Poll: What is the biggest problem with the Mass Effect 3 ending? (spoilers!)

[random281]

Actually, for all of those saying that 'galactic civilization will recover', there's a glaring plot hole because of an established canon event in ME2. In the "Arrival" expansion, a mass effect relay is destroyed, and it is explicitly stated (and shown) that they have enough power to destroy the entire solar system they are stationed in. So... when *all* the Mass Relays blow up at the end of ME3 (any ending), there go a heck of a lot of solar systems. Including Earth.

I'm fairly sure that can be explained away because the Crucible used all the energy of the Relays. It released the energy in a different form then the explosion in Arrival.

That said, the energy wave that gently passed by Soldiers fighting on Earth somehow generated enough force to knock out the engine of the Normandy, they might just have pulled it completely out of their ass.

 

[Uszi]

People are pissed because with the last 20-30 minutes of game play, they decide they're totally going to change the tone of the whole 3 game series.

I don't think you can have a fan-service, feel good science fiction game that ends on such a bitter, incomplete note.... Not without alienating people.

 

[SajuukKhar]

People are pissed because with the last 20-30 minutes of game play, they decide they're totally going to change the tone of the whole 3 game series.

I don't think you can have a fan-service, feel good science fiction game that ends on such a bitter, incomplete note.... Not without alienating people.

Yes because destroying the devices the badguys used to technological and socially enslave all races in the galaxy thus freeing them to build a future of their own, on their own terms, free from the limits of the badguys, is a incomplete ending?

 

[Aprilgold]

It wasn't bittersweet, it was a god damn tragedy. And it didn't make any logical sense. Best case scenario the entire galaxy is ruined. No more space travel. And what the hell is going to happen to all the people in those ships above Earth? What's gonna happen to their families? Are they all supposed to live on Earth after that? And what of people who lived on The Citadel? And what happened to your crew? Not to mention that the ending makes the entire journey pointless. Choices, heroic acts, sacrifices. All pointless. Mordin died for nothing. Legion too. And Kaiden in my ME. Countless others.

Not to mention that Reapers motivations have nothing to do with what Sovereign and Harbinger have been saying all along. Their motivation is basically a wrong opinion. Reapers: "We are incomprehensible. We have an opinion about something and we're gonna kill everyone because of it. It doesn't matter that Shepard proved our opinion is wrong when Joker started dating EDI and when the geth and quarians achieved peace. Not to mention that organics fight each other all the time so it really has nothing to do with organics vs. synthetics. We're not actually incomprehensible, we're just retarded."

Reaper motivations should never have been revealed. Once you describe something as incomprehensible, leave it at that because whatever you reveal will be disappointing. But Bioware didn't stop there. They did something far worse. They introduced the creator of Reapers. That presents another problem now. Who the fuck created the creator, and why? Just fuckin' leave it a mystery. I always thought that Reapers originated from another galaxy. Maybe they do the same to other galaxies and that's why it takes them 50,000 years to reach ours? It would be better to leave us with our own thoughts about their existence. Those were my thoughts. And now they're rendered useless as is the rest of Mass Effect. The most beautiful video game trilogy in the world was destroyed in 5 minutes.

You hit it on the head.

Good job sir.

Or good job madam.

 

[random281]

Yes because destroying the devices the badguys used to technological and socially enslave all races in the galaxy thus freeing them to build a future of their own, on their own terms, free from the limits of the badguys, is a incomplete ending?

Even if we were to accept your version of event, You don't really free yourself, you're freed by Catalyst.

You're not given an option that Catalyst hasn't laid out for you. For all we currently know, He now has direct control over the individual evolution of every species in the galaxy rather then the loose control provided through the Mass Relay Trap.

You weren't picking how you were going to be free from him, you simply picked his new solution to the problem.

 

[Blachman201_v1legacy]

Yes because destroying the devices the badguys used to technological and socially enslave all races in the galaxy thus freeing them to build a future of their own, on their own terms, free from the limits of the badguys, is a incomplete ending?

I really don't get what is inherently wrong about using your former oppressor's technology for your own convenience, once you are freed from them.

