Poll: To the anime haters

[axlryder]

I don't inherently have a problem with Anime or any sort of art style. I've always been indifferent to it myself. The problem is when half of the young adult population is ripping off the exact same style or just making very small changes because they can't come up with their own.

99% of Amercicans who draw "anime" are terrible artists. It's a trend I absolutely hate. They think because anime is somewhat more simplistic that it's easier to draw. Of course, they're wrong, and their complete lack of skill is entirely apparent to anyone with even a modicum of talent or experience. I'm not implying that anime is somehow superior to western art, but so many people post absolute garbage on DA. That said, it's not entirely about originality. There are hardly any really original artists out there, and making a significant tweak to an existing style that visually works is actually a fairly big accomplishment. It's just that so many "artists" are terrible at the style they're emulating, giving the rest of us who draw it a bad name.

All good artists have to start from the same initial point which is drawing from real life. DA artists start from tutorials and since "anime" has the "advantage" of looking "complex" and being "simple" to draw they "learn" the style and never improve. I mean to draw a exaggerated person/squirrel/airplane you have to know how they look in the first place.

This is 100% true of a lot of "anime artists" I've met. Now, to be fair, you don't have to start from real life, but at some point you have to learn it, and I'd agree that it's the best place to start so you don't form bad habits. It's also ironic, as you mention, that often times trying to learn the "style" first impedes them from ever really mastering it. A lot of professional anime artists have some background in still life and life drawing for that very reason (though some monstrously talented ones can skip it). A great example is Yoshihiro Togashi's work. Just compare Level E to Hunter X Hunter.

 

[ex275w]

I don't inherently have a problem with Anime or any sort of art style. I've always been indifferent to it myself. The problem is when half of the young adult population is ripping off the exact same style or just making very small changes because they can't come up with their own.

99% of Amercicans who draw "anime" are terrible artists. It's a trend I absolutely hate. They think because anime is somewhat more simplistic that it's easier to draw. Of course, they're wrong, and their complete lack of skill is entirely apparent to anyone with even a modicum of talent or experience. I'm not implying that anime is somehow superior to western art, but so many people post absolute garbage on DA. That said, it's not entirely about originality. There are hardly any really original artists out there, and making a significant tweak to an existing style that visually works is actually a fairly big accomplishment. It's just that so many "artists" are terrible at the style they're emulating, giving the rest of us who draw it a bad name.

All good artists have to start from the same initial point which is drawing from real life. DA artists start from tutorials and since "anime" has the "advantage" of looking "complex" and being "simple" to draw they "learn" the style and never improve. I mean to draw a exaggerated person/squirrel/airplane you have to know how they look in the first place.

This is 100% true of a lot of "anime artists" I've met. Now, to be fair, you don't have to start from real life, but at some point you have to learn it, and I'd agree that it's the best place to start so you don't form bad habits. It's also ironic, as you mention, that often times trying to learn the "style" first impedes them from ever really mastering it. Almost all professional anime artists have some background in still life and life drawing for that very reason (though some monstrously talented ones can skip past it).

Another important facet in learning to draw is learning from the people who inspired the people who inspired you. If you like anime then you have to study Tezuka who started it all and then his influence who was Disney Disney. This teaches you why certain things are done in anime. For example the crazy hairstyles in some anime come from Astro Boy whose hair was inspired by the creator's bed hair. Big eyes according to Disney are supposed to show more emotion, innocence and pureness, thus making them appealing.

Copying the superficial aspects of the work that has inspired you is terrible at teaching you why you like them.

 

[Animyr]

I don't inherently have a problem with Anime or any sort of art style. I've always been indifferent to it myself. The problem is when half of the young adult population is ripping off the exact same style or just making very small changes because they can't come up with their own.

99% of Amercicans who draw "anime" are terrible artists. It's a trend I absolutely hate. They think because anime is somewhat more simplistic that it's easier to draw. Of course, they're wrong, and their complete lack of skill is entirely apparent to anyone with even a modicum of talent or experience. I'm not implying that anime is somehow superior to western art, but so many people post absolute garbage on DA. That said, it's not entirely about originality. There are hardly any really original artists out there, and making a significant tweak to an existing style that visually works is actually a fairly big accomplishment. It's just that so many "artists" are terrible at the style they're emulating, giving the rest of us who draw it a bad name.

All good artists have to start from the same initial point which is drawing from real life. DA artists start from tutorials and since "anime" has the "advantage" of looking "complex" and being "simple" to draw they "learn" the style and never improve. I mean to draw a exaggerated person/squirrel/airplane you have to know how they look in the first place.

