The Ethics of "Project Harpoon"

[Sanderpower]

I never said they should be free to do as they please. That doesn't mean they will face consequences and it's silly to think that they will. Also your comparisons are just...laughable and are not in any way the same thing. You're comparing rape to having photos online edited.

I should make it clear that I'm not saying humiliating edited photos are on par with rape. Rather, it's comparable because of victim blaming. "If you don't want people to do (bad thing X), don't do (completely acceptable thing Y)".

It's less victim blaming and more "You know this shit happens in reality and you know the people responsible are rarely made to face the consequences, so why are you expecting something different all of a sudden?"

So somebody who puts a picture online should expect random strangers to begin sharing said picture? Okay fair enough, but that doesn't mean that the people who are taking the pictures are in the right. There is a huge difference in "expecting something" and "accepting something". You can expect people to not give a rat's ass about other people's privacy online, however that doesn't mean it should be accepted.

 

[Neonsilver]

So 4chan started a reactionary movement called "Project Harpoon". This was a response to photoshopped images of female video game characters, designed to have the proportions of the average American female (ie. overweight). The response was a campaign to photoshop overweight people who used social media, whether they were professional or amateur models, or even members of the public who had the audacity to post a selfie to Facebook or Twitter.

The project's Facebook and Instagram pages were taken down after numerous reports, and as usual they've cried censorship. While the original set of images, as well as similar fat-advocacy campaigns are tasteless and insulting, I believe "Project Harpoon" have fought fire with napalm here. I don't even believe that fat-shaming is the issue, but rather an invasion of people's privacy. As much as "Project Harpoon" claim to want to advocate "healthiness", they were clearly seeking to provoke.

When an anti-SJW page I followed posted about it, I expressed my thoughts about the invasion of privacy. The responses I got were... troubling. I was called an SJW and a shill of course, but what bothered me was how privacy wasn't an issue with anyone. In fact, I was told that "if you don't want your photos edited, don't post your photos on the internet". Actually, the responses to many news articles about the page expressed a complete lack of concern for privacy.

How did I find out about the page? A friend of mine had a photo of hers edited and posted on the page. She was absolutely humiliated, and I filed my own report against the page because of that. According to Facebook's own community standards, the page was unacceptable (because it featured altered images of private individuals).

So what do you think? Did "Project Harpoon" have the right to do what they did? Was it a valid response to fat-positive feminist campaigns?

In regards to the privacy issue, I don't think anyone has much right to complain if they upload pictures and make them available for everyone.

In regards to the original videogame character pictures and project harpoon, the only difference I see, is that the videogame characters can't complain about being used like this. I don't see much of a message in either sets of pictures.

 

[Qizx]

So 4chan started a reactionary movement called "Project Harpoon". This was a response to photoshopped images of female video game characters, designed to have the proportions of the average American female (ie. overweight). The response was a campaign to photoshop overweight people who used social media, whether they were professional or amateur models, or even members of the public who had the audacity to post a selfie to Facebook or Twitter.

The project's Facebook and Instagram pages were taken down after numerous reports, and as usual they've cried censorship. While the original set of images, as well as similar fat-advocacy campaigns are tasteless and insulting, I believe "Project Harpoon" have fought fire with napalm here. I don't even believe that fat-shaming is the issue, but rather an invasion of people's privacy. As much as "Project Harpoon" claim to want to advocate "healthiness", they were clearly seeking to provoke.

When an anti-SJW page I followed posted about it, I expressed my thoughts about the invasion of privacy. The responses I got were... troubling. I was called an SJW and a shill of course, but what bothered me was how privacy wasn't an issue with anyone. In fact, I was told that "if you don't want your photos edited, don't post your photos on the internet". Actually, the responses to many news articles about the page expressed a complete lack of concern for privacy.

How did I find out about the page? A friend of mine had a photo of hers edited and posted on the page. She was absolutely humiliated, and I filed my own report against the page because of that. According to Facebook's own community standards, the page was unacceptable (because it featured altered images of private individuals).

So what do you think? Did "Project Harpoon" have the right to do what they did? Was it a valid response to fat-positive feminist campaigns?

Well the argument "don't post your photos online if you want privacy" is kinda a solid arguement. Once you're out there online it's not that easy to keep it entirely private for all. There's concern for privacy, then there's the reality of privacy on the internet.

Also fuck fat advocacy, if a bunch of lazy fucks want to take pride in their overweight joy then be my guest. But don't start hating and then warping images of people who put the effort in to take care of their bodies because you're a lazy ****.

I agree with not posting photos of yourself on the internet if you're gonna get really upset when random wankers mess with it. Once you give out your photo, it's up to whoever you've given it to in order to be a custodian. If I gave my photo out to people on the street I would fully expect at least a few people to draw dicks on them, or worse.

