This is why I hate "Fake Geek/Gamer Girls"

[Calibanbutcher]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7A5OgfP4NA

Overall video games is experiencing a commodification of a culture where what used to have meaning is being sold en masse and this makes people who are actually part of that culture mad. It would be like if I played 10 minutes of basketball and called myself a professional athlete and tried to fit in with other 6'4" basketball players.

The best example is the punk rock which was anti establishment but now you can buy punk rock on iTunes and buy spiky belts in Hot Topic.

Oh god that video is annoying, I stopped watching after a few minutes.

Why does that guy think that his video actually profits from annoying as f*ck background music?

If you try to make a point, you should articulate it in a clear and easy to understand way.
You do not speak softly over 8bit-style bits of music.


ON topic:
I don't care.
If someone wants to identify as a nerd / geek / whatever-the-f*ck-he-she-it-wants, then so be it, who am I to judge.
I don't go around smacking "guitarists" who only have a guitar to pick up chicks and scream at them to practice till their fingers bleed. They are enjoying themselves and that's what is important.

 

[Zen Bard]

I'm intrigued by the Original Poster's question. But I think the title of the thread is somewhat little misleading and a magnet for flame-throwers.

I also think the whole argument is flawed. The so called "Gaming Culture" was a "Commoditized Culture" to begin with. It's an artificial marketing demographic created to help companies easily identify a target audience for certain products.

It gained prominence when members of a loosely knit community sharing certain common interests banded together and showed how they could actually impact the success of movies, games and television shows. After that, that group of people became a sought-after consumer base. And it was easier for big business to simply identify this group as "The Geek/Gaming/Nerd Culture".

Typically, anytime something is identified as a "sub-culture", it's done more from a standpoint of marketing than meaning.

I'd also point out that the punk culture was "commoditized" the second Malcom McLaren, who owned a clothing store in London, decided to fund and manage the Sex Pistols primarily to sell more merchandise.

Look, I'm all about keeping the integrity of a community pure. But the minute some one realizes there's a buck to be made, it's going to suffer.

As for women gamers...I say "Welcome...and what kept you?"

 

[Entitled]

Provide numbers for that statement. Please, I want proof that a nameworthy majority of the fake geeks / nerds (this has actually to be defined. I want clear signs of 'fake') is female to the extent that justifies the expliocit statement that male fake geeks are not a problem.

Until then all you write is just the willingfull ignorance of the issue at hand:

People having problem with girls invading their playground. If it was anything else then why the hell is there always the need of explicit calling of a gender. B

The fake nerd is basically a trope. Tropes get gendered all the time. Why is the "crazy cat lady" always a lady, and never a "crazy cat dude"? Why is it that a nurse, or a flight attendant, or a fanfic writer, is assumed to be female by default?

Is that some sexist prejudice?

Actually, kind of, maybe, as long as you believe that every gendered stereotype is sexist. But there is still a lot more to it than "anyone who invokes this trope literally believes that all women are like this, and hates women".

 

[Azwrath]

Ookaay....

I have seen alot of debate lately on this "fake geek/nerd/gamer girls" subject. Now i can't really say for sure what i am since it has never been my life's purpose to describe myself in one word and i care little for what others might think of me but since i have a form of social anxiety, i dislike people in general and i play alot of games i guess i could be called a geek or a gamer. It is not something i'm ashamed or proud of, it is just something i am.

Now as a gamer/geek/nerd/whateverthef..k my one question is...Who the hell cares? I'm dead serious about this question. Who cares? Because i think people that genuinely care about this are right up there with those who make it their life's purpose to point out that Katy Perry's bottom got 0.25 cm larger in one summer morning. It's pointless, puerile and offensive to all the "real geeks" out there.

So what if some girl or guy pretends to be into games when they don't really play them that much? Are you affraid they are doing it for attention? So what? Attention is not a quantifiable resource. We have plenty to go around for everyone.

You think they are making gamers look bad? Well they are not because no reasonable human being cares about this. You know who is giving games a bad name? All those who think you need some kind of badge from some secret society before you can call yourself a gamer or a nerd and if you really care so much about this whole "fake" thing then stop making so much god damn fuss about it and giving the "non-real ones" so much freaken importance.

 

[Azwrath]

Ah crap sry for the double post. Seems my connection is acting out again....

 

[xmbts]

snip

Lets see...

None.

Nope.

Nah-uh.

Dexterity?

No.

I can't decide they'll both wage war on me sooner or later, Monty will just be more up front about it.

Blanca...Guile...and that guy with the silly hat.

Don't have the space.

Also don't have the space. <.>

That did make my day however and for that I thank you.

 

[Nomanslander]

are you so scared of these girls that you would rather belittle and degrade them? forcing them out of the community? In the process prolonging your loneliness?

I think that's the exact reason for all this Fake Gamer Girl hob-bob going on I've been hearing.

