The Big Picture: Sidekicks

[Scarim Coral]

Yup I already know this as I read up on each of them Robin's ages ago (and reading others like Superman Prime) but I kind of suprise how you were able to list the main ones (e.g. that non canon girl Robin from The Dark Knight Return novel)in around 5 minutes!

 

[brazuca]

Comic books get messy when they adapt their content to other media. Batman Under the Red Hood gives a simplified story of Todd story. To keep it simple, nothing animated is cannon until become cannon. Earth 12 (animated) has it own continuity that is the series in itself.

PS: I might be wrong about the number, but it goes like this. What happened in the JLA Series or Justice League as it is known outside of USA, only exist in the series universe.

 

[shintakie10]

The vote for whether or not Jason Todd died, if I recall correctly wasn't it supposed to be like REALLY close, like it was less than 100 votes difference for life or death for him? That's just what I heard, I dunno if it's true.

Anyway, I would say Tim is probably my favorite of the Robins. I was actually reading his Red Robin series for a while, and I think that's the only on-going Batman series I've ever really picked up.

Though now that John Layman is gonna be writing Detective Comics I may have to look into that...

It was incredibly close. The difference was within 100 votes, like you said. Its entirely possible that the difference got made up of dbags who just voted to kill him off just to see if DC would do it.

Fuckers, all of the people who did that. Jason Todd was amazin and while Dick holds a special place in my heart for his place in the Titans, Jason will always be the best in my mind. The problem was the writers seemed to absolutely hate him after Death in the Family. When he came back as the Red Hood it was a great read. This was Batmans failure and showed exactly why its a feckin retarded idea to take children and make them see the worst that humanity has to offer day in and day out. Jason was Batmans greatest failure as a person, as a hero, and as a "father."

But then DC was like "Wait! Batman can't fail!" and fucked up the whole thing by continually retconning the story so that Jason was actually kind of a failure anyway. Then they made him more inept. Then they made him more bloodthirsty. Then they made him even more retarded all to try and say "See! It wasn't Batmans fault! Jason was already destined to fuck up and die." Except it doesnt even make any fuckin sense because it makes Batman look even more like a retard for ever takin Jason under his wing.

Slightly related. Yall wanna see the best animated DC movie which also happens to feature the best Robin ever? Watch Under the Red Hood. Friggin love it.

 

[Mortamus]

Gotta love it, and now I want to go watch Under the Red Hood.

"Well it's been fun...Well, maybe more fun for me, I'm just guessing since you're being awfully quiet."

 

[Aureliano]

Oh Batman. Can't have a lady sidekick or people might stop thinking he's gay. Or people might start thinking that girls can do things.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Good stuff to know. So, what about the short lived sidekicks of batmans come and gone and yet to come? Like Carrie Kelly, from The Dark Knight Returns (though, I could do without the catsuit of The Dark Knight Strikes Again). Is there an episode on them, or is that coming later?

 

[Tiamattt]

Batgirl next week? Or is there not enough to work with?

Material wise there's plenty to work with since off the top of my head there were at least 4 Batgirls, and most of them had plenty of interesting stories to tell.

Sort of on that topic I always thought Stephanie Brown wasn't that bad of a Robin. Yes she did screw up which led to Batman firing her but all the Robins screw up every now and then, so imo it was a little unfair. But I'm guessing it had to be done due to editorial mandate because DC wanted Tim back as Robin, so not really all that big of a deal.

 

[SilverHammerMan]

I do have one small Batman related question is Terry McGinnis canon as Bruce's son in the Batman universe or is he just his son as far as the cartoon goes.

He wasn't his son, just an adopted father figure.

Actually I'm pretty sure he is, something about shadowy government types using nanobots or something to rejigger Terry's dad's reproductive DNA to be identical to Bruce Wayne's (really) in an attempt to create a new Batman. So Terry is kinda Bruce's son biologically.

I liked that you used a very recent picture of the four Robins together, it helps keep the show feel up to date. One thing I will say that you didn't mention I that apparently in the new continuity Tim Drake was never Robin and instead was always Red Robin.

God that was a stupid retcon. I feel like this is going to be one of those occassions were the fans just go "NOPE" to a creator and ignore it, a "Death of the Author" situation ala that one X-Men story were Nightcrawler's dad was really a mutant-demon-guy and it defeated the whole original point of Nightcrawler.
It's just so stupid and it confuses me. Was Tim Drake ever Batman's sidekick now? Was he just sidekicking as Red Robin? I get that they're trying to streamline everything now for their whole 5 year timeline thing, another stupid idea in my opinion especially when applied to the Batman franchise, but Tim Drake is one of the better know Robins, like Bob said. If they were going to get rid of a Robin the could have done worse than getting rid of Damian Wayne, who is really only interesting and likable when cast as the Robin to Dick Grayson's Batman. But that would mean derailing Grant Morrison's whole Bat-God cycle and DC won't do that. Sadly.

Oh yeah, and uh, Bob, good episode.

 

[TitanAura]

I'm in the Tim Drake camp on this one. Being a Batman:TAS child of the 90's, seeing what became of him in the animated universe during "Return of the Joker", cemented him as THE Robin in my book. Not saying I don't like the other Robins but come on.... that series/movie was fucking awesome.

 

[jaymiechan]

I always liked Stephanie Brown as Robin, since I thought she was an interesting character, what with trying to intercept her dad's crimes. The whole Batman firing her thing was, I think, pretty stupid.

