Top 5 Rifles Ever Made

[the mechsican]

What I see in this thread is a lot fanboyism over guns 50 years and older from a lot of people who dont really know guns because they're not providing any real meat to the meal.

How about the fact that I've been deployed to areas all around the world and fired numerous wweapons? Does that count?

The AR series is garbage. Trial and error shouldn't be the exclusive method of improving a gun intented for defending air force bases in field conditions worse than slightly excessive wind speeds made by a company that got to produce them en mass because they were the lowest bidder.

The AR series is good. It sounds like you are just quoting what a bunch of idiots who have never fired the rifle say. The military grade M-16 and the 5.56x45 will still reach out and touch someone alot more accurately than alot of the .30 rifles that it competes against at the Camp Perry matches in Virginia.

Not everything from Germany is gold, most of it is overpriced and overhyped. Quality engineering is nothing more than a stereotype and good marketing. HK doesn't make crap, but they dont always make gold either. (FAL > G3)

I agree.

The AK series - There's a reason you can get 50 62-year-old guns for 6 dollars in most parts of the uncivilized world, just saying. That and it's a 62 year old gun. We dont have anything better yet? I'm calling bull****.

If it aint broke, don't fix it. Until you've either fired one or been on the recieving end of one, do us a favor and stop talking.

First you people need to get some standard definition of what would equate to the bestust rifflez evarz...(gibberish)Not really my thread but thats a proposal for getting this thread to be something other than a carbon copy of at least...a zillion others. Search button you know?

Blah blah blah. Quit acting like you're such an expert after firing a .22LR

 

[Anarchy In Detroit]

I'm not a real gun buff, but AK47 is an ideal gun from a strategic perspective. Cheap,

If you find $1000 [http://www.impactguns.com/store/arsenal.html] cheap, then yes.

Seriously? Then that store sucks.

An AK47 costs about 50 bucks to make.

EDIT: And I would agree in that the AK47 is one of the best guns out there. Alongside the FAMAS, but only because it's my Counter Strike buddy.

Actually you must realize there are locally (meaning various countries besides Russia make them) made variants of the AK that fucking suck. The best is a real Russian one. So yes, commercially it would cost quite a bit. Depending on where you are in the world and what model you're getting prices will vary, though you are right that some places have tons for 30 or 50 bucks (but they're trash).

Oh please, people. The best civilian rifle you can get is the Ruger Mini-14. Semi-automatic, uses actual assault rifle rounds, durable, and has very little recoil for what it's chambered for. Fully legal everywhere (As far as I know), even in the gunless wastes of California.

no it isnt legal anywhere. its a fucking rifle. if you had that thing lying around here in denmark (or generally Europe), you would end in jail faster than you can say "gun".

He meant the US. We know Europeans don't have commercially available guns so why would you think you're included?

My vote goes to the AK. Certainly an M-16 is nowhere near the top of my list because if you can't take care of it it will fucking fail. I base my choice on preparing for the eventuality that one may be in combat and may not have access to spare parts and cleaning stuff. The AK is the weapon of the guerrilla. I mean partisan, post apocalyptic, fighting off the guys with the black helicopters live in the woods kind of shit. No tax payer money keeping anything on hand.

 

[Rahnzan]

No way I'm doing the quoting thing

@Mechscican wasn't talking about you, you at least try.

I dont like the AR, and while that's not a fact, I am still entitled to my opinion like everyone else.

Glad someone does.

Who says its not broke? I'm not refuting that a GOOD AK isn't a good gun, only that your typical AK isn't as cracked up to be what it is. And everything can be improved - especially after 62 YEARS.

Fuck .22 Especially after Max Brooks. As well, there is absolutely nothing wrong with trying to get an appropriate system going for determining the best rifle out there. Personally I subscribe to the school of thought that there is no such weapon and there wont be for some time, but it doesn't hurt to make sure everyones on the same page and not calling out crappy weapons from RSV or COD4.

I suppose the P90 is an unstoppable murder machine? Yeah...No. Having no facts to go on in any discussion to determine the best of something isn't the best way to hold a discussion on determining what is the best.