Anyways, why bring up gamer girls? So you're telling me there aren't any fake gamer guys? I mean, I agree, a lot of cultures and sub-groups have and are continuing to be commodified. Sometimes it's done well, sometimes it's not (actually mostly it hasn't been).

Now geeks and nerds have been around a while, and their image has changed a lot during that time. But a Gamer is something that relatively new, and it wasn't just an activity for a niche sub-group of people. I'm 31, so I was around during the golden age of gaming (if you'd call it that), and no one ever referred to themselves as gamers. Why? Because everybody that age played games. There was no sub-group, everyone played games. So gamer really doesn't qualify as a sub-group to begin with. If anything, it's more of a generational thing like Rock n Roll was in the 50s: We get it but our parents gen doesn't.

Now I'm not saying there wasn't some people that took it to an extreme. The video is correct to talk about nerds and how that sub-group has been commodified for mainstream culture. But honestly, how much of a bad thing is it? Eventually all sub-groups have their time and then the mainstream comes along and markets and milks the shit out of it, it's the will of things.

Finally, when it come to the matter of fake-ness, when something is popular there will always be people that act like they like it to fit in. You've heard the word "poser" right? Well they DO exist. Guy or girl, there always will be some among the group. But for anyone that says there aren't any girls in this sub-group just shows how much of an ignorant misogynist they are. What you've done there is completely separated woman from the human equation like they're their own sub-group, and can never be nerds, punks, lawyers or doctors. They have no role in society except to look pretty, and be good wives or daughters. 0.o

 

[DrunkOnEstus]

It doesn't mean or prove anything, but my sister does this. When she turned 15 or so, she decided "geeky guys, you know - scrawny, glasses, socially awkward" were adorable and that's what she wanted to date. She then spent a lot of time reading Wikipedia articles about games so that she could tell these dudes that she had played them and could appear that she knew what she was talking about.

I didn't care, I didn't feel that my hobby had been infringed, but some of the guys got hurt and frustrated. When it got to the point where they would come to the house, they would notice that she had no systems and never played anything at all. Some would say "oh, so you're a fraud" and quit talking to her. I never heard them say that the hobby or "lifestyle" had been infringed, but that they were personally disappointed and insulted that they were being lied to.

It's a needlessly complex issue. It's very subjective, as 1 or 2 of these guys said "to hell with it" and dated her anyway because they were astonished that an attractive girl actually wanted to date them and even pretending to be interested in their hobbies was enough for them. Either way, it's VERY superficial both to pretend and to care about pretenders, and in the real adult world I can't imagine how this can matter so much to people. If you don't respect a liar, don't have them in your life. If someone of either gender is being an asshat in your game and clearly doesn't know what they're doing, mute or go to another server. There's bigger things to worry about.

 

[Hagi]

Can't really say I care overly much,

but erm... I watched the video and it's pretty gender neutral...

All it's saying is that anyone who says "I'm such a nerd" (regardless of gender) seriously after doing something slightly associated with said culture like reading a fantasy book or playing a computer game is about as stupid as someone proclaiming they're such an athlete after participating in a single sporting event.

Seriously did any of you people even watch the video or read the OP before you started preaching about the male treehouse of gaming where no girls are allowed?

This thread is just rather sad with people looking rather silly as they vastly overreact to something that's not even happening here...

The video is about the commercialization of nerd culture. It's got absolutely nothing to do with gender...

 

[DioWallachia]

That video doesn't really demonstrate much, since douchebag guys exist in games too. The girl and women games I know are pretty even-keeled. One I know said she didn't want to talk much in-game for a very long time because she was used to being harassed when people found out she's a girl.

So yeah, it's not a guy/girl problem. It's a general asshat problem.

Exactly. And it would have ended it in a general asshat problem if it wasnt for the sheer power women have in reminding everyone that they are women, and everything we said negatively about her is SEXIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIST!!! YOU MYSOGINISTIC FUCKER!!

Is this kind of bullshit what makes people so angry about, for example, Anita Sarkesiam. She inmediately assumes that all the detractors are 1)Gamers, 2)Men, 3)Mysoginist, 4)Not just your regular Trolls that troll everyone even themselves

 

[bartholen_v1legacy]

I hadn't really bothered with this whole "fake gamer girls" debacle until now, and wouldn't like to start doing so. But this thread gives me the opportunity to link this Cyanide and Happiness strip that got me thinking

The way I see it, this is a fad like the big gay trend of the early 2000s, when Queer eye for the straight guy was a big hit. If I had seen more of these "fake geek girls" I might have more to say on this, but I must say that C&H strip raised the thought in my head that there's something iffy in pretending to be something you're not just because it's a trend or the big thing at the moment. It's the same thing with any subculture or niche: once people who weren't acting like them before start doing so, the niche immediately makes a backlash. Same thing with rap becoming less like N.W.A. and more like 50 Cent and punk becoming less like Sex Pistols and more like Blink 182.

