The Ending Was Not ME3's Only Problem

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JoesshittyOs

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You do realize that we went through literally all of this shit about 2 weeks after people played Mass Effect 3. I even remember the mindset of it. It was right after people started saying that it was nearly a perfect game besides the ending, and then threads started popping up telling us that there were other problems.

In fact, I think I can even find a few threads worth of this stuff.

Look. This one is even called <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.366302-Problems-with-Mass-Effect-3-unrelated-to-the-ending>"Problems with Mass Effect 3 Unrelated to the Ending", pretty much your exact title with one different word.

That was literally the first thing that popped up when I typed it in the Search Bar. Which really needs to be brought back up. If you want to complain about something -especially a dead horse like Mass Effect 3- use the search bar first. Because odds are, it's been done before. In this case, about a hundred times.

I hate to pull the Search Bar Nazi card (though in all honesty, I really don't), but this is getting ridiculous. You're beating a dead horse. A horse that has been dead for nearly 3 months now. A pulverized skeleton vaguely resembling a horse. It might even be a donkey, we don't know because of how dead it is.
 

Vault101

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Sep 26, 2010
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undeadsuitor said:
Vault101 said:
don't know how I did it...think it was paragon points (not sure if romance tali changes anything)
basically, you need a number of points. You get points by

1. Tali was not exiled (loyal) and you didn't show the evidence for the admirals.
2. Legion must be loyal, and the heretic base must be DESTROYED, not re-written.
3. Save admiral Korris from Rannoch.
4. Deal with geth fighter squardron.


And have a high Paragon/Renegade score. I think you can get away with rewriting the heretics if you did everything else, but I'm not sure.
I re-wrote the geth..so yes it is possible
 

AD-Stu

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undeadsuitor said:
Vault101 said:
don't know how I did it...think it was paragon points (not sure if romance tali changes anything)
basically, you need a number of points. You get points by

1. Tali was not exiled (loyal) and you didn't show the evidence for the admirals.
2. Legion must be loyal, and the heretic base must be DESTROYED, not re-written.
3. Save admiral Korris from Rannoch.
4. Deal with geth fighter squardron.


And have a high Paragon/Renegade score. I think you can get away with rewriting the heretics if you did everything else, but I'm not sure.
Apparently it's so convoluted that there still isn't a definitive answer. Long version is at the bottom of the page here (http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Priority:_Rannoch) but in short:

- You have to have at least four reputation bars (Paragon/Renegade doesn't matter)
- Tali and Legion both need to be there (not Ran or "Geth VI")
- You have to have imported a ME2 save
- You have to save Koris

Those are definite pass/fail requirements, fail any one of them and peace is impossible. After that there's a bunch of other stuff that has at least some effect, including whether or not Tali was exiled, whether you destroyed or rewrote the heretics, whether you resolved the Tali/Legion argument in ME2 successfully and whether or not you dealt with the fighter squadrons (may also be pass/fail).
 

PirateRose

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I feel like the story is a lot of shock and emotionally moments without a lot of logic. The first time I played it was so very tiring to play, not because the battles were difficult, but just because the game just unloads so much emotional crap on you. Playing the second time around, every time that solo piano music starts playing when something "deep" is happening, my eyes roll to the back of my head and I feel like seizing. I can't help feeling half the time, why did I think that this moment was so well done before, it's so incredibly stupid. This game is one massive chunk of PMS.

Then of course, Thane was my favorite character romance or not. I had the expectation that he will die, but the expectation included that I would see him a lot more before that happened. One conversation almost entirely around his miserable sickness and then he dies the next time I see him. He is such a minor character now, he's easily replaced by a minor character from ME1 and the game guide doesn't list him as anything important. It's made worse by the romance because there is no paramour, no I loves, not even friggen tears from female Shepard, no difference from the non-romanced Thane plot, and no one ever talks about him again. There is a conversation with Garrus immediately after about Kaidan/Ashley who died 2 years ago. Somehow that was far more important to Shepard and Garrus than Thane, the guy that went on the much more recent suicide mission and died about an hour ago.