"I like M16 with RDS and Double Tap!" .....Eyah. Real...real scientific guys.

 

[the mechsican]

From what I've heard it's generally accepted that the Mosin bolt body is more complicated because it has three main pieces as opposed to the two main pieces of the Mauser. However, having owned both, I've never got my Mosin bolt cocked incorrectly during assembly that I needed to use a screw driver to reassemble and gouge a chunk of flesh out of my hand. The safety on a Mauser cocks the whole process up. And yes, the 7.62x54R is an amazing round, one of my favorites. Still amazing that a rifle and round designed over 100 years ago can still put rounds dead center reliably.

Sorry. I got it mixed up. The Mauser has one less piece than the Mosin. I was thinking of overall rifle parts. Yeah, the Mauser safety is quite different. Did you ever get the cleaning kit, ammo pouches and dog collar sling with your Mosin? I have the M44 with the side folding bayonet.

 

[the mechsican]

The 5.56x45 is a bullet that will fuck you up. It may not take you down right away, but the M855 ball round will do alot of internal damage. A .30/7.62, especially with ball ammo, tends to punch through a target rather than tumble; I've seen wounds where the M855 tumbles severely and breaks up at the cannelure causing even more tissue damage.

The M855 is on the same level as the Russian 5.45x39 being that they are small bullets that cause massive internal damage that will kill you. Not right away, but you are guaranteed death from it.

The AK has had numerous upgrades including a rebarreling to accept the 5.45 round. There are numerous models and makes that are essentially a Kalashnikov, just accurized and with better technology applied to it.

Off the top of my head, I can think of Norinco Type 56 (A Chinese weapon that isn't a piece of shit?!), Valmets, Galils, Krinkovs, RPK's, WASR-10's that are good quality AK's

 

[Rahnzan]

The 5.56x45 is a bullet that will fuck you up. It may not take you down right away, but the M855 ball round will do alot of internal damage. A .30/7.62, especially with ball ammo, tends to punch through a target rather than tumble; I've seen wounds where the M855 tumbles severely and breaks up at the cannelure causing even more tissue damage.

The M855 is on the same level as the Russian 5.45x39 being that they are small bullets that cause massive internal damage that will kill you.

The AK has had numerous upgrades including a rebarreling to accept the 5.45 round. There are numerous models and makes that are essentially a Kalashnikov, just accurized and with better technology applied to it.

And this in my opinion is what the rest of this thread should be doing.

 

[the mechsican]

Gotcha. You are correct about the Rainbow Six/Call Of Duty fanboyism.

 

[Vern]

Sorry. I got it mixed up. The Mauser has one less piece than the Mosin. I was thinking of overall rifle parts. Yeah, the Mauser safety is quite different. Did you ever get the cleaning kit, ammo pouches and dog collar sling with your Mosin? I have the M44 with the side folding bayonet.

I did get the ammo pouch, sling, and cleaning kit with my Mosin 91/30 and the detachable bayonet. I also have the M44 with the side folding bayonet, but I bought it from my father and he didn't have any of the accessories. Fantastic rifle though, I still have to find someone that likes shooting it as much as I do. The M44 with Hungarian Heavy Ball kicks like a mule and throws out a muzzle flare at least two feet long. Seeing what it does to melons, rocks, and rebar is pretty impressive though. And the 91/30 can hit two inch groups at 200 yards, which is very impressive for a military rifle from 1942.

 

[Downfall89]

*snip

Just so you know, the AK-47 is NOT accurate, it has incredible amounts of recoil. But it is still incredibly easy to fire and is very powerful

 

[duchaked]

I
2.M-16
Accurate Powerful Reliable and Easy to maintain

Really? Really? REALLY?

Maybe the newer ones anyways...

In Vietnam they sucked until they actually told them to clean them, And the A2 and A3 are alot more reliable

yeah maybe with more so some of the later variations/version or whatnot

 

[garfoldsomeoneelse]

Though how do you figure that it's "powerful"? It only fires the 5.56mm bullet, which is only standard for NATO and much weaker than for example the AK-47's 7.62.