Edit: but probably what bothers me most about this is how all of a sudden some people say that "the title of a nerd is earned". Like it was a belt rank in a martial art or something. To to earn something means to me that you have striven for it, desired it and seen it as worth putting effort into. Myself having been categorized as a nerd in the past is none of those things. So why are some people waving it as some sort of badge of honor, rather than an embrassing social stamp?

It's a fad, and I think it'll blow over. Personally I don't care one way or another. I wonder, though, what the next big thing's gonna be?

 

[johnnyLupine]

I wasn't even aware that people even considered this an issue until recently and in all honesty I find the reasoning behind all of this contempt confusing. I don't remember anyone thinking hobbies, gaming in particular, were reason to make a phariah out of anyone. Was this alienation supposed to be happening at school? As far as I was aware people were not catagorised and singled out for being in the wrong catagory when I used to go, infact I didn't even know there were catagories, at least not in the same way that is shown on tv (which is where most people seem to get their idea of social catagories from anyway. Practically everyone I knew played football at lunch for example, many of them also played warhammer and computer games too, according to the TV this does not happen, TV is where people are catagorised and that is the only place it has ever been relevant).

 

[II2]

The YT link had some good points on the commodification of subculture and stereotypes, but it doesn't really touch on the malleable nature of language and it's (re)appropriation. He comments on Big Bang Theory as "Nerd Blackface", harsh, but the show IS miserable rubbish. Following that line of thought though, black guys reclaimed 'nigga' and to some extent, queers reclaimed fag and dyke, so why not the same for nerds and geeks and gamers?

I mean, I had an awkward childhood like he spoke of and was strange for owning a NES in 85 and preferring it and my PC to the company of other kids, but... Is this really an important debate? Is this really the hill to die on?

I'll call myself a geek as a shorthand for longer explanation, but that's just utility and economy of language; not a label of pride. If I see someone declaring it to the skies to be seen as something, that speaks to their experience and need, not mine. Selling culture is never tasteful and some people need to pose, but, fucks sake, just find someone else who's interesting to talk to and get on with your day.

The beautiful people are trying to be mistaken for gamers, not trying to ridicule gamers. That is the difference between this and the horrible comparison of blackface.

If the cool kids are trying be part of your club, that means you are cool now. This isn't a social injustice issue. Just general nerds with overblown complexes of self importance.

I'm not sure if that was a criticism or a nod. I should probably speak more plainly on issues, but I love words. At any rate, I agree with you.

 

[Myndnix]

If I can throw this out there, I have no idea why 'fake' gamer/whatever girls are even a thing. I've never met one and I'd never even encountered it until people on the internet started bitching about how 'annoying' it is. As far as I know, it's something we've made up in order to have something to complain about.
Though on that note, the majority of my friends are female, and the majority of my friends are gamers. So 'gamer girls' aren't some kind of mythical creature that you only hear about at conventions, to me. I know a lot of them. They're...people.

 

[infinity_turtles]

The issue is more about posers then gender. In a male dominated culture women are more likely to be posers just as in a female dominated culture men are more likely to be posers. Partly because they each have more to "gain" in those scenarios, but also because people usually have more friends of their own gender. If someones trying to jump into things on their own, they're more likely to pretend they're already part of the culture and knowledgeable about things important in it, where-as if they're with a friend they're more willing to admit they know less and bank on their friends' credibility. Just how most people are, even though someone on their own who admits they don't much but are interested is more likely to be embraced.

Not to say there aren't misogynists doing stupid shit, but that's not who most detractors are and trying to paint it as such is either ignorant or dishonest.

 

[Entitled]

Tropes are gendered... So what? Does that excuse the increased hostility towards that specific gender if it comes to that trope? Or even justify?

If all that "hostility" that you are talking about amounts to people ranting about posers in general, and chosing to use a gendered subcategory as a typical example, than yeah, that pretty much excuses it.

If you have any specific example of people who openly argued that all women should get out of gaming, then go ahead and hate them for it.

But to start arguing against all the people who just thoughtlessly grabbed this one stereotyped example with a potential sexist origin while trying to talk about another issue, and explain for them what they must have wanted to imply with it, is about as fruitless as arguing against everyone who uses "he" as a default personal pronoun (because it implies that males are the default gender), or against people who assume that I'm a woman if I say that I have a boyfriend, (because it implies that they are heteronormative), or against those who use "lame" as an insult (that implies that disabled people are unwanted and you should be outraged to be compared to one).


Yes, the words have these unfortunate origins. And yes, whoever was the one who first established "fake geek GIRL" as a stereotype was probably a raging mysogynist, in the same way as whoever first said "you are lame" to a healthy person, was an ableist. Yet you simply can't ignore that most people participating in these arguments don't even recognize that it has something supposed to be with gender politics, including the OP of this thread.

At this point, bringing up the sexism argument for it's own sake, might be well-intentioned, but it's not helping anyone, at least not in the same way as fighting against the explicit sexist statements themselves would be.