The X-box One is for Publishers, not You.

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BFEL

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I'm not going to buy an Xbone, I'm going to tell my rich uncle not to buy me an Xbone, and if I thought I could get away with it, I would go to Best Buy and throw the entire stock of these abominations in the nearest fire.

I'm following Yahtzee's advice, I'm going PC.
 

go-10

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Xbone will primarily be a kids console, so even if at first they get lots of different games in 2 to 3 years the people who own the console will probably be children that got it as a Christmas gift since most gamers with a disposable income will probably start investing in PC's anyway
 

Nimcha

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Shadowstar38 said:
Publishers aren't going to make a company money. The people buying the product do. This line of reasoning is suicidal.
People will buy it anyway. I don't think Microsoft gives much about the opinions of people on these sort of websites. They are clearly not the people they want as costumers.

Who can blame them.
 

Something Amyss

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Dec 3, 2008
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Haven't multiple Escapist contributors made this exact point already? I thought I'd seen both Jim and Yahtzee cover it in some of their content already.

Anyway, I agree. It's just not a new point.

Soopy said:
The case for my PC build arrived this morning :D.
Sweet, I'm about 3-4 days behind you, depending on the shipping over the weekend!
 

Something Amyss

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Shadowstar38 said:
Publishers aren't going to make a company money. The people buying the product do. This line of reasoning is suicidal.
The gaming consumer has demonstrated time and again their spineless nature. In most industries, I would agree that this was suicidal. In gaming? I think it's going to be profitable.

I hope I'm wrong, but people keep proving me right time and again.
 

Colt47

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Doom972 said:
Soopy said:
Doom972 said:
Soopy said:
All the exclusives in the world won't win shit, if nobody owns the console. The recent backlash against Microsoft would have to be one of the biggest I've ever seen.
The success of the 360 proves otherwise. People are actually willing to pay a monthly subscription to XBL to be able to download patches and play multiplayer.

Many gamers are either uninformed or don't care. Many more will buy it just so they can play their favorite exclusives. This will probably be the most successful console of this generation.
But you don't have to pay a subscription fee in order to download anything. The Gold accounts simply enable users to use multiplayer servers. Which honestly seems kind of fair to me. You can still use XBLA without a subscription.
See, that's exactly the problem: It seems fair to you. After the dust settles and exclusives are announced people will start thinking "It's not that bad", "I can live with it", "Seems fair" - just as they did with the 360.
Actually the X-box gold fee wasn't bad at all... until they turned the entire dashboard into an advertisement board from the pits of Hades and put in anti-class action lawsuit clauses in their EULA. I'm not against paying a monthly fee if it is actually going towards better services, like VOIP and server maintenance, but if I got to sit through advertisements that advertising revenue better be footing the bill. On the Xbox 360 it clearly wasn't.
 

PoolCleaningRobot

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Trinab said:
The exclusives will always win console wars.
If that's true then Nintendo has already won.

I don't really get this line of thinking that Microsoft has to be successful. Exclusives don't mean shit when people physically cannot use the system. All my dude bro friends who own 360's? They live at the dorms at my college which require special permission to connect. Not to mention, our campus's Cincinnati Bell provided Internet service is spotty as hell. If anything, they'll be getting a ps4 and an XB1. As other people have pointed out, some campuses don't even allow consoles in the first place. I admit, I haven't lost my Internet connection in years and 24 hour connections would be no problem for me but there are a lot of people who know they'll lose their connection eventually and for those people you can't just say "its not that bad"

I think publishers will welcome the revenue they can get from the XB1 but I doubt they would miss out on the huge audience for other consoles. If they did, then would have stopped making ports for those "dirty pirates" who use pc. XB1 sales will probably be mediocre
 
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I don't know why publishers and developers feel they have any rights whatsoever to second-hand sales. Books, films, CDs, cars, clothes, toys and anything else one cares to name can be and are frequently traded by their owners. For some reason however, games developers feel they continue owning the product even after it has been purchased. WTF? Seriously developers, you aren't entitled to so much as a single penny from a second hand sale as the product is not yours. It stopped being yours when you sold it to the retailer.

I have no intention of buying an Xbox Three. I have many 360 games already which would be rendered obsolete by the new platform, do not wish to support a company or product that a) makes such products or b) enables hackers to steal from me and others via XBox Live, have a PC that is already higher spec than next gen consoles and frankly don't want a games console whose focus isn't games.

I may consider it if a homebrew scene springs up around it, or the PS4 possibly depending on what/how many draconian features it incorporates.
 
Dec 16, 2009
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Soopy said:
All the exclusives in the world won't win shit, if nobody owns the console. The recent backlash against Microsoft would have to be one of the biggest I've ever seen.
no matter the backlash from people like us who debate over each press release, i know lots of people who dont care about any of this s#it and are just looking for the next thing that'll play COD. enough of them sort of sales will get the ball rolling
 

Scott Rothman

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So what happens when Microsoft stops support for the Xbox One? Are all of the games you purchased over the years instantly worthless?
 

KarmaTheAlligator

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Scott Rothman said:
So what happens when Microsoft stops support for the Xbox One? Are all of the games you purchased over the years instantly worthless?
Unless they go the Steam route and make it so the console doesn't need the once a day check-up, then yes, they'll be worthless within 24 hours. Unless the next Xbox is backwards compatible, but then, that'd be backwards.
 

