Transgendered Woman Beat Up In McDonald's; Employees Do Nothing

[t3h br0th3r]

Fear of litigation doesn't stop you being human, and you only get one shot at life to prove what you're worth.

I don't know about Europe, but over in gun toting America self defense laws apply to people defending someone else.

Lawful Stupid is still no defense, you are legally allowed to protect someone getting beat up.

failure to do so means you are Lawful Pussy aligned.

 

[Azaraxzealot]

that's fucked up, but by law, sitting back and doing nothing is not a crime.

Incorrect. It is indeed a crime, especially when things get serious. We all have a duty of care - a legal one.

where in the world does it say (in any constitution) that if someone is getting attacked i need to help them?

if it's not in the constitution or a law is not constitutional, then i don't have to follow it.

besides, i'm not defending these people who did nothing. no, i WISH they could be lawfully punished VERY severely

but unfortunately, by law, they were exercising a constitutional right. the right to not be involved. to do nothing.

like it's a right to sit back and do nothing when millions of people are dying in genocides all over the world, it's also a right to watch a beating and do nothing. though, the fact that they were doing nothing because it was a transgendered woman is going to bring "hate crimes" into this and the situation will get sticky beyond anything i can deal with

Its more about ethical and moral responsibility than constitutional rights or laws

it is, but ethics and morals can't be defined by law since every individual has different morals and ethics (see: australia's game rating system)

which is why it's legally ok for people to sit back and do nothing as someone is beaten, even if it is against the majority's moral code, we can't say for sure if it's against theirs.

i wish there was a batman or daredevil for all these sick people, but alas, the world has no superheroes who are unafraid of the laws set against them. willing to make the decisions that governments can't or won't because it's by morals and not straight up laws.

 

[Longsight]

You can say that, but I've lost crappy jobs like that before for standing up for what was the right thing at the right time, and I'd do it again; because no matter what happens to me, I have no interest in perpetuating a society where keeping a crappy job is more important than making sure someone else keeps their life.

And yes, I used to work at McDonalds - and despite needing the money, I walked out on that job because of systematic managerial abuse of the staff. Money is never everything.

 

[CM156_v1legacy]

snip

Ehhhhh. Shoosh.

If you were to walk down the street tomorrow night and see a man being beaten to death and lying in the street - yet you keep on walking, you would be charged with serious offenses due to failure to act and negligence. Sorry. Same deal if this girl was seriously hurt. But she wasn't, so yeah, you wouldn't be charged in this particular incident - but your view of "I don't have to do anything" is completely wrong.

But yes, your faultless logic of "If it ain't in the constitution, I ain't have ta follow it!" is awesome. Keep trying to defend it, doesn't matter what you say, it's still illegal to not uphold your duty of care.

Again, how do you owe a random stranger a "duty of care"? I'm not saying its right, but I saw someone being beat up, I have to intervine, even if it puts my life in danger?

 

[Craorach]

Actually yes I have had to, I was fired from that job for talking back to a customer who called me a freak. Im well aware or the rules and regulations

Congratulations then, I applaud you for standing by your convictions in a position where you were able to.

I, for example am not in a position where I would be able to. If I lost my job, in the current employment market where I live, I would not get another easily. I wouldn't be able to eat or pay my bills.

Two types of people work in the fast food industry.. young people who need work but have limited time due to school/uni... most of those have parents to back them up. The other type are older people like me who, for one reason or another, are in positions where these are jobs we have to keep.

 

[SlasherX]

snip

Why were you capitalizing transgendered it isn't supposed to be capitalized, this shows a bias on your part because you believe that that is something that is important and value(learned this Thursday in Psychology)

OT: I find it disgusting. There isn't a reason anyone should be beaten like that it is also wrong that no one helped till that on older women. It also disgusts me that this is just now getting news when I saw it on 4chan a week or 2 ago.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

It's kind of upsetting to me looking at all the people on this site who are defending the staff for not doing anything. But, I guess that's the world we live in now. These days, being an employee of McDonalds is as much as a reason as you need to let someone be degraded and assaulted in public.

The nerve of those people, wanting to keep their only means of making money.

Yes, because calling the police and/or trying to stop the fight would have automatically resulted in them being fired?

You really believe this? You think this is company policy? Really?

I can't believe the amount of people who have fallen for that awful excuse.

