Poll: Would you let your kid play (American) football in school?

[ffronw]

*snip*

We're just going around in circles at this point. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Albino Boo]

FRREDDDUM cuz ' Merica.. I got it....

It is literally my job to take care of other's children's health. That is what I am paid to do, and as such yes that is my concern. When I was in school the football team raped a girl in the parking lot, and no, I do not think that should be used to gauge the well being of students. If football didn't exist they would just be playing another sport with less TBI's. It isn't like this is in any way necessary to have happy, healthy well adjusted teenagers. We have invented many games over the years they can invent another that doesn't involve causing brain damage to your opponents.

And in my highschool the Drama club beat a couple with the metal sides of belts and ripped their clothes off in the middle of the hallway between classes because they turned down both of the gay members because they were straight(equality ho!). Oh, and they basically got away with it because they were butt-buddies with our principles(one of the ones involved were also a kid of an administrator) and the victims got punished for being out of uniform. People are awful beings, banning football won't do much there. Small-town politics are so great I tells ya!

No one said banning football would read his quote I was replying to. I said we do not judge all teenagers by " how football players were at his school". Thank you for proving my point. LOL

Where are the 49 million injuries? Perhaps that 79 professional sportsmen are not representative 50 million people. I strongly suggest that you look up sample size and further understand the basic concept of risk. I have not proved you point because you ignored the lack 49 million injuries.

 

[Redryhno]

It'll build character, AND it's fun! That answer the question?

You know what else builds character and is fun?
Woodworking! Swimming! volleyball! Baseball! Scouting! Softball! Kickball! Billiards! Chess! Robotics! and many other things..

All of which come with various risks whether you're playing them properly or not. What are you gonna do if a kid doesn't find those as fun as football or is just completely bored by any/all of them?

I mean, Swimming can lead to brain injuries as well, since not breathing for a while starts the process of shutting down braincells, billiards wrecks all kind of havoc on your arms and back, a softball is literally designed for you to be hit and not have injuries, volleyball is all about stretching your tendons and hitting a ball with your hand, we've covered baseball and kickball already, robotics? Tell me exactly how a kid mainly interested in physical activities is going to want to go over programming and building a glorified channel flipper(most of the time that's what the competitions end up being anyways) out of scrap? What about chess? A game that even alot of board game fanatics find boring? And woodworking? Seriously? The stuff that most kids aren't allowed to do because it involves saws, woodburners, and other things that can maim or seriously injure? That's what you want them doing instead of the chance of a TBI? How about we add in construction work too? Child labor laws be damned, they need to build strength and character and we can't have them doing any of that nasty dreadful football they might get hurt!

I'm gonna keep asking this though, what use is a brain if your body doesn't work and you're not an extraordinary person? Because you need both for pretty much everything in life.

Edit: Can't believe I forgot the Scouts, an organization that has basically become paperwork in the outdoors every once in a while. Where getting Eagle is honestly just something you get to by the time you're 16, and not hard at all to get and honestly has no prestige connected to it anymore because everyone gets it no matter how much their parents did all the requirements for them. Which is part of why I quit at Life, since I got all I was going to get out of the experience and it was just a waste of time anymore. Hell, at least the Girl Scouts learn about safe sex and to be careful who they let in their drawers.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

*snip*

We're just going around in circles at this point. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Yes, we can agree to disagree. However, I do think you know as well as I do that a leg injury doesn't change " who you are" on the inside, it is more of a superficial injury vs a brain injury, With a TBI you risk no longer even being the same "person".

http://www.nasponline.org/publications/cq/39/7/traumatic-brain-injury.aspx

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

FRREDDDUM cuz ' Merica.. I got it....

It is literally my job to take care of other's children's health. That is what I am paid to do, and as such yes that is my concern. When I was in school the football team raped a girl in the parking lot, and no, I do not think that should be used to gauge the well being of students. If football didn't exist they would just be playing another sport with less TBI's. It isn't like this is in any way necessary to have happy, healthy well adjusted teenagers. We have invented many games over the years they can invent another that doesn't involve causing brain damage to your opponents.

And in my highschool the Drama club beat a couple with the metal sides of belts and ripped their clothes off in the middle of the hallway between classes because they turned down both of the gay members because they were straight(equality ho!). Oh, and they basically got away with it because they were butt-buddies with our principles(one of the ones involved were also a kid of an administrator) and the victims got punished for being out of uniform. People are awful beings, banning football won't do much there. Small-town politics are so great I tells ya!

No one said banning football would read his quote I was replying to. I said we do not judge all teenagers by " how football players were at his school". Thank you for proving my point. LOL

Where are the 49 million injuries? Perhaps that 79 professional sportsmen are not representative 50 million people. I strongly suggest that you look up sample size and further understand the basic concept of risk. I have not proved you point because you ignored the lack 49 million injuries.