Well no, someone does bring him up frequently. That poor excuse for a villain, the 12-year-old internet douche named Kai Leng likes to trash talk Thane since he is no longer around to kick Leng's weak ass. I really wish Thane was healthier enough to have just killed Leng off so I would have one less thing to hate the game for.

No back to crappy romance, even if I wanted to move my Shepard on from Thane, Kaidan friend-zoned my Shepard because I didn't buy him booze and all that was left were lesbian relationships. I'm happy Bioware finally embraced homosexual relationships in the game, but that was ridiculous for female Shepard. Vega's a vagina tease, Joker has "standards" and would rather do a robot, Garrus is only available if you imported his romance and goes after Tali, and Javik while completely unprovoked for romance turns Shepard down. Then Jacob, I can not believe they did that. Despite all the flack that guy got, there were a minority of fans that loved that character and passed up all the other romances for him only to find out near the end of the game he couldn't wait and had moved on. The nice guy, the down to earth, none angsty romancable guy gets turned into an cheating ass reminiscent of his own father that he spoke out so strongly against.

The auto-dialogue really kills the game for me. There was too much of it in ME3 and replaying makes it so much more painfully apparent as it doesn't seem like the conversations change at all. Even though I'm picking different options Shepard says the same stuff. When you actually get to pick something Shepard's tone just goes from one extreme to another, but then after that Shepard's saying the same stuff no matter what. You can even see it in the first ten minutes of the game. One of the conversations that really irked me was when you get to first talk to Vega on the Normandy, and Shepard's (in my case female) only options are to flirt or be a *****. There's no middle option for Shepard to just be interested in making a friend. There's no middle option for the entire game except I think for when Liara brings up her time capsule.

Why the hell did they take out the middle option. RPG's basically all have the same three personality types going on, super good/selfless hero, unsure/down to earth hero, evil/rebellious hero. What the crap happened to the unsure/down to earth hero type?

ME1 was too far the other extreme, Shepard couldn't say a word without the player picking an option and that led the character to being too flat and boring. Shepard would stand and watch everyone else carry on entire conversations without saying anything.


ME2 had this perfect balance, were you had your choices that actually influenced the auto dialogue then would go back to another choice that could take the conversation in another direction and influence the dialogue more. Up until ME3 came out, I was still discovering conversations I completely missed because I didn't explore everything yet.

With ME3, I feel like there is no point in replaying. Besides the endings pretty much making all Shepard's efforts feel pointless, the story is emotional crap, there's no appealing romance options to me, and Shepard as a playable character is sorely limited. They might as well have saved themselves time and money, said to hell with it and made Shepard male, default appearance, have him romanced with Liara, no dialogue options period, only one personality and only one ending.

It just seems like they became as attached to Shepard as the players have and formed a strong opinion on how Shepard should look, behave, and who he is with.


I have a feeling if there are future Mass Effect games it will have nothing to do with player choice anymore and the games will be more like the rest of the action adventure games out there like Assassins Creed.

Or perhaps they'll just retcon stuff, place it 300+ years later, and make a RPGMMO with shallow characters and story that will bore me to tears.

Otherwise, the combat in ME3 is great and I love multiplayer for allowing me to only play that and avoid the tragic headache of a single player story.
 

RedDeadFred

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May 13, 2009
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Another Mass Effect 3 thread? ANOTHER ONE?!

Hasn't this been done to death enough? Is their a rule against this sort of thing? It's really just getting old and is more and more seeming like a plea for comments since everyone of these thread seems to get a ton of comments.

I honestly think we've bludgeoned the game enough. Now we're just kicking it while it's down.
 

Ascarus

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Jitters Caffeine said:
As long as you've imported a character from the previous games, or even just from ME2, you can get MORE than enough War Assets without multiplayer. I have over 6500 before I got too antsy and just went to the finale.
while this is mostly true,
if you want the couple second end shot of shepherd taking in a breath
after choosing red, green or blue, you need an EMS > 5000 (4000?). either way that number cannot be reached without participating in the MP game.

fuck that bullshit. MP participation should never impact the SP campaign in any way. period.
 

