Two students make a racist video, in blackface. Will they get kicked out?
- Thread starter idarkphoenixi
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If you really want to here you go [http://www.skytube2.com/video/Rachel_Cooper_and_Jessica_Heid_VIDEO]. I think "hate speech" isn't really a good way to describe it. Probably "stupid speech" is better.Mr F. said:
I wouldn't know about the black/brown thing - I don't have a lot of experience with those videos but I assumed that reporting the video would result in YouTube pulling it down - they don't really monitor each and every upload. Similar to how mods here operate. Or are they reluctant to pull a video even after it was reported?Mr F. said:
Yeah, I'm honestly surprised how many people confuse "free speech" with "I can say anything and nobody is even allowed to do anything about it".Mr F. said:
I'm sorry but to everyone saying they should be expelled, I have a question; Should the masses of overtly racist responses from the black community to the video on youtube also be expelled from their respective schools? Unless your answer is yes then you have some form of agenda against the girls.
OT: I don't think they should be expelled, I do think they should be required to take 2 mandatory Black Social Science classes, with one of them being something that focuses on the history of black oppression in America. If they refuse then they can be expelled. I don't think this was an accident as they say, there is no reason to keep the video around, let alone allow it to be posted to youtube if it was just an accidental thing, so some form of punishment should be required (apart from a formal apology).
OT: I don't think they should be expelled, I do think they should be required to take 2 mandatory Black Social Science classes, with one of them being something that focuses on the history of black oppression in America. If they refuse then they can be expelled. I don't think this was an accident as they say, there is no reason to keep the video around, let alone allow it to be posted to youtube if it was just an accidental thing, so some form of punishment should be required (apart from a formal apology).
But yes, throw them out equally. Racism in every way is effen disgraceful and should be punished, the skin colour of the person saying that shit does not matter.barbzilla said:
Maybe it's me not being from the USA, but I think it is scary that so many people think that hatespeech is covered by free speech.
Unless they performed this blackface thing in class, during school hours, then the university should not have any reason to so much as reprimand them, much less kick them out. This is like the people who get fired for saying "My boss sucks" on facebook and then their boss sees. It is incredibly stupid, sure, but as long as you are doing something, that is not illegal, on your own time and it does not harm anyone, you should have the right to do it. That's what free speech is about. You can act like a moron all you want on your free time as long as you don't hurt anyone.idarkphoenixi said:
I am not condoning their actions at all. I'm sure it's about as offensive as I imagine it is. But, if they live in the US, they have all the right in the world to do it.
All speech is covered by free speech, so long as it is not directly harming someone, or inciting people into violence against someone.N3squ1ck said:
"God hates queers! You're all gonna burn in hell" is fine.
"Hey, let's go kill that ******!" is not.
Most decent Americans aren't fond of how certain types of people walk right along the line, and borderline abuse their right, but it is their right. If a few idiots being able to show how backwards and stupid they are is the tradeoff for everyone else being able to honestly speak their minds about anything they want, then I think that's more than acceptable.
They're poking fun at stereotypes. They're not discriminating anyone, are they?
Sure, it's crude humour. Incredibly crude. Offensively crude. They should probably apologise. But they didn't incite hatred at all. This isn't hatespeech. This is kids trying to be funny and missing the mark.
But I might be missing something, I never really understood why "blackface" is such a huge deal in the US.
Sure, it's crude humour. Incredibly crude. Offensively crude. They should probably apologise. But they didn't incite hatred at all. This isn't hatespeech. This is kids trying to be funny and missing the mark.
But I might be missing something, I never really understood why "blackface" is such a huge deal in the US.
If you say throw them out equally then I am okay with you. I think it might be a bit harsh, but at least I can agree with you on a fundamental level.N3squ1ck said:
As for free speech, it is often abused in peoples minds. Free Speech is not the freedom to say what you want, it is the ability to get across ideas without being silenced by your government. Hate speech meanwhile is illegal and fully punishable by the government, so please educate thy selves (not pointed at you obviously as you are making the same point).
