Poll: Unschooling: Parenting at it's worst

[ObsessiveSketch]

I'm not a "social butterfly" myself, but I don't want to be. I keep to myself. I can't speak on the US education system but here I still think it is rushing many children, especially those with learning difficulties. There needs to be less focus on being competitive both in schools and in the world.

Idk, I'd say that most schools here (at least on the West Coast) are fairly supportive to mentally challenged students. Competition is good because it promotes progress. If there's nobody to compete against, there's less incentive to try. And I still don't understand all this talk of 'rushing.' The US system of education is one of the slowest, most stagnant system that I'm aware of. "No child left behind' forced schools to dumb down everything to meet the lowest common denominator, so I can't really see where this sense of 'rush' is coming from.

Welp, good luck to you. If it works for you, that's fine, I've just noticed that while homeschooled kids get an adequate (maybe even better) education, they may struggle in the business world because it's usually based on interaction. Think about interviews, marketing, debate, etc. From my experience with homeschooled students, I wouldn't count on them doing very well with a job.

I have no intention of being involved in the business world. I don't want to work in a large company or in an office. I'm not to bothered what job I end up with as long as it pays my bills and I enjoy it. I think it will probably be the same with these "unschooling" kids.

They don't have a high school diploma, much less a College degree. Their futures are shit as far as comfort goes. I could sympathize with unschooling if it was like a trade school type of thing, such as plumbing, construction, all that. Y'know, learning to DO something? As far as I can tell from this article, the parents are just letting their kids do f**k all. What if they discover that they really enjoy, say, architecture? Or writing stories? Tough shit, they wasted the first 15-some years of their life when they could've been cultivating their interests. No matter how 'free-minded' they are, without the papers they're just another dumbass. I've known some brilliant people who dropped out of high school, and it just shot their life to hell. It's not that they lack the skills, it's that any place of employment isn't going to look twice at somebody with NO education.

 

[bobknowsall]

No OP, you're not being narrow-minded.
Isn't their a law against not sending your child to school?

Only in certain places. The States are okay with it, and so are the UK and Ireland. But you do have to get assessed to see if you're fit to teach your kids.

And yes, he is being narrow-minded. He's basing his assumptions on a single video, as opposed to doing a bit of research.

I'm predominantly self-taught, and I guess I could be considered an unschooler (Textbooks and other school resources are used, but my study routine is up to me), so maybe I'm a bit biased. Unschooling requires a huge amount of internal motivation, and these parents seem to be approaching it entirely the wrong way. They're not guiding their kids towards interests that would be beneficial in the long run, and that won't end well.

 

[bobknowsall]

They don't have a high school diploma, much less a College degree. Their futures are shit as far as comfort goes. I could sympathize with unschooling if it was like a trade school type of thing, such as plumbing, construction, all that. Y'know, learning to DO something? As far as I can tell from this article, the parents are just letting their kids do f**k all. What if they discover that they really enjoy, say, architecture? Or writing stories? Tough shit, they wasted the first 15-some years of their life when they could've been cultivating their interests. No matter how 'free-minded' they are, without the papers they're just another dumbass. I've known some brilliant people who dropped out of high school, and it just shot their life to hell. It's not that they lack the skills, it's that any place of employment isn't going to look twice at somebody with NO education.

Okay, I'm going to call you out on this one. The self-taught and home-educated can get high school diplomas where I come from, but they have to study for the exams and get a decent grade. They've got basically the same chances as a high school student, and it's effort that will determine whether or not they succeed.

(In response to an earlier comment about homeschoolers and employment: I've been holding down a job for quite some time, and my method of education means that I can balance work and study. Maybe I'm an exception, but please don't label a group as unfit for employment without citing some specific examples of unschoolers who sucked at their jobs.)

 

[Flames66]

My argument is if it harms no one, do what you will. If these people can find some way to support themselves without living off the state then there is no argument against the way they were taught.

 

[firedfns13]

I've learned a lot on my own but that's because I'm a loner. Most kids/students would never learn anything on their own, nor would they ever have any interaction with people in society. School's the one spot that I interact with people on a daily basis, most days I get up, go to school, then spend the next 8 hours playing videogames, working out, and reading.

