USA health system... umm... what the hell?!

[conflictofinterests]

You know, despite the horror stories you hear, a hospital cannot refuse treatment of an emergency on basis of payment, and if you cannot pay up front they will give you options to pay later or waive your bill if you can prove your emergency bill is unpayable. That being said, I'd rather be handed a bill today than wait six months in line at bare minimum for a hip replacement. Also, I'm surprised you support a system where the "rich" can also take advantage of government aid when they in no way need it.

Not sure how often people can meet the proof requirement for the bill being "unpayable." Does that mean the bill has already bankrupted them? If so, isn't the relief of that debt a little late?

 

[Nieroshai]

You know, despite the horror stories you hear, a hospital cannot refuse treatment of an emergency on basis of payment, and if you cannot pay up front they will give you options to pay later or waive your bill if you can prove your emergency bill is unpayable. That being said, I'd rather be handed a bill today than wait six months in line at bare minimum for a hip replacement. Also, I'm surprised you support a system where the "rich" can also take advantage of government aid when they in no way need it.

Not sure how often people can meet the proof requirement for the bill being "unpayable." Does that mean the bill has already bankrupted them? If so, isn't the relief of that debt a little late?

No, that your income level shows there is no way you can pay the bill and still support yourself.

 

[Kpt._Rob]

Don't get me wrong, I hate it. But I also have a hatred of capitalism in general, so figure that one out. Still, here in America (and yes, I am a resident) capitalism has been put up on this pedestal as "the best possible system", along with representative democracy. We're taught that they're great since we were kids, and the vast majority of us never stop to question whether that's actually true or not.

What you get, of course, is a system in which doctors are, essentially, able to hold your life ransom until you cough up the dough. That's the kind of situation you get when you think that you should have to pay to live.

Not that there aren't flaws in any system, including the socialist system. Probably one of the big problems people have here with socialism is in relation to food stamps. I honestly didn't used to think they were a big deal, and I used to think that they were a good thing that helped people in need. Then I started working at Wal-Mart as a cashier, and it became all too obvious just how many people were abusing the system. I'm not even kidding, most of the time I can guess when someone's going to pay with food stamps just by looking at their cart. I can guess not because the people using food stamps look like they need them (very few of them do), but because those carts tend to be full of soda, chips, and more meat than should be in any healthy diet.

My assumption is that in this case a lot of the fear that people have is that if we have a socialized healthcare system, it will be abused too. And they may not be wrong. There are a lot of people here who are more than happy to try and game the system.

I would love to see a socialized healthcare system set up here, but before that can happen, America needs to rethink how it regulates social care systems. They're very important to our health as a nation, but they're also too easy to abuse at the current time.

 

[lacktheknack]

Just don't go into socialized medicine because that is even worse.

<sits in house in chair in front of computer listening to music, none of which would be possible if it wasn't for socialized Canadian Healthcare protecting me from tens of millions of dollars of debt, waiting for you to explain>

Actually, screw it. Nothing you say will ever make sense to me, because socialized healthcare saved my ass way too hard.

 

[Cheesus333]

I think the American approach to healing the human body can be best conveyed in a single image. Or, more appropriately, a single man:

For those who don't know, Dr. Bob Kelso is the tightfisted Chief of Medicine of Sacred Heart, the hospital that Scrubs is set in. Think Mr. Krabs if he was a doctor, and also Satan.

Of course, batting for the other team is Dr. Perry Cox. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr_Cox] And even then he's frequently shown to be a massive bastard.

Anyway, I live in the UK where you can either have crappy healthcare that the tax money pays for, or good healthcare that you pay for. I like it this way.

 

[conflictofinterests]

You know, despite the horror stories you hear, a hospital cannot refuse treatment of an emergency on basis of payment, and if you cannot pay up front they will give you options to pay later or waive your bill if you can prove your emergency bill is unpayable. That being said, I'd rather be handed a bill today than wait six months in line at bare minimum for a hip replacement. Also, I'm surprised you support a system where the "rich" can also take advantage of government aid when they in no way need it.

Not sure how often people can meet the proof requirement for the bill being "unpayable." Does that mean the bill has already bankrupted them? If so, isn't the relief of that debt a little late?