 

[Quellist]

Nah, IMO it was cruelty and trolling, plain and simple. The hateful remarks that accompanied those pictures were frequently worse than the pictures themselves.

Also they never photoshopped the breasts smaller for some reason...

 

[chikusho]

It's like the difference between telling somebody she's an ugly cow and telling your friend, in private, that this fat girl you saw was ugly.

More like the difference between telling somebody she's an ugly cow and plastering a doctored, embarrassing photograph along highways and bus stops to encourage everyone to publicly mock the person from a safe distance.

OT: This thing, like all similar efforts that came before it, are nothing more than a thinly veiled excuse to be dipshits for sadistic reasons.

 

[madster11]

I can't believe a thread with a few dickheads posting some really badly photoshopped images has managed to make the entire world mad so successfully.

Actually makes me very worried about the new stock market crashing thing that's going on over there, i initially wrote it off as hopeless but now...

 

[Queen Michael]

It's like the difference between telling somebody she's an ugly cow and telling your friend, in private, that this fat girl you saw was ugly.

More like the difference between telling somebody she's an ugly cow and plastering a doctored, embarrassing photograph along highways and bus stops to encourage everyone to publicly mock the person from a safe distance.

Gotta admit, your phrasing is better than mine was. =)

 

[Sigmund Av Volsung]

"if you don't want your photos edited, don't post your photos on the internet"

I think I'm gonna print that, frame it and hang it up on my wall.

I bet these folks are completely fine with the NSA and GCHQ looking up their photos as well? I mean, it's technically also on the internet, right? Like say, your GPS data, your facebook profile, your search history, your friends and families, your hopes, your dreams, your favourite movies, your favourite music, etc. etc.

Suffice to say I automatically think that the invasion of privacy is bad across the board. I don't care for what cause or for what intent, it is illegal and makes people complicit in accepting that their privacy is like their bloody phone when they get mugged for it.

 

[ThreeName]

To begin with, copyright is innate. So anything a person makes is copyrighted by default.
Secondly, the Terms of Service for Facebook (and pretty much any similar site) don't negate your ownership. That is complete and utter paranoid and or delusional nonsense.

This is incorrect. A number of years ago my friends were involved in a "scandal" (to use the term loosely), and the national media used photos taken from their Facebook and put them on the front page. They were unable to legally act upon this despite A) Having taken the photos themselves and B) Being the subjects of the photos.

Photos publicly put on Facebook are public property.

 

[Alleged_Alec]

Did "Project Harpoon" have the right to do what they did? Was it a valid response to fat-positive feminist campaigns?

Yes to the first, and no to the second (not sure how strong the connection between fat-positive and feminism is anyway).

I have the right, as a response anything anyone says about anything, to loudly declare that I'm an annoying tosser. It's not a useful thing for me to do, and I shouldn't be surprised if people think I'm an annoying tosser, however.

It's 4chan being stereotypically 4chan, I don't think we need spend too much time wondering if this is a good way to behave.

I agree with all of that, especially the 4Chan bit. Reddit, 8Chan, and a lot of places don't deserve their reputation (only some parts do), but 4Chan? Fuck 4Chan.

Apparently you've never been to 4chan then. Most of it is pretty okay.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

Should I feel bad that I understood the basic gist of what this is about by just the name of the topic alone? lol



But yes, fat people are people, it's not their fault that those ugly as hell photoshops were made. Going after random people who did nothing wrong is not smart.

 

[Dizchu]

Apparently you've never been to 4chan then. Most of it is pretty okay.

Everything on 4chan can be found elsewhere, with fewer insufferable people. Sure. /b/ is the worst board where all the edgy 12 year olds go to spout the nonsense their parents won't allow them to say, but that attitude is pretty ubiquitous across the whole site.

"if you don't want your photos edited, don't post your photos on the internet"

I think I'm gonna print that, frame it and hang it up on my wall.

I bet these folks are completely fine with the NSA and GCHQ looking up their photos as well? I mean, it's technically also on the internet, right? Like say, your GPS data, your facebook profile, your search history, your friends and families, your hopes, your dreams, your favourite movies, your favourite music, etc. etc.

To be honest it's easy for these guys to say things like that because they use anime girls as avatars wherever they go, even on Facebook. This "that's how the internet works, get over it" attitude probably wouldn't apply if their private photos were altered and spread around for ridicule, or if photos of their family members were.

I mean right now, I can find a random person on Facebook, stalk them, send them harassment... and because they chose to use Facebook, that makes it okay?

They shot themselves in the foot when they decided to take random people's pictures off of social media in "response" to something that was nothing like the thing they're doing. Fictional characters aren't the same as real random people on the Internet, so it's clear that excuse is just a bullshit excuse to shame, for some bizarre but sadly unsurprising reason, women. There appeared to be a small handful of guys there, but the vast majority seems to women from what I've seen.

