Seanfall said:
....okay so you take my comment out of context and apply it to everyone with a handicap? Your seriously comparing war vets, and jews to a fucking pedophile? ...holy shit...everyone on this site has their head up their asses. Fine you bleeding heart idiots win. I'll stop posting that someone who raped a kid deserves a harsh punishment. I mean expecting someone who raped a 9 year old and then kept doing it for 2 years should be put away for at least life is obviously a crazy thing to say. No much better we reform him, hey about we give him a job cleaning bathrooms in an elementry school. After all...he's only a pedophile.
TLDR: You people are nuts. I'm sick of defending my beliefs.
You got a warning for that... really? xD
Guess one of the Mods doesn't like you. Ignorant (lack of knowlage) that post may be I wouldn't give you a warning for ignorance. I'd try to educate you.
OK here is a long shot but I'll try none the less.
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We as a human being are made from 2 different things:
1) Our DNA which we inherited.
2) Our environment which shapes us. This includes our physical surroundings (ie a house or a cave, warmth or cold) but also the people around us and our interactions with them.
If I've lost you or you don't understand that, stop reading... there is no point. Hopefully you haven't stopped though.
Our Brain is incredibly complex and consists of the same DNA environment mix but the environmental impact is much much more. We adapt to our surroundings and our understandings of them. Language, culture, the notions of; trust, love, bonds with individuals like parents and siblings.
This is cause and effect.
An example of this in humans. If the mother does not hold the child when young, does not form a bond with the child and no one else forms the motherly bond with the child then in later life said individual will find it hard forming relationships with others, and may have "problems" staying loyal to someone in a relationship. Also if said individual becomes a parent... they won't know how to make a bond with their child unless they are helped to by their partner, their life experiences or... someone else.
So the person wasn't hugged as a child and that lead to a different individual detached more from relationships bla bla etc etc.
So... what causes someone to become a paedophile?
DNA and enviroment.
There has been a glitch in the Matrix of the noggin...
Here is something from my local newspaper:
http://www.herefordtimes.com/news/9376096.SAS_soldier_convicted_of_child_abuse_charges/
Soldiers are a key example of things going weird with the brain. Men who are taught for years and years of their life to become the most effective killing machines on the planet. Taught to ignore emotion and to make killing an instinct.
You then let these people loose onto the streets and expect things to be just fine?
My dad was in the sas and is now a full time alcoholic, unable to cope with everything he has done in his lifetime. He then drinks to make the screaming in his head stop (not literally).
The soldier in the article... after his service... for some reason abused children... why? I dunno because I'm not him. However we as we are judge this man to be evil and lock him away?
Why do we think he is the problem... this is what he was he was turned into by his nation. He joined the army and its likely that this contributed to him ruining the lives of innocent children.
There are 2 other common reasons for the urge to do this to children... or rape in general (but raping a child is both worse and rarer).
Genes which... you can't help with that problem... not yet... not yet.
Abuse as a child. Its strange at first but... anger breeds anger, violence breeds violence and... Sexual Abuse breeds sexual abuse under certain conditions. Those conditions being, no one knows about the abuse for a long~ish period of time and the damage is done to the child. If its found about early on then a councillor can be brought into the scenario and the damage limited significantly.
The fact still remains though that feeling such things are not a persons fault, but how a person has been constructed. Those problems being caused by the problems or faults of others and so on and so... considering that it's a rather good surprise that we've pulled ourselves up so far out of the dirt...
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Considering this... why do we punish people?
Deterrents!
To say "if you do this, you will be punished" means some of those who would have taken an action will not.
If you do not punish people then... there is no deterrent and(example) you could kill people at will... which is silly.
However deterrents only do so much. People ignore deterrents for one reason or the other.
It's a mistake to think most who commit crimes of this nature believe they won't be caught... as you have quite a few repeat offenders. They know they may be able to dodge a bullet or two my chance but it's just that... chance. If someone digs deep into a situation or a victim speaks out they get caught. "It is only very, very stupid people who think the law is stupid".