This is 100% true of a lot of "anime artists" I've met. Now, to be fair, you don't have to start from real life, but at some point you have to learn it, and I'd agree that it's the best place to start so you don't form bad habits. It's also ironic, as you mention, that often times trying to learn the "style" first impedes them from ever really mastering it. Almost all professional anime artists have some background in still life and life drawing for that very reason (though some monstrously talented ones can skip past it).

Another important facet in learning to draw is learning from the people who inspired the people who inspired you. If you like anime then you have to study Tezuka who started it all and then his influence who was Disney Disney. This teaches you why certain things are done in anime. For example the crazy hairstyles in some anime come from Astro Boy whose hair was inspired by the creator's bed hair. Big eyes according to Disney are supposed to show more emotion, innocence and pureness, thus making them appealing.

Copying the superficial aspects of the work that has inspired you is terrible at teaching you why you like them.

The general feeling I've gotten from my art classes about the anime craze (and other past crazes) is that it's okay to be inspired by someone else as long as you make the your work your own. After all, all professional art programs start with realism. Once you learn the rules you can break them. Same with copying individual styles, except nobody these days seems interested in breaking them. And if someone did, a bunch of people would start copying them. Just how it works. For centuries it was considered hip to imitate Raphael. Eventually people got tired and went back to fellow ninja turtle Da Vinci, or turned to abstracts stuff.

 

[SuperBelkar]

What generally turns me off to anime is that a lot of the plots can be boiled down to: a quest for revenge OR to prove I'm the strongest. Now I must stress that this is not all of them, but certainly enough to make up a significant portion of the base.

Furthermore, what bothers me the most is a lack of relatable characters. I was watching this one series -Claymore- which I thought started out pretty good. Here's this chick who can barely keep up with this monstrosity and is basically getting her ass kicked until someone distracts the thing and she kills it, but by the end of the series she's so frickin' over-powered that I'm not exactly sure what's a threat to her or not. She's basically operating on the level of a minor Greek god, and I've lost total investment in her character. Same issue with Van Helsing, and Dragon Ball.

I also gave another series 'gunslinger girls' a shot, but had to quit because I encountered the same problem in a different context. The characters basically acted like unfeeling robots, and I just can't bring myself to care about a plot that boils down to 'they needed to do this thing, so they did.'(over-arching plot of the series not withstanding because I wasn't able to make it past Episode 3)

Alternately, I LOVED Desert Punk, I LOVED FMA, I LOVED The Last Airbender (Yes, I know that's Amerime now ask me if I care). These were all about the characters; learning, growing, fucking up, making difficult decisions, and even though Aang and Edward basically had superpowers it was still pretty clear what the limits of their respective abilities were in any given context.

Give me more anime like that!

I agree with you about all of that, but I want to add something. The biggest thing that turns people off to anime is that it is, without any comparison, stylized. It is the only thing remotely like it, so it would be understandable why one may be turned off to the idea. It is made to entertain a group of people interested in its fashion. You can't expect everyone to like something made especially for you.

On a different note. I don't really know anything about Desert Punk or FMA, but I never liked Avatar. I always knew, from the moment I saw that bald headed child, that he would win. Hands down. Sure he made a mistake or two, but it never really caused any of his friends to die, and a show about children that has no threat of death means he could pull dumb crap all day long with no repercussions. If it is going to end with good guys win, bad guys lose, and not even asking me to think about it, I just don't see the point of investing all that time with an age group that I don't even care about. As for "character development," understand that they are kids, in ten years they won't even be the same person, so who cares about what their ideological beliefs are. Damn, this is longer than my actual point.

 

[ex275w]

I don't inherently have a problem with Anime or any sort of art style. I've always been indifferent to it myself. The problem is when half of the young adult population is ripping off the exact same style or just making very small changes because they can't come up with their own.

99% of Amercicans who draw "anime" are terrible artists. It's a trend I absolutely hate. They think because anime is somewhat more simplistic that it's easier to draw. Of course, they're wrong, and their complete lack of skill is entirely apparent to anyone with even a modicum of talent or experience. I'm not implying that anime is somehow superior to western art, but so many people post absolute garbage on DA. That said, it's not entirely about originality. There are hardly any really original artists out there, and making a significant tweak to an existing style that visually works is actually a fairly big accomplishment. It's just that so many "artists" are terrible at the style they're emulating, giving the rest of us who draw it a bad name.

All good artists have to start from the same initial point which is drawing from real life. DA artists start from tutorials and since "anime" has the "advantage" of looking "complex" and being "simple" to draw they "learn" the style and never improve. I mean to draw a exaggerated person/squirrel/airplane you have to know how they look in the first place.

