The real problem with sexism

[Jaiko]

Okay! This will be my very first post on the forums of the escapist so I figured why not start it off on a (controversial) topic that always just... Grates on my nerves.

I wish that people would grow up about sexism! The views that many women, and even many men have are just mind mindbogglingly painful!

Now hear me out, I understand the massive spur from women that have been demanding equality with men. To be completely honest I agree with the demands that a woman needs to be allowed to do what ever a guy can do, and that they shouldn't be judged based on gender.

As much as I love the idea for women to get all the equal rights that men have, this is were the problem is as well. Most women I know of will claim that they do not want to be discriminated against because they are a women, but will then hide behind their female label when something they don't want comes up. A great example of this is something that happened many times at my job, Often the girls that I work with would ask me to get something off the top shelves for them because they are a girl and I'm a guy. I know for a fact that if I saw the same girl trying to get something and I said, "Let me get that for you, I'm a guy after all" she would cry sexism on me.

What gets me even more frustrated though is any person, man or women, who will cry for equality, but then will cry sexism if a man punches a woman. If an attack was based on the fact that the target was a woman, then yes it was sexist. However if a woman is being a prick, or outright attacking someone, I think a person should throw a punch just the same way they would if the person was a man... Assuming the person would punch a man. Claiming that a person shouldn't punch a girl for no reason more than she is a girl, is just as sexist as refusing them something they want because they are a girl.

Well that's my rant for now, Discuss please!

 

[DoPo]

In truth I have done none of those things because this topic has been done to death. Also I didn't want to read all that because it looks very boring and has a noteable absence of robots and explosions and exploding robots.

I read half of it and then skimmed over another quarter. I concur, no explosions, nor robots. Yes, and boring, but no robots is the big one.

Would some murder cheer you up?

 

[twistedmic]

You sure it was for that reason?

Because every time I'm asked to get something down from a high shelf it's because I'm tall, not because I'm a guy.

You too suffer from height-ism? It's such a sad state of affairs that us tall people are constantly asked to pull things from, or place things on, high shelves just because we're 'taller'.

 

[bluepilot]

I am a fully grown adult but only reached 4"9 and sometimes reply on tall people and foot ladders to reach things in high places. All of the awesome things are in high places. I am really really really happy when people help me reach stuff. Especially if they are a tall Spock look-a-like. If a someone gets offended because someone offered them help, male or female, they are being rude.

But I am superior to all you tall people because I can fit in a suitcase, ahah!!

 

[Dags90]

Because every time I'm asked to get something down from a high shelf it's because I'm tall, not because I'm a guy.

This sort of makes the OPs anecdote sort of stupid. As a reasonably tall person I've gotten things off of shelves, mainly for women but also for shorter men. Likewise I've sometimes asked guys for help lifting things, not because they're men but because they're stronger than I am.

Not to mention, "Let me get that for you, I'm a guy after all" is probably the most patronizing way to offer assistance.

 

[Ruedyn]

As opposed to all of the fake problems we have addressed thus far in one of out many many MANY threads of this very same topic.

Couldn't you just pull a necro?

 

[axlryder]

To the OP's point, I can't disagree with him that this is an issue that does exist (though his example is dumb). At my job, whenever there is something slightly heavy to be lifted, I'm called upon. Not because the woman I work with are incapable of lifting it (they aren't). It's not because I'm particularly strong (I'm 5'7", 140 pounds, and my strength is merely above average for my size, but I have thin forearms so I actually appear pretty frail). They're also all aware I have a bad joint condition as well, so lifting heavy things puts more strain on my joints than a normal person. Despite that, they still call on me, because I'm a man. It's the same thing with going up on the ladder in the stock room. I know there are woman there capable of climbing ladders and hauling record documents, but I'm still always the one who does it. Hell, there are woman there who are taller than I am. It would make more sense for them to do it. Anyway, even if I flat out refused, I know that they would think less of me because of it, even though I'm no more obligated to do that work than the rest of them. Yet, quite hypocritically, any time some benefit is rendered upon the guys at my workplace, the woman cry sexism, despite they themselves clearly receiving treatment that could be deemed preferential. For instance, the woman are always given first pick to go home early when we're slow if they want to, and granted that request if they ask, whereas the guys are hardly ever granted permission to do so. No, I'm not skewing this situation or lying. This is straight up how it is. I genuinely like most of my co-workers (male and female), and it's not even that big of a deal to me, but it is bullshit.

That said, this really has been done to death. And even if I agree that the issue is there, I don't think this is "the real problem" with sexism. Considering my old co-worker was just recently messaging me about how the assholes at her new job are sending her dirty texts and touching her inappropriately, and HR doesn't seem to give much of a fuck, I'd say there are a lot of other very serious issues with sexism.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Not this again.

Firstly, this has been done over and over again.

Secondly, it's bullshit. There are any number of important gender issues. Women being annoyed with men who say "I'll solve your problems for you, because I'm a man and you aren't" is very obviously not one of them.

 

[Angie7F]

I think sexism exists because it has been around for ever as a fact of life (women are physically weaker and smaller, have to go though pregnancy etc), whereas gender equality is a newer concept so it has not been well though out.