So no, school > unschooling.

 

[FinalHeart95]

I see the reasoning behind it, in that children will learn from their mistakes. Unfortunately, mistakes such as not bothering to learn how to multiply will put you severely behind in society and could give you a permanent disadvantage. This would only work if you had kids who new what was best for them out of the womb, which, obviously, NEVER HAPPENS.

 

[Ph0t0n1c Ph34r]

If everyone was "unschooled" we'd lose any form of advanced science that involved anything more than a linear function.

My goodness I went to the website

But, what about math?

It's easy to see how children can learn many things without using traditional, formal methods of teaching, but many people see math as a huge stumbling block, mainly, because most of us have learned to hate math because of the way it was taught in school. There are a great many ways to encounter math in the real world. Geometry can be found in quilt making, algebra in painting a room. Shifting perspectives, from textbooks to the real world is sometimes difficult, but math that is actually used is math truly learned.

Where will the calculus come from! Nooo!

Maybe they will need to paint the area under a parabola, and want to know the exact amount of paint needed. Boom. There you go.

 

[microwaviblerabbit]

While I do not agree with no school, since it makes you interact with people who aren't your family, I do think that less time in school is a better thing. This goes along with standardized testing, why does a single test mean more than an entire term of study and work?
I know that there used to be a system where only students who were around the failing line had to take the finals, while anyone decently above didn't. So hypothetically a term mark of 75% or higher means that you don't have exams. So you have more time to work/play/whatever.

Also, bring back shop! Being able to fix your house/car or build basic things is far more useful than learning how to balance chemical equations unless you aim for a scientific career.

 

[KP Shadow]

children aren't fucking animals.

*in Christopher Walken voice* Well, biologically, they are, but I guess that's beside your point.

OT: Look, I believe that the "unschoolers" should have their kids do what I do, go to a "regular" (I.E. Public, Private, Catholic or some other standardized curriculum-based) school for the required stuff, and pursue their own interests in independant studies (for instance, I pursue my interest in art through making figurines, and in video games and intellectual discussion through this place, and two other sites (mainly because there are almost no "true" gamers in my school, some of them making up games and consoles such as "Pokémon GayRainbow Version", and the "Xbox 720", just to get the "true" gamers such as myself pissed off).)

 

[Plurralbles]

Gross. Disgusting. you have to have a semblance of structure and education to even KNOW WHAT YOUR INTERESTS ARE! I would probably enjoy being afarmer, but I find Software a hell of a lot more intersting and fun and I would never have gotten to this point without having a semblance of duty and responsibility and time management and skills that are gained from the numerous subjects that are taught in school.

To unschool is to relegate your child to being limited in their options and are keeping someone that could be genuinely happier doing something else, to being relegated to farming or a garbage job. I respect farming, that's why I think it's important to ahve a real education so you can make the decision to yourself, NOT your scumbag parents.

 

[Plazmatic]

If everyone was "unschooled" we'd lose any form of advanced science that involved anything more than a linear function.

My goodness I went to the website

But, what about math?

It's easy to see how children can learn many things without using traditional, formal methods of teaching, but many people see math as a huge stumbling block, mainly, because most of us have learned to hate math because of the way it was taught in school. There are a great many ways to encounter math in the real world. Geometry can be found in quilt making, algebra in painting a room. Shifting perspectives, from textbooks to the real world is sometimes difficult, but math that is actually used is math truly learned.

Where will the calculus come from! Nooo!

Ok how do you learn about sine, cosine, and tangent from a FUCKING QUILT, and how do you learn the quadratic formula in PAINTING A FRIGGEN ROOM, or actually SINCE WHEN DO YOU LEARN MATH AT ALL IN "painting a room".

 

[Nadiril]

I have just finished school, and I now see that my life would of been total shit if I was "unschooled". If I had followed my interest I would of spent roughly 10-12 hours a day playing videogames and roughly 0 doing work or study. If it wasn't for school I would never of learnt that I was really good at math, nor would I have learnt how to write an essay which any university course requires. To the people going on about how they shouldn't have grades, the entire point of having grades and exams is to prove that your competent in the subject, so that when you get to university or other educational institute you won't freak out that you have to actually study for something.