When deterrents fail you need back up systems and counter-measures.
When someone gets caught get them in a cell and have the child seen to with councillors and psychologists as a means of damage limitation.
Now the offender is in a cell... what to do with them... that is the question.
First option is the simple "Kill them" option. This is outdated, Medieval and frankly barbaric. The idea these people are evil is a superstitious Religious one at best that suggests we control ourselves solely through our spirits... which is bullshit to an incredibly large extent and most of the time we are a product constructed by others who is then let out to run around freely.
The supporting argument to this is that these people will never be cured and are a public menace. We could keep them forever imprisoned or kill them off, and killing them saves on resources.
Public menace in their current form. Yes. They are damaging people by abusing them and ruining part of their lives. The effects of that will be felt for possibly generations down the line due to the effects it has breeds on the persons offspring and so on and so forth.
Drain on resources? Here we come to my comparison between those in wheelchairs and Paedophiles. A lot of people who are in wheelchairs are a burden in some form or another on society. In the western world we are happily able to fit them into our society and give them meaningful existences to unquestioningly justify their existence. However not all. Some cases it would be argued by a supporter of Eugenics that they should be "removed" to make way for more appropriate people.
People who's condition may be no fault of their own removed from society for something that impedes them as a value to it... sound familiar?
If you think these people should be killed... just say so... both groups... you don't get to pick and choose as that would be hypocritical. Both are in effect that same but one is more damaging to society and is demonized as well... (religion popping up again). The argument for getting rid of one however is the same as the other. (I'd keep both btw)
Second option is to let them rot in prison. Err... pardon? Firstly they are a human being and to put them in prison until they die... they hold some responsibility but not enough to warrant a life of containment within a prison. Secondly they are a body sitting in a cell doing fuck all which could be doing anything else. It makes no sense to keep them in prison unless you simply cannot release them into the general public ever again... which brings us back to the first "final solution" which... yeah.
Thrid option is Prison then rehabilitation. As said earlier if we don't have deterrents even as ineffective as they have proven themselves to be there would be more crimes than if they were there. They serve a sentence but then a treated like anyone else who has a mental disorder. The video I linked in my previous post is one method of doing this. The people are kept in an open but safe facility where the offenders stay in an environment where they cannot harm the rest of society but are a lot more free than a prison. Them having been in prison then servers as an encouragement to cooperate in their own rehabilitation. If without doubt they have been cured of their urges (which can be tested through means of pupil dilation, sweat, erectile signs) then they can be reintegrated with society in a location without a unnecessary abundance of children. Also if or when reintegrated the individual should not suffer temptation or access to children so no I'd never let someone convicted of sexually abusing or even harassing a child into a school... You'd have to be a fucking idiot to do that.
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Where I differ from you on this matter is simple... a good chunk of this is not their own fault it is that of someone elses or even just chance (DNA). People who do things like this are often far beyond saving but that never means you shouldn't attempt to help them as helping them is helping ourselves, future generations and will stop potential victims. you would happily demonize them and frankly I think you and people like you are part of the problem.
Rehabilitation can only happen if people see that they have a problem AND ARE WILLING TO COME FORWARD. If every time you hear the word Paedophile people reach for the pitchforks... no wonder people hide away... they hide themselves and their true feelings and thoughts... and when an opportunity comes forth they are overcome.
We need an environment where people can come forth if they have these thoughts and feelings and not be demonized by society outright for having them as they are not evil, and frankly not admitting them currently is merely self preservation. If people are able and encouraged to admit them then, they can get help before anything happens and we could save innocent children from harm, instead of picking up the pieces afterwards...
Think about this if you bother to read it... think about it very hard... thank that you and those like you may have passively caused children to suffer abuse... once you have thought about it... stop doing it and stop other when you see not helping the situation.