No, that your income level shows there is no way you can pay the bill and still support yourself.

How many people can argue that competently on their own? How many people would have to hire a lawyer to do that? Seems like a catch 22 to me.

 

[JochemDude]

It's socialism that America needs, not capitalism. I can only be glad I don't live in a country as the US.

 

[McNinja]

The system is entirely broken.
My own little foray into hospital medicine was a 30-minute out-patient procedure that will cost me almost $5,600 when it's finally paid-off.
30 minutes. $5,600, all out-of-pocket. I can't afford insurance.

I tried to establish what my costs would be before going into that, and everyone involved was completely evasive. I could get NO answer from ANYONE, except that costs "depended on a variety of factors." That's it. Not even a ballpark estimate of what I was getting myself into. My bill was received un-itemized, just a dollar figure for "OP Surgery," and my attempts to get an itemized listing of costs was incredibly time-consuming, and beyond difficult. It's like the hospital didn't want me to find out what they were charging me for.

I know someone who said that their itemization of their hospital costs included $200 for the "administration of 2 (two) aspirin. $200 to be handed a cup of TWO ASPIRIN

Aside from the ridiculously inflated costs, health insurance prices are insanely high cost per month ($300-400/month) to get a deductible under $30,000, and it seems that more often than not, any attempts to actually make an insurance claim when you need them most, will be REJECTED anyway.
It's paying endlessly into a system that just turns around and denies you coverage when you actually need it.

No wonder insurance companies lobby to keep the status-quo. These guys are reaping huge profits on the backs of normal people, and they want to make it MANDATED THAT EVERYONE BUY HEALTH INSURANCE?! wtf?

Every day I hear more and more and more that convinces me that the people we elect are in NO WAY interested in fulfilling the will of the people. They aim to fulfill only the profit motive of the biggest earners, and take their kickbacks in the form of "campaign financing" while the 99% of the rest of us serve as nothing more than vote fodder to be placated with words to ensure incumbency, so the cycle can continue.


--Yikes, guess I kind of launched into a rant, there.--

The thing about my insurance (and why I never, ever go to the doctor) is because the insurance I have has a $50 co-pay. Every time I go in, doesn't matter for what, I have to pay $50. It blows.

And I do agree the US health system is broken. I am not entirely against a universal health care system, but until people start getting over their elitism and egos (and party lines-I'm looking at you Congress) we will never get anywhere, and will just continue going down.

 

[ReincarnatedFTP]

American here.
It pisses me right the fuck off.
America is not even really too much of a first world nation.
I'll be proud of America gay marriage is legalized, the war on drugs is ended or severely curtailed, we're not in everybody's overseas engagements, Christianity (or any religion for that matter) isn't enforcing moral laws or playing a big part in politics such as abortion or countering teaching fucking science (evolution,global warming) in school, morons aren't voting based on "hurr muslims commies immigrants jesus" , labor is treated better and not like serfs, the fourth amendment gets some respect, and we have single payer healthcare or some form of UHC. Our culture is filled with "violence good sex drugs bad".

Also,
How many Americans think 9/11 was a government conspiracy?
How many Americans think vaccines cause autism?
How many Americans think the moon landing was a hoax?
How many think global warming is a hoax?
How many think gay is a choice?
How many believe Big Foot, the Loch Ness Monster, and alien abductions are real?
How many think blacks are inferior, Jews are inferior, women are inferior, Hispanics are inferior?
How many are fundamentally religious?
How many think "evolution is just a theory" is a valid criticism?

This country is completely idiotic.

 

[boringanarchy]

I agree. I think it's ridiculous that USA doesn't have socialized health care, nearly all other developed country has it. It has something to do with USA's deep-rooted fear of socialism and "Dem evil reds!" I think.

It's called corporate propaganda coupled with gullible peoples.

That and the fact that, as a rule in general, I'd rather a corporation do something than the government. I'd rather someone charge a high price than fuck it up.

 

[Nieroshai]

You know, despite the horror stories you hear, a hospital cannot refuse treatment of an emergency on basis of payment, and if you cannot pay up front they will give you options to pay later or waive your bill if you can prove your emergency bill is unpayable. That being said, I'd rather be handed a bill today than wait six months in line at bare minimum for a hip replacement. Also, I'm surprised you support a system where the "rich" can also take advantage of government aid when they in no way need it.