Doom972

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Colt47 said:
Doom972 said:
Soopy said:
Doom972 said:
Soopy said:
All the exclusives in the world won't win shit, if nobody owns the console. The recent backlash against Microsoft would have to be one of the biggest I've ever seen.
The success of the 360 proves otherwise. People are actually willing to pay a monthly subscription to XBL to be able to download patches and play multiplayer.

Many gamers are either uninformed or don't care. Many more will buy it just so they can play their favorite exclusives. This will probably be the most successful console of this generation.
But you don't have to pay a subscription fee in order to download anything. The Gold accounts simply enable users to use multiplayer servers. Which honestly seems kind of fair to me. You can still use XBLA without a subscription.
See, that's exactly the problem: It seems fair to you. After the dust settles and exclusives are announced people will start thinking "It's not that bad", "I can live with it", "Seems fair" - just as they did with the 360.
Actually the X-box gold fee wasn't bad at all... until they turned the entire dashboard into an advertisement board from the pits of Hades and put in anti-class action lawsuit clauses in their EULA. I'm not against paying a monthly fee if it is actually going towards better services, like VOIP and server maintenance, but if I got to sit through advertisements that advertising revenue better be footing the bill. On the Xbox 360 it clearly wasn't.
It's a slippery slope isn't it? If charging for multiplayer and patches is fine, why shouldn't charging extra for installing used games, and what's so bad about a mandatory connection one time per day?

None of these things will prevent the average gamer from playing, but once you accept these things it'll be very hard to go back. Microsoft saw that players were fine with having to pay extra for patches and multiplayer (even though their competitors gave these things for free), so they realized that they might be able to milk their users even more. Until people start to think about the long term and vote with their wallets it'll only get worse.
 

Elijin

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So like.....the existing system?

You know, online passes. Implemented by publishers, in order to get in on that used game market?

Whoops sorry, did I interrupt everyone's MS Xbox One hate boner with some logic?
 

Dragonbums

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Trinab said:
I originally posted this in the xbox poll, but felt it may be more appropriate as a separate topic.

I think I understand Microsoft's reasoning now.

Earlier, I thought they were insane, seemingly alienating gamers and consumers in general with their strategies, but now, this key point was made confirmed things for me.

The post is still incredibly vague on trading in games, with Major Nelson saying that "game publishers can enable you to trade in your games at participating retailers." It's up to third-party publishers to make the call, but there's no word on what "participating retailers" means, or any other details that might clear up this issue completely.
I shall reiterate.

It's up to third-party publishers to make the call
They are not marketing the Xbox One to consumers, they are marketing it to publishers.

They are offering this used game paying service as a huge boon to publishers, and innocently stating they are not enforcing it themselves. They are probably now going to publishers, nudging them and saying 'if you make a game with us, you don't have to worry about used games at all.' They then hope the publishers will then turn to Sony and go 'why can't you offer us the same thing?'

If Sony doesn't, the publishers may give more exclusives to Microsoft, giving them the edge in the console war. The exclusives will always win console wars.

And if Sony does bow down and do the same thing? Well great! Now the combined might of two of them will destroy used games utterly. Microsoft is sacrificing bad press now, for future sales. Either way, they win.

It really doesn't matter what the consumers in general think. They will swallow their disdain, and go with those exclusives.

So yeah, Microsoft doesn't even have to try to appease people or ease their worry. All they got to do is keep going, the publishers, and the games, will fall in line behind their console.

Any thoughts on this theory?
Sounds crazy, but now that I think about it? It makes a lot of sense.
Notice how not a single developer, nor a single publisher had ANY complaints about used games, or how this is bad for the consumers.
Of course they won't say it out loud, but they are probably all giddy about the prospect of having complete control over their own games. Why do you think EA suddenly got all buddy buddy with Microsoft after Nintendo told them to fuck off after their little scheme of implementing Origin on their online servers?
 

Vivi22

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Soopy said:
I don't see how "fair" has a great deal to do with it. It's not as if Microsoft hide the fact that their XBLA gold service is a paid service. Its up to the consumer to decide whether or not its worth it for them. Just because Sony don't charge, doesn't mean that it is an industry standard.
Free online multiplayer was the industry standard before the Xbox and 360 came along and is still the standard now. Platforms with free online multiplayer: PC, Dreamcast, PS2, Gamecube (maybe a bit of a cop out since Nintendo did so little to support it, but still an online console with no subscription required), PS3, Wii, Wii U, and presumably the PS4.

That Microsoft has managed to convince people that online multiplayer is a service worth paying for when everyone else offers it for free is baffling. Even more so that anyone would describe this arrangement as "fair" or argue that free online multiplayer isn't the industry standard.
 

rednose1

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Except the publishers can see a huge profit loss by designing games for a console no one has, vs multiplatform releases. Microsoft is still shooting themselves in the foot, trying to increase profits per customer, vice increasing profits by increasing customers.
 

Dragonbums

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May 9, 2013
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Elijin said:
So like.....the existing system?

You know, online passes. Implemented by publishers, in order to get in on that used game market?

Whoops sorry, did I interrupt everyone's MS Xbox One hate boner with some logic?
And how many people on the Escapist alone claimed that online passes, were complete trash? Nobody liked those either except for folks with a lot of money on their hands or teens who have parents with deep pockets.