was nearby and began to chase me as I neared the bridge. I ended up jumping prematurely and only fell about 10 feet onto the side of the hill/cliff. Still being chased I continued to run. Later the same night I climbed the gas pipes on the side of a railway bridge, and strode along that, but the chase and fear of being caught kept me moving forward. Eventually, I was picked up by the police, random car patrol. (Being subject to a manhunt. With dogs. The only thing I am proud of from this event: I beat the dog squads. I outran the police dog squads and they lost me.)I was then taken to the hospital.
Second serious attempt was a few months later. I overdosed taking about 400mg of Olanzapine. This one I backed out of myself about an hour later, by calling the ambulance. After being pumped full of charcoal and spending a while in the mental ward, I went home lacking an permanent damage.
Third one should have killed me. I jumped 50+ feet off of a highway overpass. However, the weather intervened. What I thought was about 3 inches of snow covering the ground was 3 feet. I landed in a hole. Lay there for about 2 minutes thinking,"Wow, fuck me." Then a cop came and asked me all my details. I got up and was escorted to the police car. Apparently I had jumped on the exact boundary of the two precincts,so they had to decide what to do with me. Eventually I was strapped to a spine board and taken to the hospital. Injuries: none.
My final attempt was extremely close. I took all the Olanzapine I had,about 450-500mg. Then I climbed out of a window and ran into a forest. Simple;drugs kill me, forest hides me until drugs kill me. I was disturbed in the forest by something coming from inside of it. (I have no idea what.) So I ran to somewhere new. I never made it. I was found about 24 hours later in a back alley. (Oh, and I will only wearing pants and shoes, I had gotten rid of my shirt and sweater.) I spent 3 days in a coma, strapped to a bed, with tubes in every orifice. EVERY.
Ever had a cathoder? Imagine a foot long tube, that is as thick as a normal pencil, stuck up your penis. It hurts. It burns. And it never feels any different. Oh and damage....well...none.
That is my story.
The reason why for all this. 1. Severe Depression.
2. Meds. Medicine fucked me up bad. Interesting side effects. Long term Muscle spasms, I could not extend my arms beyond about 60 degrees. I had muscle spasm in my throat, where it would close. SO they gave me a counter-drug. This made me start to go blind. I had 20/20, I dropped to needing actual glasses, no idea what my vision was, but everything was a blur. After they took me off, my vision went back to normal. Addiction. I was given a twice daily dose of an anti-anxiety when displaying no signs of anxiety. It was highly addictive. Then they sent me home and took me off cold turkey. That was FUN!
Another nice effect. Zero brain power. I could no think. I was a zombie. I could manage to eat, sleep, breathe and use the bathroom. Sleeping was hard. Eating was hard. Walking was an adventure due to muscle spasms. I couldn't read. Movies were annoying. I had 2 months of this.
3. Misdiagnosis. Ever had specialists fight each other? The psychiatrists all 9 of them (before my current one, so I am on my 10th. IN about 2.5 years) insisted I was psychotic. The psychologists, after testing me extensively. A week of 9-5 testing, said all I had was depression and some social maladjustment. The psychiatrists won. EVEN though I told them I was not. Apparently that is a further sign of it?
YAY CATCH 22.
4. The time (3 months total), spent in different institutions. It's worse than prison. There are more guards, they have more power, more tools, and they force you to take your pills. ALL OF THEM. Ok, some things not allowed. Telling anyone why you are here. (But we did anyway, or at least tried to.) Belts, string, anything made of metal, Most music-if it wasn't 100% what the desk nurses liked-nope, Keys, Coins, Headphones, Paper clips, they would pull the draw cords from our hoodies, laces from our shoes, pencils were by request only. Food was beyond shit. Imagine if you got airplane food for every meal, every single day. No caffeine. Bed by 10. Up by 7. Checkups every 15 minutes. Oh, and you are locked in. Refusal or resistance earns you a needle to the neck. Some off the staff are plain evil. Gays are evil. True gays do not exist. You are just psychotic. This is all things the staff actually said. Misbehavior earns you solitary in a plain, empty, locked white room. WELCOME TO HELL.