Those findings are just the beginning, these studies are already under way. The preliminary findings are grim, and the other studies are in progress.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

I fell off a merrygoround (we called them roundabouts) as a youngster because the big kids pushed it too fast. Ended up in hospital, though no problems. Broke my leg too, but that's unrelated.

As to the question at hand, I don't think I'd be keen on my kids playing. Apart from the completely unfathomable rules (I tried playing a Madden demo off of Amiga Power once and had no idea what was going on), I would worry about injuries. That said, I may be looking at this as an adult and thinking about how hard adults smash into each other (especially at 1am in the Bigg Market, amirite Newcastlers? [that was a sex joke]). Certainly, I played rugby at school, and I'm 100% normal. But whatever, I probably wouldn't want my kids playing it, especially not if they had a shot as being a fisherman.

You know what else builds character and is fun?
Woodworking! Swimming! volleyball! Baseball! Scouting! Softball! Kickball! Billiards! Chess! Robotics! and many other things..

Actually, woodwork can mess up your lungs unless you have really good masks - too many fibres, as well as high VOC paints and treatments. And chess gets you bullied. Being a robot would be cool though.

I really really really loved merry go rounds.. LOL
I was sad when they started removing them, but I understand it is for the best. I actually knew 4 people who were sent to the hospital from them growing up, but I still loved them. Yes they have masks and non VOC products as well now to make it safer:
http://www.ecospaints.net/complete-product-list/varnish-and-stains/

Geee just talking about merry go rounds makes me want to drive to another state where they haven't torn them down yet and get on one...

 

[ffronw]

Yes, we can agree to disagree. However, I do think you know as well as I do that a leg injury doesn't change " who you are" on the inside, it is more of a superficial injury vs a brain injury, With a TBU you rick no longer even being the same "person".

http://www.nasponline.org/publications/cq/39/7/traumatic-brain-injury.aspx

*sigh*

I said I wasn't going to do this.

No one is disputing that a brain injury is bad. We're disputing the numbers that you're throwing around. The ones that even the people in the articles you linked say aren't representative. That's all.

They're much lower than that, and they certainly don't rise to the level of banning something.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

Yes, we can agree to disagree. However, I do think you know as well as I do that a leg injury doesn't change " who you are" on the inside, it is more of a superficial injury vs a brain injury, With a TBU you rick no longer even being the same "person".

http://www.nasponline.org/publications/cq/39/7/traumatic-brain-injury.aspx

*sigh*

I said I wasn't going to do this.

No one is disputing that a brain injury is bad. We're disputing the numbers that you're throwing around. The ones that even the people in the articles you linked say aren't representative. That's all.

They're much lower than that, and they certainly don't rise to the level of banning something.

Actually looking at the numbers in children , it is.

"During 2001--2005, an estimated 207,830 emergency department (ED) visits for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities were reported annually, with 65% of TBIs occurring among children aged 5--18"

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6039a1.htm
Those are just the ones that went to the hospital, many times children have concussions and do not tell anyone because they do not realize they should. Now given those are not all from football alone, when we start looking at just those numbers, it is still disturbingly high.

Down on table 3 you can see it doubles some sports and triples from others.

 

[ffronw]

Actually looking at the numbers in children , it is.

"During 2001--2005, an estimated 207,830 emergency department (ED) visits for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities were reported annually, with 65% of TBIs occurring among children aged 5--18"

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6039a1.htm
Those are just the ones that went to the hospital, many times children have concussions and do not tell anyone because they do not realize the should.

OK, this is seriously the last post I am making on this, but I needed to use your number to show how ludicrous this is.

207,830 emergency department (ED) visits for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities were reported annually, with 65% of TBIs occurring among children aged 5--18

That means 135,089 TBIs for kids 5-18.

In 2008, there were 73,941,848 children 18 and under in the US.

So .18% of kids 18 and under. Do you see why we doubt your numbers?

 

[babinro]

Not that I'll ever have children but I can't say I'd want them to ever play a heavy contact sport like Football, Rugby, Boxing or Hockey. I don't much care of the type of entertainment those sports promote despite the incredible skill and athleticism associated with them.

That said, I think the reality of being a parent is that you can't/shouldn't go around crushing your child's dreams. If they are passionate enough about something they'll probably just go do it anyways with or without your consent/support. So while I'd try to direct them elsewhere and maybe act as a bit of a barrier at first...I'd ultimately fold and support them.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

Actually looking at the numbers in children , it is.

"During 2001--2005, an estimated 207,830 emergency department (ED) visits for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities were reported annually, with 65% of TBIs occurring among children aged 5--18"

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6039a1.htm
Those are just the ones that went to the hospital, many times children have concussions and do not tell anyone because they do not realize the should.