Calling the police is required, and was done.

Stepping in the physically stop the fight is guaranteed termination on the spot.

Some people need money more then gratitude. This is the real world, not a fantasy land where everyone can be a vigilante. Not only if you physically step in to stop the fight, you can sued by the attacker for inciting.

 

[Nemesis729]

what were the employee's to do? you know that when you get hired they tell you if you get involved in any confrontation, no matter the reason, you're fired on the spot. they can't take the risk of someone getting hurt. so if the kids (probably) valued their jobs there was nothing they could do.

True they couldn't have done anything themselves while on duty but as it says, one of them recorded it, and another said to Vicki as she went to help "You do know that's not a woman. That's a transvestite."

I'd say they deserved to get fired

 

[Kerra]

You can say that, but I've lost crappy jobs like that before for standing up for what was the right thing at the right time, and I'd do it again; because no matter what happens to me, I have no interest in perpetuating a society where keeping a crappy job is more important than making sure someone else keeps their life.

And yes, I used to work at McDonalds - and despite needing the money, I walked out on that job because of systematic managerial abuse of the staff. Money is never everything.

I agree, a society that would put money above life except in a case where the loss of that money will result in the loss of life is a truly disgusting and corrupt society indeed.

 

[Pipotchi]

I love how many people in this thread are all, screw the job you have to you are a human being, you have to get involved.

If everyone who had that stance in this thread got involved at every opportunity then the world would be a much better place but I call Bullshit on that.

Easy to judge from your high horse but in the real world people have concerns about their jobs, their families etc.

 

[Azaraxzealot]

snip

Ehhhhh. Shoosh.

If you were to walk down the street tomorrow night and see a man being beaten to death and lying in the street - yet you keep on walking, you would be charged with serious offenses due to failure to act and negligence. Sorry. Same deal if this girl was seriously hurt. But she wasn't, so yeah, you wouldn't be charged in this particular incident - but your view of "I don't have to do anything" is completely wrong.

But yes, your faultless logic of "If it ain't in the constitution, I ain't have ta follow it!" is awesome. Keep trying to defend it, doesn't matter what you say, it's still illegal to not uphold your duty of care.

wtf? i'm not saying i WOULDN'T do anything! you're accusing me of defending these people and their actions and of being a spineless coward!

i'm not saying it's okay, because it's NOT! i'm just saying that it sucks that legally THEY CAN'T BE FAULTED FOR DOING NOTHING!

believe me, if someone was about to be shot up with an AK47 and you had the chance to intervene, would you do it? knowing that, in the process, you AND the person about to be shot would both die if you DID intervene? probably not.

if someone was about to be mugged with a knife and you had a chance to stop them from being stabbed knowing you WILL be slashed or stabbed in the process and probably not even get out of it alive because the person doing to mugging is much more formidable than you, would you do it? more likely than not, no.

self-preservation is an instinct that is powerful enough to prevent you from doing MANY great deeds.

sure we say now "IF I WAS THERE I WOULDA STOPPED IT!"

but once we're IN such a situation, we don't. we're scared, we want to hide, we want to run.

i know i wouldn't only because i HAVE fought tooth and nail to help others in need. and i've paid for it both legally and physically.

so i'm not trying to be some bigot who just hides behind the constitution. because i hate when people do that, i hate people who cower and flee or just let something happen because it's "not their problem" or they "agree with it"

but i'm pointing out that this world sucks because even the heroes get punished more often than not. so don't call this my "your view of "I don't have to do anything"" because it's not mine. it's just what the average person thinks and its THEIR defense for not doing anything.

so please, put your accusation finger away, there are others who deserve it, but not i.

 

[Kortney]

It's kind of upsetting to me looking at all the people on this site who are defending the staff for not doing anything. But, I guess that's the world we live in now. These days, being an employee of McDonalds is as much as a reason as you need to let someone be degraded and assaulted in public.

The nerve of those people, wanting to keep their only means of making money.

Yes, because calling the police and/or trying to stop the fight would have automatically resulted in them being fired?

You really believe this? You think this is company policy? Really?

I can't believe the amount of people who have fallen for that awful excuse.

Calling the police is required, and was done.

Stepping in the physically stop the fight is guaranteed termination on the spot.

