Tomb Raider writer expressed an interest in making Lara gay?

[Spartan Altego]

"They're suggesting making a character homosexual, it's pandering tokenism. When they don't decide to make a character homosexual, it's obviously writer homophobia. Obviously, female characters should get some more strong straight leads first, then we can make homosexual female leads. It changes Laura too much. Making her gay would take away another strong straight female lead, which female gamers desperately need right now.(Because turning her into a strong homosexual lead is just too much.)

Have I listed all the complaints? Probably just scratched the surface, right?

I don't care what Laura's preference is anyways. If they want to establish her as homosexual, go for it. It has little bearing on my perception of the character or my fun raiding tombs. Do or don't, I don't really care.

 

[Sixcess]

The idea that straight, male, white, etc., are all unlisted default states, and only deviations from those are considered traits, is exactly the type of thing we need to fight.

I don't disagree, but knowing when and where to fight is important as well, and a long running mainstream franchise that isn't exactly known for depth of character and has a protagonist who is near universally percieved as heterosexual is not the place to do it.

A new IP gives you a blank slate and no pre-concieved perceptions to work against, but a new entry - even a 'reboot' - in a long running franchise trades that freedom in for brand name recognition. You can have or the other - you can't have both.

The first step is to not accept that view as reality.

I have to agree with Remnant_Phoenix on this. Acting as if this isn't reality will not change the fact that it is.

If LGBT gamers wants gay and lesbian video game protagonists, as they should, then they're better off supporting those that already do exist and making more, rather than trying to adopt existing ones who are not.

(Either that or revive Fear Effect, which had two bi female characters back in 1999. Yeah, they should do that. Fear Effect was awesome.)

 

[ZLAY]

snip

Saying those things don't count is a bit of a fallacy though isn't it since it's still catering to lesbian gamers albeit indirectly. (which in my defense I pointed out above) Straight women don't get that perk.

Fang and Vanille from Final Fantasy 13 where heavily implied to be in a relationship. I think I feel pretty confident providing them as an example.

Make a new gay female character by all means but don't start depriving straight women of the few we have.

Funny you mention Fang, as she was originally written as a male character... Also she isn't the protagonist.

But anyway, I don't care for Lara's sexuality to be honest, the thing that irks me is that some consider defining her sexuality can make her less relatable. She is a great character, to me at least, because she went trough hell, reacted as expected and emerged victorious. She wasn't stated as straight nor lesbian to define her character, and adding either one of those in future titles should not be an issue or even affect her relatability. (I'm talking about the reboot of course)

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

snip

Saying those things don't count is a bit of a fallacy though isn't it since it's still catering to lesbian gamers albeit indirectly. (which in my defense I pointed out above) Straight women don't get that perk.

Fang and Vanille from Final Fantasy 13 where heavily implied to be in a relationship. I think I feel pretty confident providing them as an example.

Make a new gay female character by all means but don't start depriving straight women of the few we have.

Funny you mention Fang, as she was originally written as a male character... Also she isn't the protagonist.

But anyway, I don't care for Lara's sexuality to be honest, the thing that irks me is that some consider defining her sexuality can make her less relatable. She is a great character, to me at least, because she went trough hell, reacted as expected and emerged victorious. She wasn't stated as straight nor lesbian to define her character, and adding either one of those in future titles should not be an issue or even affect her relatability. (I'm talking about the reboot of course)

As a straight woman I think it would effect my relatability to Lara. That's what I've been trying to say. I;d say Fang and Vanille are protagonists as you can play as them multiple times throughout the game (but I don't really want to argue minutia)

Lara has a (dead) fiance in the original series and male romantic attachments in the movies so she's at least bi.

I'm cool with them leaving her sexuality out altogether but it would be nice if she was allowed a boyfriend just to prove they had left that view behind that she 'belongs' to male gamers...

 

[GeneralFungi]

To be clear on my stance, I don't actually believe Lora should have been gay. I was mostly against the reaction people had to the possibility. I felt like it was being treated with a negative attitude by a select few individuals and I got a tad offended by it. I guess I had a bit of a personal interest in trying to dispel that.

I share the opinion of not changing her orientation because as an established character changing major details never goes out well. And it would feel like some tacked on just to attempt to garner sales just for interests sake. If they had designed a character from the ground up, made them interesting and designed that aspect of themselves from the very beginning it would be a more positive thing. But taking an already well established character and slapping that on would have been rather thoughtless and wouldn't have even affected the game in any meaningful way. It would not have demonstrated much effort put into it and would have felt manipulative.

"When they don't decide to make a character homosexual, it's obviously writer homophobia."

I don't remember anyone saying anything along those lines at any point in time...

Of course, you are entirely correct. We need to make sure that they also have people of every ethnicity too, or else they might appear racist. Oh and we don't want them holding out on all of the religions either!

 

[mionic]

While I'm not very familiar with the franchise, it probably won't affect it too much and I quite like the idea even though might just end up culminating in an excuse to include a fanservice lesbian scene thingie in future installments.
I don't have time to read the full article but it looks interesting enough.