Ascarus

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Wakikifudge said:
Another Mass Effect 3 thread? ANOTHER ONE?!

Hasn't this been done to death enough? Is their a rule against this sort of thing? It's really just getting old and is more and more seeming like a plea for comments since everyone of these thread seems to get a ton of comments.

I honestly think we've bludgeoned the game enough. Now we're just kicking it while it's down.
don't want to read the content of a thread that clearly states what its contents are? don't click the link.

"problem" solved.
 

Jitters Caffeine

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Ascarus said:
while this is mostly true,
if you want the couple second end shot of shepherd taking in a breath
after choosing red, green or blue, you need an EMS > 5000 (4000?). either way that number cannot be reached without participating in the MP game.

fuck that bullshit. MP participation should never impact the SP campaign in any way. period.
Like I said, I had 6500 war assets and finished the game before I ever touched the multiplayer, so I know for a fact it's 100% possible to beat the game with the required amount of EMS without playing the multiplayer once. You just have to import a game from at least ME2 to have enough.

But if you ask me, if you jump into the third game of a trilogy without playing the first two, you aren't allowed to complain about it not catering to your every whim.
 

SweetLiquidSnake

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its been 2 months... please let it go...... please... pick up skyrim again.... just play something else... let it goo!!!!
 

Ascarus

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Jitters Caffeine said:
Ascarus said:
while this is mostly true,
if you want the couple second end shot of shepherd taking in a breath
after choosing red, green or blue, you need an EMS > 5000 (4000?). either way that number cannot be reached without participating in the MP game.

fuck that bullshit. MP participation should never impact the SP campaign in any way. period.
Like I said, I had 6500 war assets and finished the game before I ever touched the multiplayer, so I know for a fact it's 100% possible to beat the game with the required amount of EMS without playing the multiplayer once.
yes it is possible to get the "special" GREEN ending. you cannot get the other part i mentioned without participating in the MP game. and that is bullshit. esp if it impacts future DLCs in some fashion ... which remains to be seen.
 

WanderingFool

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Emiscary said:
NO. STOP. SHUT UP.

I don't care if you liked the ending.

I don't care if you didn't like it.

And I ESPECIALLY don't care that *you* don't care about the above two opinions. (You know who you are, meta-complainers of the world.)

Now then, here are the main reasons that ME3 (while still being a good game all things considered) does not deserve to be rated as objectively perfect:

1. "Galactic Readiness"

This whole concept is basically the gaming equivalent of a ham-fisted segue.

"And now, MULTIPLAYER!"

I *think* the reasoning behind putting this gobshite into the game was to try and incentivise people who were only interested in player single player into giving the multi player a shot. Now, I consider it a social faux-pas for a layperson to tell a professional how to do his job, but this clearly needs to be said:

EA, when your player base has no interest in a mechanic you're planning on adding to a game you're in the process of developing, the solution is not to coerce them into playing it. The solution is *to not fucking add the mechanic to the game*. If that's not an option? Keep it segregated from the rest of the experience. If the MP can stand up on it's own two legs? Wonderful. If not, then at least you didn't give anyone the impression of having their arm twisted to do shit they didn't wanna do.

2. The Quest Tracking

Anyone who's actually played the game can tell you what a nightmarish clusterfuck the quest menu in ME3 is. See the Angryjoe review on youtube if you want more explanation/some pretty visuals.

3. Invisible Characters

This is a pretty common graphics glitch. I'd need the use of both hands and feet to count the number of times I was catapulted from any sense of immersion by a quick chat with The Hollow Man.

4. Fuglyface Imports

If you've spent some time on the BSN, you can probably name about 12 different threads in which 1000s of people with custom Shepard faces complain that upon import into ME3 their character appears to have suffered botched plastic surgery. And if the screenshots are any indication, the problem is far from solved.

5. The Rachni

Again, putting aside the ending, the consequences of choosing to save/kill the Queen in ME1 where nowhere near as profound as advertised. Basically the choice amounts to 1 model being reskinned, and a different modulator being used to voice it.