Some people need money more then gratitude. This is the real world, not a fantasy land where everyone can be a vigilante. Not only if you physically step in to stop the fight, you can sued by the attacker for inciting.

I never said anything about physically stepping in. You are jumping way to the other extreme.

snip

Ehhhhh. Shoosh.

If you were to walk down the street tomorrow night and see a man being beaten to death and lying in the street - yet you keep on walking, you would be charged with serious offenses due to failure to act and negligence. Sorry. Same deal if this girl was seriously hurt. But she wasn't, so yeah, you wouldn't be charged in this particular incident - but your view of "I don't have to do anything" is completely wrong.

But yes, your faultless logic of "If it ain't in the constitution, I ain't have ta follow it!" is awesome. Keep trying to defend it, doesn't matter what you say, it's still illegal to not uphold your duty of care.

Again, how do you owe a random stranger a "duty of care"? I'm not saying its right, but I saw someone being beat up, I have to intervine, even if it puts my life in danger?

Argh! Why are you all coming out of the woodwork haha.

It's the law. Don't ask me why. I'm not God, I don't know why! It just is! It isn't a moral debate - it is just reality! You have a duty of care to everyone you pass when you walk down the street. If you don't do anything when something serious is happening you are charged as a criminal. Stop quoting me. It falls under negligence or carelessness. In this particular case, no, you wouldn't be charged for it (because no serious, permanent harm was done). But to suggest you have no responsibility with events like these is ridiculous and more importantly it is down right WRONG. INCORRECT. NOT TRUE. THE OPPOSITE OF REALITY. Thank you!.

I'm way too tired for this!

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

People talking about how the employees were right to not step in because of the threat of losing a minimum wage job in this thread disgust me. If somebody is being beaten to death in front of you and you do nothing then you murdered them just as much as the person who physically beat them did.

Fuck the whole individualist ideology that leads people to believe that self interest is a valid excuse to permit a hate crime to occur feet from you without taking action. It is not. The majority who stand by and do nothing, even though they could, are the true downfall of society. Not the small minority actually carrying out the violent act. Because if the majority were not so damningly apathetic the minority would not be a problem in the first place.

Arrest or fine those who did nothing. Execute those who carried out the hate crime. That is the best solution I can think of to this situation.

 

[Mad1Cow]

To all the people that are saying, "The employees shouldn't have stepped in, because they could loose their jobs", why can't they call the police behind the desk or something out of view of the assailants? I'm not saying it's their fault, but obviously when someone can clearly record it on their phone, I'd have been trying to call the police instead...though that's just me...I call the police when a fly casts an ominous shadow during the night [/sarcasm]

This obviously has nothing to do with transgendered in my opinion, but considering the people who were just blatantly hurting her for doing nothing, I'm willing to say let the laywers try to make them stay off the streets longer. While I still believe that the death sentance is too harsh for any reason, no amount of support is going to change those horrible people, so whatever keeps them seperate from society the better...

 

[Kerra]

So this is former guy who got beat up by a bunch of girls?

Yeah, pretty much.

...and your points are?

Their points are that a guy got beat up by a bunch of girls.

It's only an issue because the guy wants to be a girl.

Say it all you want that transgirls arent really girls, the medical field and the law says we are

 

[Velocity Eleven]

So this is former guy who got beat up by a bunch of girls?

Yeah, pretty much.

...and your points are?

Their points are that a guy got beat up by a bunch of girls.

It's only an issue because the guy wants to be a girl.

no, she's a transwoman, therefore she's a girl

 

[Escapefromwhatever]

Once, journos used to say "transgendered man" if born male. Then they started doing the opposite. Now you just can't figure.

Welcome from your time machine. Rule # 1 of the future- don't talk about the future. Rule # 2 of the future- Shit changes and often for the better. Learn to deal with it.

So this is former guy who got beat up by a bunch of girls?

Yeah, pretty much.

...and your points are?

Their points are that a guy got beat up by a bunch of girls.

It's only an issue because the guy wants to be a girl.

She's a woman. Her brain is that way, her body is now, she's a woman socially. You...you know what? I'm not going to defend our existence every time I see a post like this. If you're going to make these sort of claims, at least back them up. Go do some research. Spend some time in the

Spoiler: chamber of understanding

]

.