It is worse than that; you can read on DC Women Kicking Ass that they never planned on letting her stay as Robin, and in fact don't count her as one, saying it was "just a trial". Basically they only used Steph as Robin to set up the War Games story.

 

[PainInTheAssInternet]

Basically what I got from all these comic book episodes is that it is impossible to make the slightest of a change without fans flipping their lids and demanding the status quo, with the writers more often than not caving in and validating the next outburst.

It's one of the reasons I never got into comic books. With characters like Spiderman, Superman, Batman etc you know that they cannot die or have anyone they care for who has been with them since origin die while those new characters or character-altering story arcs are expendable. How are you supposed to get involved with the character when any and all meaningful actions and reactions can be and frequently are erased at the drop of a hat?

 

[Hindkjar]

We need flowcharts for these episodes !! Brain hurt...

 

[leviadragon99]

You want to know what the really scary thing is? I somehow allready knew most of that allready, despite only following the comics on again-off again.

 

[Random Argument Man]

So.... one Robin got killed after being tortured by *the joker*. The reason for this was *fans let him to die after DC asked them*. (Fans loved it)
Another Robin got killed after being tortured by "the black mask*. The reason for this was *died of torture but could've been saved by somebody when the choice was presented*. (Fans hated it).

After this *sort of* irony, I can safely assume that the gaming community is not the only weird community in geek culture.

 

[Hutzpah Chicken]

So, can the next few episodes focus on something not related to comics? Maybe something about Chuck Cunningham disappearing?

 

[Guffe]

Bob is a psychic nowadays!!??
The "pick up your brains..." part at the end was so me xD
Nice episode!

 

[Trishbot]

Dick Grayson is, in my opinion, one of the greatest heroes EVER. Unlike pretty much EVERY other hero DC has, Dick Grayson is the only one to actually evolve, grow up, mature, and have a fully realized story arc that lasted several decades that DC, thus far, hasn't totally retconned or destroyed.

... Though I REALLY wanted him to stay the official Batman for much longer. Wally West and Kyle Rayner had longer tenures as Flash and Green Lantern, and Dick Grayson's Batman with Damien Wayne as Robin was some of the best, freshest, and most enjoyable Batman stories in decades.

Jason should have stayed dead... or, if he HAD to come back, stay evil. DC has retconned Jason Todd over four times in the past five years.

Stephanie Brown... does she even EXIST in the new universe?

And DC is so confused by Tim Drake right now. They say he was never Robin in this new continuity... yet the new continuity has proven he was Robin in other comics (like Batman #1) so... either DC is retconning their rectcon, or they actually don't even read their other comics.

 

[Zoe Castillo]

--

 

[Mr_Terrific]

Please do a Batgirl. That's way more confusing than Robin.. I've been subscribed to the entire Bat family for years and I still don't know what happened to Stephanie, Helena, Cassandra, or how Barbara Gordan is walking again. There's mention of a surgery in the first...ermm new first issue but since comics are weird...who knows.

I'd also like Bob to sort out wtf is up with the new 52. Again...I'm subscribed to over 20 of them and have no idea why DC's entire history is only 5 years long in some places, and much longer in others. For example... Blackest Night happened just before FP and the new 52. People fought and died and were reborn and stayed dead. Fast forward to New 52 and Blackest Night only happened to Green Lantern and Sinestro? Hell, most of the major plot points didn't happen because characters either don't exist, or don't know each other. ex:Superboy does not know Superman yet and the JSA does not exist. Or Why are there still multiple universes and What exactly was the point of Flashpoint?

Loving some of the new stories but the new 52 overall is more confusing than DC has ever been.

 

[Vault Citizen]

I do have one small Batman related question is Terry McGinnis canon as Bruce's son in the Batman universe or is he just his son as far as the cartoon goes.

He wasn't his son, just an adopted father figure.

Actually I'm pretty sure he is, something about shadowy government types using nanobots or something to rejigger Terry's dad's reproductive DNA to be identical to Bruce Wayne's (really) in an attempt to create a new Batman. So Terry is kinda Bruce's son biologically.

I liked that you used a very recent picture of the four Robins together, it helps keep the show feel up to date. One thing I will say that you didn't mention I that apparently in the new continuity Tim Drake was never Robin and instead was always Red Robin.

God that was a stupid retcon. I feel like this is going to be one of those occassions were the fans just go "NOPE" to a creator and ignore it, a "Death of the Author" situation ala that one X-Men story were Nightcrawler's dad was really a mutant-demon-guy and it defeated the whole original point of Nightcrawler.
It's just so stupid and it confuses me. Was Tim Drake ever Batman's sidekick now? Was he just sidekicking as Red Robin? I get that they're trying to streamline everything now for their whole 5 year timeline thing, another stupid idea in my opinion especially when applied to the Batman franchise, but Tim Drake is one of the better know Robins, like Bob said. If they were going to get rid of a Robin the could have done worse than getting rid of Damian Wayne, who is really only interesting and likable when cast as the Robin to Dick Grayson's Batman. But that would mean derailing Grant Morrison's whole Bat-God cycle and DC won't do that. Sadly.

Oh yeah, and uh,
Bob, good episode.

As you say the retcon is just another reason why trying to shoe horn major elements of the DCU into 5 years was a stupid idea.