 

[AngleWyrm]

I agree with the demands that a woman needs to be allowed to do what ever a guy can do, and that they shouldn't be judged based on gender.

This is just math fail. Really.

If half of all people on Earth are female, then for every little patch observed to contain More Men Than Women, there must automatically be another little patch somewhere else that contains More Women Than Men.

Funny you don't hear about that patch much. What do you suppose all those women who aren't currently "being allowed" in the boy's clubs doing?

 

[Loonyyy]

I guess the problem is you're acting inherently sexist? You could try looking at things through a bit more of a neutral standpoint (I know it's hard (No sarcasm), but trying to neutralise your biases is a good exercise).

If you're taller, or stronger, helping someone to get something down from a higher place is the LOGICAL division of labour. Generally, women are predisposed to being less strong, and less tall. Those are facts, and it's not a case of discrimination. Of course women are going to need help getting things down more! They're shorter on average! I'm the tallest guy at my work, so when we're getting stuff down from high places, I usually volunteer to help. Whether it's a guy or a girl. Because I'm more capable at that task. If I said "Well, cause you're a shortass, I'ma get this down for you." I'd get weird looks, and depending on the context, I'd probably be disliked by that person. I'd be being a jerk. If you staple "I am a guy after all" on it, you're being a sexist jerk. See how that works?

For a long time, my friend could drive, and I could not. So him giving me a lift home was an obvious division of labour. See how that sort of thing has nothing to do with gender, overall? I was the best at our subject work, so I helped my friends with their work. It's a case of those with a better qualification for the task (Lifting, driving, or maths etc), helping those who are less qualified, in the interests of efficiency.

The other stuff is nonsense. Yes, there's the question of chivalry being sexist (It is, but it's hardly negative), and the case for punching women etc, which, you might notice, is generally not one used as an example by those who believe in equality, nor is it anything to do with that question. You're conflating various opinions as one cohesive view. Which will only end in confusion.

(Also, that stuff about "Serves that ***** right" attitude and "She'll be treated like a man" is really disgusting. If you're saying that, you should be ashamed of yourself. It's a perverse amount of pleasure to take in senseless violence, because it's a woman getting treated "Equally". If you can't see how that's misogynist in the worst way, you should reconsider your philosophy.)

 

[Blunderboy]

You sure it was for that reason?

Because every time I'm asked to get something down from a high shelf it's because I'm tall, not because I'm a guy.

You too suffer from height-ism? It's such a sad state of affairs that us tall people are constantly asked to pull things from, or place things on, high shelves just because we're 'taller'.

I make them pick stuff off the floor for me. Hey, it's only fair. They're closer.

OT - Yeah, it's been done. To death. So no, not touching that one.

 

[Eclipse Dragon]

Welcome to the Escapist, why did you decide to make this your first post?
In the future, I highly recommend using the "forum search" feature before creating a topic.
We have quite a few necromancers here and in some cases it's not exactly a bad thing.

I hope you've learned your first lesson, it's a harsh one, we really are more friendly than this...

Often the girls that I work with would ask me to get something off the top shelves for them because they are a girl and I'm a guy.

Perhaps they are short?
I'm 4'11", I can't get something off the top shelf, when I ask someone to help me, I ask a person that I know can reach. Gender plays no role in my selection.

-------------
That's as much of this topic as I'm touching.
So long everyone, have a wonderful day.

Sincerely,
-Your friendly neighborhood dragon

 

[Zantos]

You sure it was for that reason?

Because every time I'm asked to get something down from a high shelf it's because I'm tall, not because I'm a guy.

You too suffer from height-ism? It's such a sad state of affairs that us tall people are constantly asked to pull things from, or place things on, high shelves just because we're 'taller'.

Dude, you think that's bad? I'm 5'11" which means that depending on who I'm with at the time I can either be the tallest or the shortest in any given group of people. In the morning I can have "Can you get that down?" and "How's the weather up there?", then an afternoon full of "Can you pick that up for me? You're closer" and "D'aaawwwwww, isn't he cute!"

What? OT? Yeah, sexism is bad, but that was last season. This is the season of taking something that a handful of people have said to you, and making it sound like it's a huge thing that everyone thinks or does.

 

[Calibanbutcher]

I brought my flameshield and popcorn, this is gonna be a hoot.
Other than that, I refuse to voice an opinion on the matter, because I am not suicidal.

 

[Chemical Alia]

So, what you're really complaining about is that you don't want to have to help people people who are shorter than you reach things? So much for common courtesy, I guess.

I fail to see how this is indicative of "the real problem with sexism".

 

[AngloDoom]

What gets me even more frustrated though is any person, man or women, who will cry for equality, but then will cry sexism if a man punches a woman.

You're talking about idiots, it seems.

Pro-tip: if you spend your entire life worrying about what the idiots are worrying about...then do we tell the difference between you and an idiot?

If people want to eat dirt and tell each other how sexist it is, don't get angry that no-one steps in and tell them they're wrong. At the end of the day, they're still sitting in a ditch eating dirt off the floor and you're getting on with life.

If you have a problem with something someone is doing, tell them. Don't tell your internet friends - we're the type of friends who only pretend to care and then say nasty names about each other when our backs are turned.