But I do have some other things concerning this string of posts to address.
1) The victim appeared to be on female hormones. Therefore, her muscle mass would have been reduced from that of a man's and she wouldn't have been as strong as she used to be. While it is not pathetic for a man to be beaten up by a woman- such views are sexist and antiquated, as anyone is capable of successfully attacking anyone else given the right strategy-this doesn't even fall into that category. Even if you don't feel that the victim was a "real woman," she was on about the same level of strength as the women who attacked her.
2) "It's only an issue because the guy wanted to be a girl." I don't know, let's imagine it was a biological woman who was attacked. "Woman Beaten to Near Death in McDonald's, Has Seizure, Employees Do Nothing" seems like it could be made into an issue for the sake of spicy news. SOMEONE ALMOST DIED- that's the issue.

 

[CM156_v1legacy]

It's kind of upsetting to me looking at all the people on this site who are defending the staff for not doing anything. But, I guess that's the world we live in now. These days, being an employee of McDonalds is as much as a reason as you need to let someone be degraded and assaulted in public.

The nerve of those people, wanting to keep their only means of making money.

Yes, because calling the police and/or trying to stop the fight would have automatically resulted in them being fired?

You really believe this? You think this is company policy? Really?

I can't believe the amount of people who have fallen for that awful excuse.

Calling the police is required, and was done.

Stepping in the physically stop the fight is guaranteed termination on the spot.

Some people need money more then gratitude. This is the real world, not a fantasy land where everyone can be a vigilante. Not only if you physically step in to stop the fight, you can sued by the attacker for inciting.

I never said anything about physically stepping in. You are jumping way to the other extreme.

snip

Ehhhhh. Shoosh.

If you were to walk down the street tomorrow night and see a man being beaten to death and lying in the street - yet you keep on walking, you would be charged with serious offenses due to failure to act and negligence. Sorry. Same deal if this girl was seriously hurt. But she wasn't, so yeah, you wouldn't be charged in this particular incident - but your view of "I don't have to do anything" is completely wrong.

But yes, your faultless logic of "If it ain't in the constitution, I ain't have ta follow it!" is awesome. Keep trying to defend it, doesn't matter what you say, it's still illegal to not uphold your duty of care.

Again, how do you owe a random stranger a "duty of care"? I'm not saying its right, but I saw someone being beat up, I have to intervine, even if it puts my life in danger?

Argh! Why are you all coming out of the woodwork haha.

It's the law. Don't ask me why. I'm not God, I don't know why! It just is! It isn't a moral debate - it is just reality! You have a duty of care to everyone you pass when you walk down the street. If you don't do anything when something serious is happening you are charged as a criminal. Stop quoting me. It falls under negligence or carelessness. In this particular case, no, you wouldn't be charged for it (because no serious, permanent harm was done). But to suggest you have no responsibility with events like these is ridiculous and more importantly it is down right WRONG. INCORRECT. NOT TRUE. THE OPPOSITE OF REALITY. Thank you!.

I'm way too tired for this!

Perhaps we are dealing with different laws. From my understanding of law, in the Untied States, I don't owe a random stranger a duty of care. Case in point: my father is a doctor. If he passes someone choking on the ground, he is not obligated to do anything. He walks away, says nothing, then nothing can happen to him. If he becomes involved, he becomes liable. I would blame our "sue happy" culture in the USA for the reasons people are hesitant to become involved.

 

[Kerra]

Once, journos used to say "transgendered man" if born male. Then they started doing the opposite. Now you just can't figure.

Welcome from your time machine. Rule # 1 of the future- don't talk about the future. Rule # 2 of the future- Shit changes and often for the better. Learn to deal with it.

Transgendered Woman or Transgirl/woman = A person who goes from male to female

Transgendered Man or Transboy/man = A person who goes from female to male

 

[Kerra]

Perhaps we are dealing with different laws. From my understanding of law, in the Untied States, I don't owe a random stranger a duty of care. Case in point: my father is a doctor. If he passes someone choking on the ground, he is not obligated to do anything. He walks away, says nothing, then nothing can happen to him. If he becomes involved, he becomes liable. I would blame our "sue happy" culture in the USA for the reasons people are hesitant to become involved.

A good point, i can understand why people would be hesitant to help when our legal system allows something like a car crash victim to sue their rescuer because they later became paralysed.

Its a very very flawed system that puts financial gain above what is right