So the Indians are right now still "technologically and socially enslaved" because they didn't destroy all railroads build under the British Empire when they achieved their independence?

And many European nations are at this moment still under the oppressive thumb of the Roman Empire because they still use the roads laid down by them?

 

[Blachman201_v1legacy]

what annoyed me the most about this ending bioware pulled is its a rip off of the deus ex series.. join with an AI/synthetics, dark age or control.

It was the exact same feeling I got, except that the new dark age ending always becomes true, no matter what option you take.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Yes because destroying the devices the badguys used to technological and socially enslave all races in the galaxy thus freeing them to build a future of their own, on their own terms, free from the limits of the badguys, is a incomplete ending?

I really don't get what is inherently wrong about using your former oppressor's technology for your own convenience, once you are freed from them.

So the Indians are right now still "technologically and socially enslaved" because they didn't destroy all railroads build under the British Empire when they achieved their independence?

And many European nations are at this moment still under the oppressive thumb of the Roman Empire because they still use the roads laid down by them?

Ohh god, your taking everything I said to such an illogical extreme its hard to tell if you are being serious or not.

 

[Blachman201_v1legacy]

Ohh god, your taking everything I said to such an illogical extreme its hard to tell if you are being serious or not.

No please, by all means, explain what is bad about using your former oppressor's technology for your own means. I am genuinely curious about this.

 

[Joccaren]

Everything.
Large Plot Holes, Nowhere near enough context to the events that happen after Shepard makes his choice (Why on Earth is the Normandy is Mass Relay Transit?), Your decisions mean f*** all towards the ending, there is ONE possible 'happy' ending, and even its not happy as the entire Normandy crew is stranded, all the endings are pretty much the same, they pulled one massive Deus Ex Machina there at the end, and that freaking kid thing needs to die in a hole. Not to mention that the Reaper's reasons for killing organics make 0 logical sense at all, and that a 3 year old could come up with a better solution.
"Now son, there are big bad machines that want to kill Organics. What should we do about it?"
Reaper answer:
"Harvest Organics every 50 thousand years and turn them into One of us. One of us. One of us..."
Three year old kid answer:
"Kill the bad things"
Seriously, is it that hard to figure out?
And where did all this crap come from anyway? There were no hints towards it throughout the rest of the series, only minor ones throughout ME3, screaming that it was a 'You know what would be cool, copy Deus Ex stuff and have this be about organics and synthetics!' instead of some F***ing sweet battle on Earth where the Reapers are annihilated. Hell, I wouldn't mind if all of these options were presented in a slightly different way, and somewhat different, but still there. Its the most retarded ending I've seen for a while, and Bioware really needs to rethink their stance on it.

 

[SajuukKhar]

No please, by all means, explain what is bad about using your former oppressor's technology for your own means. I am genuinely curious about this.

Well first off you have to get rid of the notion that
"Using the technology of a different species who designed said technology to be limiting and to force civilizations down a dead end path so they could be destroyed"
Is somehow even remotely equal to
"technology built by our own race designed to make thing better and easier for people"
the very fact you even attempted, quite poorly I might add, to compare the two is almost laughable.
.
.
Secondly The Reapers designed said technology to be limiting and to force civilizations down a dead end path so they could be destroyed.

They WANTED the races of the galaxy to use The Mass relay technology as it is, and base thier technology off of it, because they knew it ultimately lead to a path, which is to say a dead end one, which is to say their own.

Why would we want to continue to use a technology built by a race we "beat" if said technology was designed to limit us?

There isn't a reason, it is silly, pointless, and only means the races of the galaxy would be salves to a master who is long dead.

Now you might bring up the question of "wouldn't they just continue to move past the Mass Relay system?", or something similar, which, in a perfect world, would be true.

However in the Mass effect universe even attempting to study the inside of a Mass Relay, the Keepers, or the Citadel for that matter is so forbidden its practically the worst sin one could commit, worthy of heavy imprisonment or death, and anyone who even attempts to suggest they build their own Mass relays gets laughed at.

The races of the galaxy have lived so long with the though that these things will always be here that they have become unreasonably terrified of ANYTHING that could alter the mass relays. Which is EXACTLY what the reapers wanted.