 

[Gearhead mk2]

...well then, all that subtext between Lara and Sam makes sense now. Personally, I would've liked to see this happen. We do need more LGBT characters. Hopefully this can be worked into later games in this continuty in a way that isn't fanservice.

 

[Edl01]

Yeah, then Lara will be both a female icon, and a homosexual icon! She'll be almost as Iconic as Mario.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Yeah, then Lara will be both a female icon, and a homosexual icon! She'll be almost as Iconic as Mario.

Look, guys, stop that. As a woman, I can tell you this: LARA IS NOT AN ICON FOR FEMALE GAMERS. LARA IS WHAT MALE GAMERS CALL AN ICON FOR FEMALE GAMERS.

She is for me and I'm a woman. :/ It's the media that sexualised her not the games themselves.

 

[Gearhead mk2]

No, just ABSOLUTELY NO.

It would have been pointless fanservice - you just can't EVER have a female protagonist without making her sexy and/or lesbian?

Call me when you make a male gay protagonist. Yeah, that's never gonna happen.

The reason we don't have many gay guy protagonists and lesbian characters that aren't built for fanservice isn't because they're impossible to make. It's because gaming, as a medium, still has a lot of growing up to do. If the writers wanna include a same-sex relationship and it's given as much attention and good writing as a good hetero one, we shouldn't shun them, we should support them. Show that we've grown up and we won't start screaming when we see two guys cuddling and won't start drooling if we see two girls do the same.

 

[Edl01]

Yeah, then Lara will be both a female icon, and a homosexual icon! She'll be almost as Iconic as Mario.

Look, guys, stop that. As a woman, I can tell you this: LARA IS NOT AN ICON FOR FEMALE GAMERS. LARA IS WHAT MALE GAMERS CALL AN ICON FOR FEMALE GAMERS.

You took my little bit of sarcasm as a jab a bit too literally.

 

[nightingale]

Yes. Because clearly every tomboy is a suppressed lesbian.

/eyeroll

 

[ItsNotRudy]

Call me when you make a male gay protagonist. Yeah, that's never gonna happen.

-calls-

Slightly NSFW.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMpULYa6l00

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Yes. Because clearly every tomboy is a suppressed lesbian.

/eyeroll

Thankyou for putting it more eloquently than I did

 

[ZLAY]

I'm cool with them leaving her sexuality out altogether but it would be nice if she was allowed a boyfriend just to prove they had left that view behind that she 'belongs' to male gamers...

So... a boyfriend to appeal heterosexual women in way to prove that she is straight and show male fans that she isn't "theirs", or a girlfriend to appeal heterosexual men, because that is obviously what they want since "they so horny".

Why not a well written -not token- romance interest that could appeal to majority?
I guess, the point of my whole bitching here is that I just want this romance sub-plot (if ever realized) to be handled carefully.

Yeah, then Lara will be both a female icon, and a homosexual icon! She'll be almost as Iconic as Mario.

Look, guys, stop that. As a woman, I can tell you this: LARA IS NOT AN ICON FOR FEMALE GAMERS. LARA IS WHAT MALE GAMERS CALL AN ICON FOR FEMALE GAMERS.

That would be your opinion, not a fact.

 

[Gearhead mk2]

Yes. Because clearly every tomboy is a suppressed lesbian.

/eyeroll

Thankyou for putting it more eloquently than I did

For me at least, it's not like that. A tomboyish character having a girly-girl freind is a well-known and well-used trope, and it alone isn't grounds for calling either one of that duo gay. But stuff like the tomboy not really having any interest in boys, them looking out for and worrying about each other throughout the whole game, and one of them carrying the other in a freaking bridal carry down a mountain... If I see subtext, I'll point it out, and from my perspective, Lara and Sam are about as subtle as Poison Ivy and Harley Quinn.

 

[remnant_phoenix]

I hate to come off as contrary for the sake of being contrary, but that IS the reality. If one doesn't understand the reality one operates in, how can one change it?

Maybe it's philosophical semantics, but I think that the most effective activists are those who recognize, "This is the reality. This other approach is the way it should be. And I will do what I can to make the way it should be the new reality."

I'm saying that there's a difference between a character actually being more sexualized and that people may perceive a character as being more sexualized.

EDIT: And not letting that perception control one's writing.

If one writes with no regard for how one's audience perceives it, one's message will probably be lost.

That's such a pointless argument for this; "other people will see it as sexualized so you have to make it sexualized." Why can't the writers just write her as gay, using a line or two about a girlfriend or how she's attracted to someone (it doesn't have to be Sam), and then let the community take it as is?

Certainly the audience should influence one's writing, but a writer should also try to influence their audience, and making her being gay not a big deal is a good way to show that being gay shouldn't be someone's defining characteristic. Making it some huge thing just because the community is just reinforces that stupid idea and isn't something someone should be doing.

I'm not arguing for that. I'm arguing against the idea a person's writing is completely independent of audience perception. Can a writer write whatever they want for no regard to how people will receive it? Certainly they can, but they're probably unlikely to find the audience that they want, and if the writer is trying to relay a message or challenge the way people think, how is that going to happen if the audience is shut out?

There is a middle ground between ignoring audience perception and catering to it, and if one wants their writing to reach people, there's where a writer needs to be. That's all I'm saying.