5. Form 1. Form 1 is a document that says that you are insane and cannot leave the hospital for 72 hours. AT that point you are to reassessed, by a psychiatrist, usually the one who first formed you. Oh, and once issued, you are pretty much a wanted felon. There is no difference. The police are hunting you with everything.
Quick Summary: 3 Attempts, all completed properly, all fatal. Why, my life was shit. Reasons given above. I survived, no idea why. I just won't fucking die. I don't think I am a coward.
From that I ruled out the ones that were impossible to me. No access to guns (Yay... Canada?). I didn't want to involve anyone else, so no jumping in front of things. That left overdoses and jumping.
My first serious attempt involved jumping. Unfortunately (Or fortunately), a family member was nearby and began to chase me as I neared the bridge. I ended up jumping prematurely and only fell about 10 feet onto the side of the hill/cliff. Still being chased I continued to run. Later the same night I climbed the gas pipes on the side of a railway bridge, and strode along that, but the chase and fear of being caught kept me moving forward. Eventually, I was picked up by the police, random car patrol. (Being subject to a manhunt. With dogs. The only thing I am proud of from this event: I beat the dog squads. I outran the police dog squads and they lost me.)I was then taken to the hospital.
Second serious attempt was a few months later. I overdosed taking about 400mg of Olanzapine. This one I backed out of myself about an hour later, by calling the ambulance. After being pumped full of charcoal and spending a while in the mental ward, I went home lacking an permanent damage.
Third one should have killed me. I jumped 50+ feet off of a highway overpass. However, the weather intervened. What I thought was about 3 inches of snow covering the ground was 3 feet. I landed in a hole. Lay there for about 2 minutes thinking,"Wow, fuck me." Then a cop came and asked me all my details. I got up and was escorted to the police car. Apparently I had jumped on the exact boundary of the two precincts,so they had to decide what to do with me. Eventually I was strapped to a spine board and taken to the hospital. Injuries: none.
My final attempt was extremely close. I took all the Olanzapine I had,about 450-500mg. Then I climbed out of a window and ran into a forest. Simple;drugs kill me, forest hides me until drugs kill me. I was disturbed in the forest by something coming from inside of it. (I have no idea what.) So I ran to somewhere new. I never made it. I was found about 24 hours later in a back alley. (Oh, and I will only wearing pants and shoes, I had gotten rid of my shirt and sweater.) I spent 3 days in a coma, strapped to a bed, with tubes in every orifice. EVERY.
Ever had a cathoder? Imagine a foot long tube, that is as thick as a normal pencil, stuck up your penis. It hurts. It burns. And it never feels any different. Oh and damage....well...none.
That is my story.
The reason why for all this. 1. Severe Depression.
2. Meds. Medicine fucked me up bad. Interesting side effects. Long term Muscle spasms, I could not extend my arms beyond about 60 degrees. I had muscle spasm in my throat, where it would close. SO they gave me a counter-drug. This made me start to go blind. I had 20/20, I dropped to needing actual glasses, no idea what my vision was, but everything was a blur. After they took me off, my vision went back to normal. Addiction. I was given a twice daily dose of an anti-anxiety when displaying no signs of anxiety. It was highly addictive. Then they sent me home and took me off cold turkey. That was FUN!
Another nice effect. Zero brain power. I could no think. I was a zombie. I could manage to eat, sleep, breathe and use the bathroom. Sleeping was hard. Eating was hard. Walking was an adventure due to muscle spasms. I couldn't read. Movies were annoying. I had 2 months of this.
3. Misdiagnosis. Ever had specialists fight each other? The psychiatrists all 9 of them (before my current one, so I am on my 10th. IN about 2.5 years) insisted I was psychotic. The psychologists, after testing me extensively. A week of 9-5 testing, said all I had was depression and some social maladjustment. The psychiatrists won. EVEN though I told them I was not. Apparently that is a further sign of it?
YAY CATCH 22.