They keep the races complacent of what they have, and so terrified of maybe losing it, that said races don't ever try to learn about these things and possibly make them better, which is The Reapers worst fear.

This trend of terror has gone on for so long that civilization as is couldn't be convinced to let go of it. The destruction of the Mass relays forces them to do what they normally wouldn't and psychologically couldn't, which is to say do it themselves.

And by doing things themselves they have the ability to move PAST The Reaper's limits because by making it themselves they know about what it is they use, how it is built, how to make more, etc. etc.

 

[Incomer]

Except the fact shepard can live at the end of the game.

Except that's not a choice. You have to farm assets like crazy (or play through DLC's that makes it soo much easier) and then when you reach certain number you are not even given the chance, it just happens. How does number of ships that are fighting for you effect your ability to survive "in-your-face" explosions?

 

[Ronin1325]

ive come to a personal conclusion.. as shepard was dying before glowy reaper kid she/he hallucinated the final ending.

what annoyed me the most about this ending bioware pulled is its a rip off of the deus ex series.. join with an AI/synthetics, dark age or control.

bioware may be free to choose their ending for the series but they had to of seen in playtesting that people would be disapointed with the endings. a series built on what you do makes a difference turns out in the end its just another choose door 1, 2 or 3 to view a final cut scene thats not that different

Actually, the "Hallucination" theory is being discussed aggresively on the Bioware forums.

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9727423

 

[Ronin1325]

The thing of it is, IF it were true, that's one of the meanest tricks played on fans of the game in videogame history. I remember back when Metal Gear Solid came out, when the player fought Psycho Mantis they actually programmed in a trick on the player where he'd take control of the controller and I believe even faked a system malfunction. Many players rebooted their game at that point, losing tons of progress. The 'joke' kind of backfired at the time, creating a fair amount of fan outrage. If Bioware pulls anything like that I fear the repercussions will be a million times that.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

At this point, people are that desperate they are actually hoping it was a hallucination. I know I am because I'm fuckin' furious and I will take anything I can get that isn't what I already got with this ending.

 

[Ronin1325]

Since we're talking about the endings, I don't think I need to warn about spoilers, but just in case-

SPOILERS!

This is from a poster on the Bioware Story/Spoiler forum-

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9769678/2

"Turtlicious wrote...

in another note.

1. The endgame scenario is Indoctrination/Manipulation from the Reapers (Harbinger) trying to force you into choosing to let the Reapers live. Shepard is not awake during the final sceens!

2. Choosing to control the Reapers allows them to live. Reapers win. They will still exist.

3. Choosing to combine organic and synthetic life: Reapers win. They will still exist.

4. Choosing to destroy all synthetic life: Reapers loose. Shepard lives. Reapers die.

5. Choosing to destroy all synthetic life option is more Renegade in appearence. Controlling the Reapers is more Paragon in appearence. The Illusive Man's choice should not be Paragon colors, just as Anderson's choice should not be Renegade.

6. Shepard awakes at the end of destroying Reapers. But Shepard is not awaking from the aftermath. He is awaking from either after he is hit by Harbingers lazer attack on Earth or after the scene with Anderson and the Illusive Man.

7. Stating that all sythetic life will be destroyed will give you pause; destroying the Geth can force you to a different conclusion. This choice exists for the illusion of choice; the other choices are ment to sound better.

8. Shepard does not awake in the other 2 "endings" because you are fully indoctrinated by the choices you made to allow the Reapers to win. "Assuming Control!"

9. Never trust any child construct, be it a ghost or artificial intelligence, or heck even human. They are just creepy.

10. Shepard awakes at the end because he has broken hold of the Reaper's control.

11. Shepard has spent alot of time around Reapers. Soveriegn, various Reaper artifacts, the Human Reaper, 2 Reaper destroyers, the Artifact from "The Arrival." Its foolish to assume there is not some level of
indoctrination.

12. Bioware not only get more $$$ for DLC for the final battle, but big props for INDOCTRINATING A LOT OF ITS OWN PLAYERS! I do not know of another gaming company that has tried to fool all of its consumers, but they look to be the first and reap all of the attention.