6. "The Crucible"

Hey, a secret Prothean weapons plan archived on Mars! Why it wasn't mentioned until now? Liara? Garrus? Dr. Chakwas? Huh, I guess we'll never know...

7. Writers Playing Favorites With Squadmates

Mass Effect 1 had a relatively small party that wanted for diversity. Mass Effect 2 had a huge cast of wildly different squadmates. What's more, you had the option of gaining their loyalty by spending time with/on them- or just ignoring them completely! It seemed like we were gonna have even more control over our squad's composition in the final installment... and then it came out. Here's the rundown: Garrus & Liara are your best friends and confidants, the Virmire survivor is back, Tali shows up eventually, EDI is your tech expert... and some white guy who got run over by a tequila bootlegger is your muscle. Everyone else is sidelined, regardless of prior choice. Including your potential love interests.

Oh, and I can still call bullshit on Javik/day 1 DLC because it's got fuck all to do with the games conclusion. Javik is the ONLY interesting new addition to the crew, and he costs 10 bucks.

8. So... if The Collectors had technology that could instantly seek out an immobilize entire populations...

Why the hell did it take *THE REAPERS* -y'know, the hyper-advanced biotechnological monstrosities that built a system of interstellar FTL relays- an entire game to round up and crush the human resistance?

Seriously, I want this explained. The Illusive Man himself bangs on about how powerful/advanced The Reapers are...

"LOOK WHAT THEY CAN DO!"

So someone explain to me how guerilla tactics designed to baffle squads of human soldiers with guns held them in check for *WEEKS*. (And remember, Earth had no outside support. They were 1 planet completely cut off and overrun by the bulk of The Reaper fleet for the entire duration of the game.)
Wow... complaints about ME3 that didnt include the ending. I didnt think these existed.

As much as I loved ME3, all the points you mentioned are actually pretty accurate, and I agree with you on most. The only thing I dont is the multiplayer, as I kinda enjoy it. Though the system to unlock new weapons, mods, and characters is crap...
 

Jitters Caffeine

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Ascarus said:
Jitters Caffeine said:
Ascarus said:
while this is mostly true,
if you want the couple second end shot of shepherd taking in a breath
after choosing red, green or blue, you need an EMS > 5000 (4000?). either way that number cannot be reached without participating in the MP game.

fuck that bullshit. MP participation should never impact the SP campaign in any way. period.
Like I said, I had 6500 war assets and finished the game before I ever touched the multiplayer, so I know for a fact it's 100% possible to beat the game with the required amount of EMS without playing the multiplayer once.
yes it is possible to get the "special" GREEN ending. you cannot get the other part i mentioned without participating in the MP game. and that is bullshit. esp if it impacts future DLCs in some fashion ... which remains to be seen.
I went with the RED ending and even got the special little scene at the end, even without playing the multiplayer. The only way you would "need" to play the multiplayer is if you didn't have an imported character. Otherwise, yes there are not enough War Assets available in the "default" stand alone story of Mass Effect 3 to get the special scene at the end.
 

Corporal Yakob

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Caramel Frappe said:
Emiscary said:

I agree almost with every point you've made OP. Also despite importing my character from ME1 to ME2, then ME2 to ME3- I still get a ton of bullcrap from the Alliance and from the Council.

ME1 Council: "Oh saved us from the Reaper have you? We'll just ignore you completely and debate about politics that only involve the Citedal, nothing further then that."

ME2 Council: "Saved colonies from the Collectors have you? That is cool- wait you blew up a Mass Relay so the Reapers couldn't invade us?! We're stripping you of everything Shepard!!."
(Oh yeah, you need to buy the DLC to know why Shepard was grounded, because in ME3's opening he is on Earth without the player knowing what's going on and why Shepard isn't a Commander anymore.)

Such bullcrap. I may be an all out Paragon type of guy, but I felt like punching the Council at times for being completely useless. They have done nothing for me, if just giving me a title to do whatever I want around the galaxy. That's it while I have to work my butt off saving everyone.