4. The time (3 months total), spent in different institutions. It's worse than prison. There are more guards, they have more power, more tools, and they force you to take your pills. ALL OF THEM. Ok, some things not allowed. Telling anyone why you are here. (But we did anyway, or at least tried to.) Belts, string, anything made of metal, Most music-if it wasn't 100% what the desk nurses liked-nope, Keys, Coins, Headphones, Paper clips, they would pull the draw cords from our hoodies, laces from our shoes, pencils were by request only. Food was beyond shit. Imagine if you got airplane food for every meal, every single day. No caffeine. Bed by 10. Up by 7. Checkups every 15 minutes. Oh, and you are locked in. Refusal or resistance earns you a needle to the neck. Some off the staff are plain evil. Gays are evil. True gays do not exist. You are just psychotic. This is all things the staff actually said. Misbehavior earns you solitary in a plain, empty, locked white room. WELCOME TO HELL.
5. Form 1. Form 1 is a document that says that you are insane and cannot leave the hospital for 72 hours. AT that point you are to reassessed, by a psychiatrist, usually the one who first formed you. Oh, and once issued, you are pretty much a wanted felon. There is no difference. The police are hunting you with everything.
Quick Summary: 3 Attempts, all completed properly, all fatal. Why, my life was shit. Reasons given above. I survived, no idea why. I just won't fucking die. I don't think I am a coward.
It's a way to give up, to submiss, but not cowardly. It's just surrendering when you could go on. More weakness than cowardice, I'd say.
I think YOU have misunderstood the implications of how genes work, and I also think you ascribe genes with an intellectual awareness which they lack in reality.Nutcase said:
Will your death affect society as a whole? No probably not. But your genes don't know that. In fact, as far as your genes are concerned you could very well be the last human on earth. Genes doesn't have eyes or a brain. They can't see that this world is an over-populated cesspool. And like with all living things your genes have preprogrammed impulses which the organism is supposed to follow. Impulses like breathing, eating and procreating, and do this as much as possible. Quite simply, all living things are preprogrammed with impulses necessary for their species to survive.
While certain species wokr differently in this regard (like ants for instance who can sacrifice themselves so the queen ant survives) human genes doesn't work this way. Human organisms are preprogrammed for individual survival, like most mammals are.
The difference between humans and most other mammals is the fact that they lack a certain degree of intellect which makes them slaves to their impulses. If you look at some cows, what do they do most of the time? Eat, sleep and procreates. They don't do much else since their brain simply doesn't allow them to question these genetically preprogrammed directives.
Humans on the other hand, can do just that. That's why we have suicide and other strange behaviour. Behaviour that doesn't make any sense at all from a biological perspective.
You're a pretty lousy christian aren't you? Or at least your argument is far from waterproof.BladeOfAkriloth said:
You're able to kill infants in their cribs and rape women as well. Does that mean that God wants you to do that, simply because you can?
Housebroken Lunatic said:
Dude, i woke up 5 mins ago... have a bit of fucking mercy will ya, i can't think straight without booze...
You wish. You see im not a Christian. I can be as merciless as I want, I don't have a God constantly looking over my shoulder. >: )BladeOfAkriloth said:
Anything other than 'depends' is oversimple and wrongheaded... on most general questions, actually, not just this one.
Yes, rather than committing a suicide of your whole being, limit it to just your rational capacities and be like all the other simpletons!BladeOfAkriloth said:
You shouldn't ahve add a depends option, the indifferent people or peopel who don't want to state their opinion will just click that.
I think suicide is selfish if you are getting away from a mental problem or something that doesn't make anyone elses lives worse. Why would you remove yourself form the world and make everyone sad and have to live without you just because you decided that you couldn't handle something thousands if not hundreds of thousand of other people did.
But thats just me.
I think suicide is selfish if you are getting away from a mental problem or something that doesn't make anyone elses lives worse. Why would you remove yourself form the world and make everyone sad and have to live without you just because you decided that you couldn't handle something thousands if not hundreds of thousand of other people did.
But thats just me.