13. Look at these screenshots. I believe the 1m1 is a clue, because of how often it shows up, and how human it is, when the ship is supposedly older then the ancients.

14. Definitions:


Catalyst =
1. Chemistry A substance, usually used in small amounts relative to the reactants, that modifies and
increases the rate of a reaction without being consumed in the process.
2. One that precipitates a process or event, especially without being involved in or changed by the consequences


Crucible=
1. A vessel made of a refractory substance such as graphite or porcelain, used for melting and calcining materials
at high temperatures.
2. A severe test, as of patience or belief; a trial. See Synonyms at trial.
3. A place, time, or situation characterized by the confluence of powerful intellectual, social, economic, or political
forces:

15. Shepard is not wearing his armor when he wakes up in the Citadel, implying that this is a dream.


Kitten Tactics:

-The endgame scenario is Indoctrination/Manipulation from the Reapers (Harbinger) trying to force you into choosing to let the Reapers live.
Shepard is not awake during the final scenes.

-Choosing Control - You can not control them, they control you. Shepard says as much to the Illusive Man moments earlier.

-Choosing Synthesis - Allows everyone in the galaxy to be manipulated by Reaper code, like they have done to the Geth multiple times now.

-Choosing Destroy - Breaks the hold the reapers have on Shepard's mind.

-Choosing to destroy all synthetic life option is more Renegade in appearence. Controlling the Reapers is more Paragon in appearence. The Illusive Man's choice should not be Paragon colors, just as Anderson's choice should not be Renegade. The reapers are saying that Destroy is the worst, Control is worse, and Synthesis is the best. They want you to fail.

-Stating that all sythetic life will be destroyed will give you pause; destroying the Geth can force you to a different conclusion. This choice exists for the illusion of choice; the other choices are ment to sound better.

-Shepard wakes up after Destroy, because the Reaper's hold is diminished. Shepard does not awake in the other 2 "endings" because you are fully indoctrinated by the choices you made to allow the Reapers to win. "Assuming Control!"

-The child does not actually exist. He is an attempt to indoctrinate Shepard. Nobody but Shepard ever sees or interacts with the child.

-When Anderson calls for Shepard at the beginning of the game, when Shepard is talking to the child, Shepard turns back and the child is gone. Shepard has been "snapped out of it".

-When Shepard turns towards Anderson after being "snapped out of it", a growl is heard. In the third novel, when Greyson resisted the reapers they would make a growling noise once they realized they didn't have him under complete control.

-During Shepard's final dream with the child, chatter can be heard over the radio about nobody making it to the beam. Shepard is still in London.

-When Shepard catches the child in the final dream, they are both engulfed in flame. Going with the child (the
reapers) means Shepard's destruction.

-Shepard has spent alot of time around Reapers. Soveriegn, various Reaper artifacts, the Human Reaper, 2 Reaper destroyers, the Artifact from "The Arrival." Its foolish to assume there is not some level of indoctrination.

-When Shepard wakes up at the end of Destroy, he/she is waking up in London, after being hit with the laser."

So from what this poster wrote, it's fairly plausible.

Maybe brilliant, I don't know. But still really, really mean.

 

[mgs16925]

Only if you take the genocide choice, and it's contrived as hell.

There is no "genocide" choice

Wiping out all synthetic life, including the Geth, is genocide. You always get that option, not sure how you missed it.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Wiping out all synthetic life, including the Geth, is genocide. You always get that option, not sure how you missed it.

That would depend on your view of what constitutes life.

Secondly as long as the geth have a backup of even some of their programs in a non-sythetic body but instead a normal computer, which would be silly if they didn't, they will very easily survive it

 

[mgs16925]

Wiping out all synthetic life, including the Geth, is genocide. You always get that option, not sure how you missed it.

That would depend on your view of what constitutes life.

Secondly as long as the geth have a backup of even some of their programs in a non-sythetic body but instead a normal computer, which would be silly if they didn't, they will very easily survive it

They are a sentient race, especially after what Legion did. That's all that matters.

As for the backup thing, we are given no indication how the weapon actually works to destroy all synthetics so who knows (the platforms are basically just a computer with legs themselves). It seems like the Reapers would be able to do it too if it works.