 

[BlueTomfoolery]

I'm going to say something in the hopes that it wasn't said before:

School doubles as a babysitting program! Parents must send their kids to school so they don't worry about their wellbeing while at work.

If you look at it that way, it's a babysitting program for idiot parents. Would anyone send someone to a babysitting program to be belittled, insulted, and hurt?

Sheesh, man. Not every kid in the world is suffering from bully problems like you.

 

[Catalyst6]

I believe there's a phrase that describes this. It starts with a string of curses and ends with "dirty hippies".

This, Timmy, is why the general populace is something of clods. "You're special! You should learn whatever you want!" I think back in that day I wanted to learn about my parents getting as far away from me as possible.

Without structured learning we lose all sense of a standard of knowledge, and boy oh boy is that bad.

 

[Gunner 51]

It seems maybe the problem doesn't so much lie with the teachers, then perhaps government one-size-fits-all education system. But then again, I can only speak of the British system having no idea how the American system works. Though from what you said the two systems are quite similar. (Britain's program is called something like the "National Curriculum")

But I have to admit, I really liked the last line of your post.

Why thank you.

Well, we have No Child Left Behind. Which, from what I gather, is a system where every school year students in elementary schools are tested via standardized tests to chart their 'progress.' And, if the students don't meet the quota the school is penalized. This is something that's administered to kids as young as first grade, who don't give a crap about taking a standardized test seriously (which, nobody really does until college anyways). I'll read up on it to get the full details, but yeah, we have a pretty screwed up school system, especially in L.A.

Thanks for telling me about the No Child Left Behind system you have in the States. It sounds like a pretty good idea, though I've spotted some wriggle room if a School Principal were a little unscrupulous. If a child was to under-achieve, the Principal might not even bother to let the child in question take the exam. (Something like this happened to me during my college years - I was flunking the electronics module pretty badly so the teacher didn't enter me in for the exam.)

 

[Raptorace18]

GET TO DA SHUTTLE! THE WORLD HAS AT LONG LAST GONE TRULY INSANE! But seriously i don't think I have herad anything more stupid in my life.

 

[AndyFromMonday]

Look, I believe that the "unschoolers" should have their kids do what I do, go to a "regular" (I.E. Public, Private, Catholic or some other standardized curriculum-based) school for the required stuff, and pursue their own interests in independant studies (for instance, I pursue my interest in art through making figurines, and in video games and intellectual discussion through this place, and two other sites (mainly because there are almost no "true" gamers in my school, some of them making up games and consoles such as "Pokémon GayRainbow Version", and the "Xbox 720", just to get the "true" gamers such as myself pissed off).)

Why should children and parents have to do that? I remember when I got into high school and how certain people were brought to tears when they found out they didn't qualify to study the subjects they applied for. It didn't matter that at those subjects their grades were high, all that mattered was the fact that they didn't excel in other subjects whilst in school. It's complete and utter bullshit.

There NEEDS to be an educational reform. We CANNOT keep the current system which deems people a failure due to the fact that they excelled in certain subjects and in others not. It's like saying that a general school graduate cannot study literature due to the fact that his grades at biology were low.

 

[GothmogII]

It sounds like a good idea, and a fun idea, but in practicality it isn't a good idea.
The world isn't full of fairytales, flowers and all that stuff. The real world is a hard place.

Where is all this fairy tale crap coming from? I'm just quoting you to make a point, but far far to many people in this thread are working under a misrepresentation of unschooling, not that mind you some aspects of it are probably not helping it.

Secondly, the video is frankly not a good representation. We will recall now the many many news programs and documentaries that focus on gaming and gaming culture, programs that are overwhelming negative and make sure only to pick those worst affected by their habits and hold them up as a prime example of what gaming does to young people. This is no different and requires you to a least go out and do your own research before coming to any damning conclusions. Something an average forum user is highly unlikely to do, hah.

Should I also care to point out that even the news report calls them 'radical unschoolers', as in: Departing markedly from the usual or customary; extreme.