This is 100% true of a lot of "anime artists" I've met. Now, to be fair, you don't have to start from real life, but at some point you have to learn it, and I'd agree that it's the best place to start so you don't form bad habits. It's also ironic, as you mention, that often times trying to learn the "style" first impedes them from ever really mastering it. Almost all professional anime artists have some background in still life and life drawing for that very reason (though some monstrously talented ones can skip past it).

Another important facet in learning to draw is learning from the people who inspired the people who inspired you. If you like anime then you have to study Tezuka who started it all and then his influence who was Disney Disney. This teaches you why certain things are done in anime. For example the crazy hairstyles in some anime come from Astro Boy whose hair was inspired by the creator's bed hair. Big eyes according to Disney are supposed to show more emotion, innocence and pureness, thus making them appealing.

Copying the superficial aspects of the work that has inspired you is terrible at teaching you why you like them.

The general feeling I've gotten from my art classes about the anime craze (and other past crazes) is that it's okay to be inspired by someone else as long as you make the your work your own. After all, all professional art programs start with realism. Once you learn the rules you can break them. Same with copying individual styles, except nobody these days seems interested in breaking them. And if someone did, a bunch of people would start copying them. Just how it works. For centuries it was considered hip to imitate Raphael. Eventually people got tired and went back to fellow ninja turtle Da Vinci, or turned to abstracts stuff.

Oh yeah I totally forgot about tweaking or "breaking" the style you like to fit your own aesthetics Yeah the final point in learning from other people and the people who inspired them is to eventually make the flavor your own.

 

[CrimsonBlaze]

I enjoy watching anime and with the exception of one anime in particular, I like all styles of anime, so long as they are interesting, deep, imaginative, and provide a good narrative and/or action.

Some of my favorite animes include DBZ (English dub), Bleach (Japanese dub), Eureka Seven (any dub with subs), Season 1 of Soul Eater (Japanese dub), Hellsing Ultimate (English dub), and Gurren Lagann (any dub with subs).

 

[tacotrainwreck]

I'll be honest. As an official anime hater, I don't know what any of those terms mean. Probably because I don't watch anime. Because I hate it.

I'm such a hater.

 

[loc978]

I find it odd that you listed Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo as two different animation styles...

But I'm more a fan of recent(ish) Madhouse productions. Black Lagoon would be a prime example.

 

[axlryder]

I find it odd that you listed Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo as two different animation styles...

But I'm more a fan of recent(ish) Madhouse productions. Black Lagoon would be a prime example.

They've both got a pretty distinctive visual style. Bebop generally has more realistic features with sloping curves, whereas Champloo has more slightly more pixie features with sharper angles. Reflecting on this post, I realize how silly it was for me to presume non-anime fans would be able to distinguish these things.

 

[axlryder]

welp, I did a quick sketch after reading through this thread again, just to see if I could make something that wouldn't make non-anime fans vomit on sight while still retaining that anime aesthetic.

Spoiler

crappy anatomy aside, thoughts?

 

[lapan]

I don't watch any form of cartoon to be honest. They're not shown at the hours I watch TV, and if there's no human emotion for me to care about, there's got to be humour. I find anime lacking in this department, so it's a no for me.

There is enough of comedy manga, though the cultural differences are deinitely a big problem here. Much of it can get lost in translation or us westeners can't relate to it.

 

[Bassik]

Myazaki style = spirited away?
Not only did I like that one, I think it was done really well, something I don't say often about anime.

 

[axlryder]

If you dislike anime only for its artstyle you're really shallow.

I present you one of the worst characters designs ever. (Imo of course).

Spoiler

http://www.defensoresdetoquio.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/FrontPageImage.jpg
Characters looks so tall and slim.

Buut it still manages to be on of the greatest anime, according to a lot of sites, and me ^^

I honestly don't think that's true. Anime is mostly just entertainment. Thus it is designed to entertain and visually appeal to us. If one doesn't find it visually appealing, then they aren't going to easily enjoy it or get invested in it. There are some decent shows I've turned away from simply because the visuals didn't grab me. I don't think it makes me shallow, visuals are just very important to me. I think the same could be said of anyone else. Yes, some people are definitely close minded about the whole thing, but not all. Some people just really can't get into the visuals.

Also, what's that image of? The link doesn't work.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

I like Highschool of the Dead style.......
Massive tits and zombies FTW! ^_^

You'd possibly like stuff like High School DxD. That is if you put an emphasis on the former. Em moving on from that I'd say other as it would probably be better if the poll was done by studios with examples.