I don't know why you keep using that phrase, I guess you picked it up in a news article and now incessantly parrot it to appear clever.Kinguendo said:
To address your point though: both the city and area I live in have a broad representation of culture and ethnicity, due to several universities being nearby and a number of densely packed ethnic communities.
I can only assume you are American --or at least not from Britain-- because you seem to have fuck all idea what the population here consists of, despite what your arrogance proclaims.
You guess wrong.rob_simple said:
No, I am British. The reason I assumed you were from America is because they have a larger black community per capita than Britain... I was actually gifting you the benefit of the doubt and increases the odds of you living near black people. I know exactly what I speak of, and avoiding naming the city in which you live only shows intellectual dishonesty... you dare not reveal it lest the truth about the populace of that area be revealed with it and you are proven wrong.
Dismissive of presented evidence that disagrees with his opinions, bloody hell I'm loosing count here. Lets recap.Kinguendo said:
1) Violent tendencies
2) Arrogant
3) Snarky
4) Obsession with intellectual superiority
5) Dismissive of anything that suggests failings on their part.
I'd say call your therapist, tell him he's a rich man.
What evidence? You assumed something, I said no. Given that your assumption was about me and I am the leading authority on me and I said no, it should have stopped there... but NOOOOO, Captain Ironic Arrogance cant let something go until he has won a war of attrition.Carsus Tyrell said:
Now I advise you give up as you have wandered into reportable territory, you arent discussing the subject. You just list insults and claim they are true... Like I said, give up.
Ok I'm going to have to stop this here before one/both of us gets warned. Honestly mate, everything past the first post was just me yanking your chain a bit. Although in my defence you made it very easy for me.Kinguendo said:
So yeah, sorry about all that.
I generally don't advocate the death penalty. But someone really needs to round up every reporter in the world and put them in front of a firing squad.
The way that stupid shit gets blown out of proportion while real screwups that destroys the lives of real people is barely touched upon is just retarded and that falls solely on the hands of the media.
Speculate away billions? Run economy into the ground? Order strike that accidentaly kills 10 civilians? Cover up shady arms deal with Saudi Arabia? It's all cool.
Post stupid youtube video? Misspeak in speech? Have marital troubles? Make joke in bad-taste? To the chair!
The western world would have alot better leaders if the media focused on revealing all the crooks and incompetent rich bastards that are in positions of power rather than dig into the private lives of people (sometimes, as in this case, not even public people) rooting around for "dirty" secrets so we can have our scandal of the week.
The way that stupid shit gets blown out of proportion while real screwups that destroys the lives of real people is barely touched upon is just retarded and that falls solely on the hands of the media.
Speculate away billions? Run economy into the ground? Order strike that accidentaly kills 10 civilians? Cover up shady arms deal with Saudi Arabia? It's all cool.
Post stupid youtube video? Misspeak in speech? Have marital troubles? Make joke in bad-taste? To the chair!
The western world would have alot better leaders if the media focused on revealing all the crooks and incompetent rich bastards that are in positions of power rather than dig into the private lives of people (sometimes, as in this case, not even public people) rooting around for "dirty" secrets so we can have our scandal of the week.
This is so stupid.
Oh the outrage. Control freaks & hypocritical liberal nutbags. youdontsay.gif
I don't even have to watch the video to know everyone is overreacting.
You want to get angry, get fucking angry at something that matters. The shit "media" tells you how to feel, and you just sop it up like it's tasty gravy. "Oh yes master, I will get angry. Yes master, I want that person to die. I want you to ruin their lives master, yes master, please."
Oh the outrage. Control freaks & hypocritical liberal nutbags. youdontsay.gif
I don't even have to watch the video to know everyone is overreacting.
You want to get angry, get fucking angry at something that matters. The shit "media" tells you how to feel, and you just sop it up like it's tasty gravy. "Oh yes master, I will get angry. Yes master, I want that person to die. I want you to ruin their lives master, yes master, please."