Besides that, ME3 has more flaws then what the OP has addressed so far. For instance, you need to buy very expensive cargo in order to unlock decent stuff on multiplayer. Rather then unlocking everything by leveling up, you just have to spend money on cargo that's always random and for the most part- you don't get what you wanted unless you're willing to pay real microsoft points to achieve stuff.

Overall ME3 is a great game, but why can't I have all my squad mates with me? I did everything in ME2 to save them and when I met them again in ME3, they only became war assets. Ugh, luckily I didn't romance any of them but I did feel sad that Jack couldn't be with me. She was a very interesting character who became a better person thanks to me from the Paragon influence.

.. The biggest flaw is ME3's ending but everyone knows that already. It's probably the worst ending I have ever came across and honestly it left a scar on my heart- which is a very bad thing to do to your customers who've invested over 200 hours of gameplay into a series Bioware.
For the love of robo-Jesus Mass Effect multiplayer: give me my Geth character already!!!! Stop giving me pistols whenever I buy your Spectre packs!!!!
 

Corporal Yakob

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Jitters Caffeine said:
Ascarus said:
while this is mostly true,
if you want the couple second end shot of shepherd taking in a breath
after choosing red, green or blue, you need an EMS > 5000 (4000?). either way that number cannot be reached without participating in the MP game.

fuck that bullshit. MP participation should never impact the SP campaign in any way. period.
Like I said, I had 6500 war assets and finished the game before I ever touched the multiplayer, so I know for a fact it's 100% possible to beat the game with the required amount of EMS without playing the multiplayer once. You just have to import a game from at least ME2 to have enough.

But if you ask me, if you jump into the third game of a trilogy without playing the first two, you aren't allowed to complain about it not catering to your every whim.
!?!

How did you get that many war assets without going online? I've imported my save from the very first game and the most I can get is roughly 3100!
 

WanderingFool

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[sub]Image chosen for lols, not for desire of such option in game...[/sub]

WHY THE FUCK IS THERE NO KROGAN TEAMMATE!?
 

Jitters Caffeine

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Corporal Yakob said:
!?!

How did you get that many war assets without going online? I've imported my save from the very first game and the most I can get is roughly 3100!
You need to go around to the different systems and scan every planet you can. You'll find random assets like "Asari Sniper Squad" that aren't attached to any quests, but are just there to add to your numbers.

WanderingFool said:

[sub]Image chosen for lols, not for desire of such option in game...[/sub]

WHY THE FUCK IS THERE NO KROGAN TEAMMATE!?
Because you've already had two, and this time you don't have the time to go around and build a new team. They only really introduced a handful of new characters into your crew, and they were all Alliance members. I don't think there would be very many Krogan in the Alliance Military.
 

4173

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Vault101 said:
4173 said:
Anyone else get massive cognitive dissonance from the conflicting "band together, life itself is at risk, your grudges are petty right now" stuff in most of the game, with the "Earth is teh awesome, racism is cool" bits.
where did you get that impression from?

Okay, I may have exaggerated a tad. But they never [even tried] selling me on the idea that Earth was some important strategic target (obviously once the Citadel is moved it is important, but that's near the end of the game). From the beginning it was "help me save Earth, and then I'll get around to your planets."

That leads into another problem; the Protheans held out for 500 years, and the current Galaxy already needs to use the McGuffin or be wiped out? Hell, if you get enough war assets, the game even tells you something to the effect "everybody is holding their own, and even winning in some key locations!"


Vault101 said:
4173 said:
it was frustrating that everyone was off being petty "WE R GONNA FIGHT DA GETH!!! YEEEAH QUARIANS RULE!!!" <- did you guys catch an infection that makes you retarded?
Especially the Salarians if you cure the genophage

Honestly, what part of "MAKE. YOU. EXTINCT." did you not understand?


It really makes me want to just take my crew, grab some fertile couples from each race and go live in a jungle on some distant planet. After all, we have no idea how the Reapers detect their targets. If they track some sort of technological emissions, going all Swiss Family Robinson might totally punk them.