OK, this is seriously the last post I am making on this, but I needed to use your number to show how ludicrous this is.

207,830 emergency department (ED) visits for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities were reported annually, with 65% of TBIs occurring among children aged 5--18

That means 135,089 TBIs for kids 5-18.

In 2008, there were 73,941,848 children 18 and under in the US.

So .18% of kids 18 and under. Do you see why we doubt your numbers?

We are talking about kids playing football, not total kids in the US. We would have to take the total number of children playing football vs the number of those who experienced a TBI during that time to gauge an accurate number. You cannot take a kid who sits in their house playing video games all day and compare him to a kid on the football field playing against guys twice his size. that just doesn't make sense! Most kids do not even play football is the issue with the number you came up with.

 

[ffronw]

We are talking about kids playing football, not total kids in the US. We would have to take the total number of children playing football vs the number of those who experienced a TBI during that time to gauge an accurate number. You cannot take a kid who sits in their house playing video games all day and compare him to a kid on the football field playing against guys twice his size. that just doesn't make sense! Most kids do not even play football is the issue with the number you came up with.

Your number is "for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities." No specific mention of football. Could be a kid who fell off the swings, a kid who got beaned by a baseball, or even someone in the stands who fell down the steps.

 

[Albino Boo]

Those findings are just the beginning, these studies are already under way. The preliminary findings are grim, and the other studies are in progress.

Thats 50 million people alive today meaning that they played football as long ago 1960s. The injuries have not shown in 50 years. You cannot extrapolate from 79 people to 50 million.

Lets break down your own figures according to you over 4 year period 130000 children suffered from TBI, making 32500 a year. There are 62 million children in schools in the US now assuming a 50/50 split that leaves 31 million children making the odds about 1 in 3 million and thats making the assumption that 100% of inures are due to football. The odds of being killed by a firework is 1 in 600000, are you going to ban the 4th of July. I strongly suggest that you understand the concept of risk

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

We are talking about kids playing football, not total kids in the US. We would have to take the total number of children playing football vs the number of those who experienced a TBI during that time to gauge an accurate number. You cannot take a kid who sits in their house playing video games all day and compare him to a kid on the football field playing against guys twice his size. that just doesn't make sense! Most kids do not even play football is the issue with the number you came up with.

Your number is "for concussions and other TBIs related to sports and recreation activities." No specific mention of football. Could be a kid who fell off the swings, a kid who got beaned by a baseball, or even someone in the stands who fell down the steps.

I would need to go find a source that compiles the data for all children under 18 from multiple years, then compare that to the number of children playing the sport to have an accurate assessment.I am honestly too lazy to go look for it all and add it up myself and would hope that someone else already has done that neatly for me. Maybe later when I am not getting ready to go out to dinner I will muster up the energy to invest that amount of time and effort to do that for you.

Now don't get me wrong, I understand everyone loves football, my sweety screams at the TV every time his game is on and this has provided me with countless hours of entertainment. I understand that this is a great aggression outlet for growing boys, but I think maybe a punching bag might be as beneficial without the risks of TBI. If there were some way we could alter the game or the equipment to reduce the number of TBI's that would be great, and that should be the first option to consider. We need to get people talking about so that we can have solutions proposed to help resolve it, if we just keep it the way it is, this gets worse not better, as they have shown that the number of sports related TBIS have increased significantly between 2001 and 2009 and we need to find solutions to reduce that.

 

[FPLOON]

Well, sure... If they asked to take part in some junior league and/or just to play it at their school, then of course I'm saying yes... and I would do my best to support them even if it leads to some future trips to the emergency room... Now, if they wanted to stop playing because of the pending head/brain injuries and shit like that, then I would understand and not force them to continue playing a sport like that afterwards...

 

[Phlap]

Sure, I mean why not? I'd rather have a kid with a few cuts and scrapes than a 40 inch waistline.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

Sure, I mean why not? I'd rather have a kid with a few cuts and scrapes than a 40 inch waistline.

I guess you missed this then:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/10/04/college-football-fattens-players-up-and-then-abandons-them.html

"Schools are more than happy to help players bulk up but nothing is done to help them slim down after the cleats get hung up. The consequences are serious and potentially deadly."

 

[freakonaleash]

Could we stop saying handegg? It just makes it sound like all you want to do is mock the sport.

 

[Redryhno]

Sure, I mean why not? I'd rather have a kid with a few cuts and scrapes than a 40 inch waistline.

I guess you missed this then:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/10/04/college-football-fattens-players-up-and-then-abandons-them.html

"Schools are more than happy to help players bulk up but nothing is done to help them slim down after the cleats get hung up. The consequences are serious and potentially deadly."

Considering he said kid, I don't think that article exactly applies