My 2 cents, the M16 and subsequent variant using 5.56mm have a sort of natural tumble effect with their bullets, which causes massive hydrostatic shock, which subsequently leads to greater damage to the tissue. Losing a limb is a lot more common.

The 7.62 will often punch through quite cleanly, because its got more force. The upside is it penetrates body armour far more effectively.

Without body armour someone is often more likely to survive a 7.62, but it's really 6 up and a half a dozen down.

The worst thing to be shot with would be a musket ball, not only were they 17mm they were often poorly forged and fragmented and they would rarely exit a body.

The 5.56x45mm round was designed to kill through body armor, in response to the Cold War-era threat of armored Soviet troops storming across eastern Europe. The reason it was so ineffectual in Viet Nam and in present-day conflicts is because the combatants being shot at with 5.56mm rounds aren't wearing body armor. The tumble effect comes after penetration of body armor, but when shot at a soft target, it overpenetrates and leave a knitting needle-like wound in its wake, meaning that it's going to go straight through and won't rupture anything it doesn't touch.

7.62x39mm is a heavier, slower round. Its effect on unarmored targets is superior to that of the 5.56x45mm, in addition to its ability to be used effectively on armor (including steel plates up to a 1/4" thick).

Modern insurgents don't actually fear soldiers carrying an M-16/M-4 type of rifle. Most of them know someone who has survived at least one shot from one. They've been said, however, to shit themselves silly when a soldier comes after them with a breeching/CQB shotgun.

 

[WolfThomas]

The 5.56x45mm round was designed to kill through body armor, in response to the Cold War-era threat of armored Soviet troops storming across eastern Europe. The reason it was so ineffectual in Viet Nam and in present-day conflicts is because the combatants being shot at with 5.56mm rounds aren't wearing body armor. The tumble effect comes after penetration of body armor, but when shot at a soft target, it overpenetrates and leave a knitting needle-like wound in its wake, meaning that it's going to go straight through and won't rupture anything it doesn't touch.

7.62x39mm is a heavier, slower round. Its effect on unarmored targets is superior to that of the 5.56x45mm, in addition to its ability to be used effectively on armor (including steel plates up to a 1/4" thick).

Modern insurgents don't actually fear soldiers carrying an M-16/M-4 type of rifle. Most of them know someone who has survived at least one shot from one. They've been said, however, to shit themselves silly when a soldier comes after them with a breeching/CQB shotgun.

Makes sense, I remember them commenting in blackhawk down (the book) that there 5.56 wouldn't drop the insurgents.

 

[FluffyNeurosis]

*snip

Just so you know, the AK-47 is NOT accurate, it has incredible amounts of recoil. But it is still incredibly easy to fire and is very powerful

Incredible amounts of recoil, really? You are either an 80lb girl or somehow got a hold of a full auto one.

 

[Sgt Doom]

Part of me dies when I read threads like this.

 

[Mondzo]

1. Barrett M82A1

2. LXM-109 25mm (Okey im cheating abit on this one, it isnt done yet.
But who dont love 25mm grenades in a sniper rifle!)
3. G3

4. FN FAL

5. AK47

 

[Hybridwolf]

Aren't they replacing the AK-47 with the AK-74? Just asking...

As I have no knowlage of shooting, aside from video games, I'm going to avoid saying what I think is the best modern rifles. But the Lee Enfield is defiently one of the better old examples. It's been around longer then the AK, and is still being used today. Just to give you an example, around 1900, the best Lee Enfield could kill a person a mile away. Not very good now, granted, but back then, it was one of the best.

But since I haven't fired one, I really can't tell if I'd agree with that. I'm just remembering a conversation I had with my dad.

 

[RanD00M]

And "reliable" is nothing to what a Ak47 can take. I've seen them dunked in water, sand, mud, beat with a hammer, then still fire off a clip.

I saw one that was filled with sand.Then thrown in water.Then driven over.And it still fired off a clipMAG.

CLIPS are what the m1 garand and Lee Enfield use. (They actually CLIP them together)
MAGS are box-type things that hold bullets over a spring that pushes them up thru the top.
Never again.

Sorry about that.How did i not know that?.Because i´m not a gun nut.