...Or, maybe I just don't want the entire internet to know where I live, did you ever consider that?Kinguendo said:
I also don't understand why you think I'd have any desire to justify my actions in your eyes. Whether or not you agree with what I did, it was a joke, in no way meant to incite hatred, and it was taken as such. What I did was in poor taste, but no more so than Sacha Baron Cohen pretending to be a functionally retarded Kazakhstani or an overly camp German fashionista or, more recently, a brutal middle-eastern dictator. It's a joke, not a dick: don't take it so hard.
I do think it's cute, though, that you seem to think you know the exact population of every area in the entirety of Britain.
To not RESPECT someone, sure, but he specifically said "Making second-class citizens." As in, being treated differently under the law or being, say, kicked out of freaking university, for something that you can't even consciously control. (Edit: You don't really have conscious control over having prejudice, to clarify)Spot1990 said:
The girls likely lived in a white world their whole life. Maybe you've never been to a college campus, but this next image basically sums up your typical upper class sheltered white girl:
The best treatment for casual/insensitive racism (assuming it's determined that racism was involved) is not goddamn expulsion or social exclusion, but to KEEP them at university so they can be exposed to a variety of cultures.
Even then, in relation to the topic, their video wasn't even bad, nor do they themselves seem like "hurr evil racists," just pathetically unfunny. The solution is NOT to have the media harp on them or to make them social outcasts.
Edit: This man sums up my opinion well:
Atrocious Joystick said:
Will they get kicked out? Or is the most the university should be able to ask of them a public apology?
No. Fuck these kids. Everyone is saying that, terrible as it is, it doesn't justify getting kicked out and so on, and I can sympathize with that train of thought to a point. However, I am almost sure that there is a fine print policy somewhere in the U of M student handbook that says something along the lines of "we reserve the right to kick you the fuck out if you make our school look bad." Even if I agreed with these people 100%, I wouldn't be stupid enough to do something like this. Fuck these kids. I am sure I'd hate them if I met them in real life. If they are booted from the school, the school will gain a bit of credibility. The rest of us will see that this kind of racist shit (even if you think it's not so bad) doesn't have a happy ending. It will make an effective example. It will protect the higher education community from at least 2 unfunny ignorant morons. Fuck these kids. This doesn't need to be an important matter for media focus. The story should start and end in the same sentence: "dumbass kids made a blackface viral video, and were obviously expelled." Anyone saying anything in their defense regarding protecting their privacy is forgetting that this is an issue because the students purposely put themselves into the public eye, to be watched as they made fools of themselves. Fuck these kids.
No. Fuck these kids. Everyone is saying that, terrible as it is, it doesn't justify getting kicked out and so on, and I can sympathize with that train of thought to a point. However, I am almost sure that there is a fine print policy somewhere in the U of M student handbook that says something along the lines of "we reserve the right to kick you the fuck out if you make our school look bad." Even if I agreed with these people 100%, I wouldn't be stupid enough to do something like this. Fuck these kids. I am sure I'd hate them if I met them in real life. If they are booted from the school, the school will gain a bit of credibility. The rest of us will see that this kind of racist shit (even if you think it's not so bad) doesn't have a happy ending. It will make an effective example. It will protect the higher education community from at least 2 unfunny ignorant morons. Fuck these kids. This doesn't need to be an important matter for media focus. The story should start and end in the same sentence: "dumbass kids made a blackface viral video, and were obviously expelled." Anyone saying anything in their defense regarding protecting their privacy is forgetting that this is an issue because the students purposely put themselves into the public eye, to be watched as they made fools of themselves. Fuck these kids.
Contradictory statement... either you are tlaking to just me here or the entire internet. You first sentence claims you dont want the entire internet knowing (exaggeration) and then go on to say that you have no desire to justify your actions to me when clearly your comments are being read by THE ENTIRE INTERNET!rob_simple said:
Was it taken as such? I didnt take it as such... and no one is ever the only one who has done something. And Sacha Baron Cohen does what he does to cause tension and frustration, so poor choice of comparison there.
I think its cute (not cute, I mean something more insulting) that you forget that we are on the internet... literally, right now.