There's several reasons why they've primarily targeted women. First of all, the original set of images focussed exclusively on women. Secondly, fat-acceptance it commonly regarded as a feminist movement, the implication being that fat women are less likely to be accepted than fat men. Recently there's been a little bit of a "dad bod" appreciation, but it commonly applies to men that once fit the "ideal" and have "let themselves go a bit" after settling down to raise kids.

But the real reason why I think they're targeting women in particular? I am fairly sure that these guys aren't exactly "in shape" themselves. As much as they'd like you to believe that they frequent the gym and eat their veggies, let's not kid ourselves. 4chan is a community of self-loathing, comprised mostly of socially inept males. When they see overweight women comfortable with their size, they'd rather tear them down than accept that their own perceptions of the real world are delusional.

 

[PainInTheAssInternet]

There's nothing ethical about it. It's 4chan. Try to read 4chan with anything but negative implications.

Also, since I personally know someone who has had their privacy violated, I can attest that "simply don't let unpleasant photos exist" is the only safeguard against the likes of 4channers. It sucks even harder because they like that power.

 

[Kathinka]

Holy crap, this is brilliant.

If it started out as trolling or not, I actually think this is a good thing.
Showing people how they could look if they achieved realistic goals? That's gotta be motivating.

Plus the entertainment value. I haven't seen this much salt on Facebook in years.

 

[Dizchu]

"Original set"? The first ones they made or the fictional characters one?

The "this is what female video game characters would look like with average proportions" one. Apart from that, the focus on "unrealistic depictions" is primarily on female characters. Whether or not you or I believe that they had valid points to make, it's no wonder that the response would target women. I have a feeling they threw in a few men just so they have something to point at to "prove" they're not misogynists.

Showing people how they could look if they achieved realistic goals? That's gotta be motivating.

On the contrary, ridicule is likely to demotivate weight loss than promote it. The way to motivate people to lose weight is with encouragement. If someone tried to quit smoking, would you berate them for smoking in the first place or congratulate them for their progress in kicking the habit?

 

[Kathinka]

Showing people how they could look if they achieved realistic goals? That's gotta be motivating.

On the contrary, ridicule is likely to demotivate weight loss than promote it. The way to motivate people to lose weight is with encouragement. If someone tried to quit smoking, would you berate them for smoking in the first place or congratulate them for their progress in kicking the habit?

I don't see anyone being ridiculed. Hell, on the FB page and on their subreddit people are lining up REQUESTING to be shopped for these exact reasons.

As a matter of fact, many coaches that get paid heaps of money to help their clients to be motivated to attain their goals employ this EXACT strategy: Do away with negative thoughts and doubts ("Why am I so fat?") and instead formulate a positive, enthusiastic goal. ("I want an awesome attractive body with a fit physique and visible muscle definition!")
This is precisely this.
All this butthurt is just the result of the current trend to label stating anything but cuddly feel-good hugbox "everyone is perfect <3" phrases as "offensive", "shaming" or "discrimination."

 

[The Almighty Aardvark]

I don't see anyone being ridiculed. Hell, on the FB page and on their subreddit people are lining up REQUESTING to be shopped for these exact reasons.

As a matter of fact, many coaches that get paid heaps of money to help their clients to be motivated to attain their goals employ this EXACT strategy: Do away with negative thoughts and doubts ("Why am I so fat?") and instead formulate a positive, enthusiastic goal. ("I want an awesome attractive body with a fit physique and visible muscle definition!")
This is precisely this.
All this butthurt is just the result of the current trend to label stating anything but cuddly feel-good hugbox "everyone is perfect <3" phrases as "offensive", "shaming" or "discrimination."

And all power to the people who actually want to be photoshopped. The problem is that they're taking people who don't, often people who are expressively comfortable with how they look, "fixing" their appearance for them, and implying that they look like whales via the name. The OP herself mentioned she had a friend who felt humiliated by it, but hell, you don't think it's a big deal so she should probably get over it.

EDIT:

Uh, yeah, this project is clearly all about positivity.

Spoiler

Behold another one of the "whales" targeted by this movement

Spoiler

She is pretty fit, and it's clear that there's no way that she could ever become the photo-shopped version they made of her. This is actually, just the way that her body is shaped. I coached a girl who climbed the hardest in my entire team (she wasn't the strongest, but she tried way harder than everyone else), and she was still bigger than this woman. This is seriously beyond ridiculous.

The crazy thing is that the people running this seem to think that they're dealing a blow against the fat acceptance movement, as opposed to giving people something to point at to justify it.

EDIT 2:

Megan Trainor too?

Spoiler

Okay, it's clear this isn't targeting dangerously overweight women, it's targeting women who aren't super-model skinny and are okay with it.