Not sure how often people can meet the proof requirement for the bill being "unpayable." Does that mean the bill has already bankrupted them? If so, isn't the relief of that debt a little late?

No, that your income level shows there is no way you can pay the bill and still support yourself.

How many people can argue that competently on their own? How many people would have to hire a lawyer to do that? Seems like a catch 22 to me.

No, you miss the point of submitting your income level. The Internal Revenue Service has your income on file because, well, they're the ones taxing your income. Then a patient's social security number can be used to request the income level of a patient in case of a dispute. To inquire farther, I honestly WOULD need to be a lawyer, but having gone through the process myself, I did not have to go into debt to see a doctor and I'm currently jobless.

 

[lacktheknack]

Just don't go into socialized medicine because that is even worse.

<sits in house in chair in front of computer listening to music, none of which would be possible if it wasn't for socialized Canadian Healthcare protecting me from tens of millions of dollars of debt, waiting for you to explain>

Actually, screw it. Nothing you say will ever make sense to me, because socialized healthcare saved my ass way too hard.

It's mostly about economics and keeping things stable. Socialized medicine really just cures the symptom at a massive cost. The symptom being the fact that people are in thousands of dollars in debt. Myself included. But I don't let my own events change my ideals. The real problem is that medical bills are so massively inflated because they can charge that much. What we really need to be focusing on is making medical bills more affordable. That way we don't end up thousands of dollars in debt without having economic instability. After we do that, then we can consider socialized medicine. But until then, the problem still exists.

>You: Thousands of dollars in debt
>Me: Not tens of millions of dollars in debt

Quite the symptom.

And while I agree that we should be deflating healthcare costs, I also think that taking it out of the hands of the private sector and into government hands would be a good start. The government isn't standing to make a profit, they just need to cover their costs. I don't normally endorse this, as I'm pro-capitalism, but I think healthcare and education should be government based.

Also, a larger movement to holistic healthcare may be in order. I heard of someone who couldn't afford a type of back surgery, and they got their problem fixed by a really good masseuse.

 

[Broax]

In Portugal healthcare is free... I had a couple of surgeries and didn't pay thing. My mother had cancer and all the treatments (including staying in the hospital for a month) was free. Even her funeral was free! There are a lot of things I really admire in the american people and in the USA as a country. The ONE thing I don't understand it's the poor politicians Americans have in the republican party.

The way this whole public healthcare was thing was taken care of is pitiful... I would much rather have higher taxes and free health (not to mention other things) then to be forced to go through what so many Americans have. America's health system is very close to a third world country. And I'm really sad that the Americans allow for such corrupt politicians to brainwash them away from such a vital thing for a nation.

Like I said, I don't have ANYTHING against Americans, I have a couple of American friends and I would love to be able to visit one day but your healthcare system is pitiful. The only thing worse then that is knowing that politicians actually make people believe their lies.

I do NOT understand how such a strong nation allows for this to happen. I have a hard time believing that things such as Fox News are actually taken seriously in the USA.

Oh well...

 

[sir.rutthed]

Ya, those campfire horror stories are true. My best friend was vomiting and urinating blood about a month ago, and when he went to the ER it was a 4 hour wait and they didn't treat him because he had no insurance. I wish that were the exception rather than the rule, but it's not. When my brother needed heart surgery my parents had insurance, but they still had to pay up thousands of dollars to cover the whole cost. On a clergyman's and public school employee's salaries no less. The system is broken, and the single best reason I can think of to move to Canada.

 

[jamesbrown]

The USA is seriously lost in various issues, if you (an austrian) followed our politics it gets very ugly. Washington D.C is currently swamped by corperate interests and profitering, our politians are very corrupt, I am not going to say who (red). obama's heathcare had a "public option" in it, but was scrapped because the republicans were scared we would become socialists (for international people republicans was pres. Nixons, and the pres. sr. and jr. Bushs party) and there was even an debate that it would lead to "death panels" where the government would sit in an room and decide who lives and who dies (crazy). But it passed without the public option. but that was 2 years ago, (americans forget quickly, look how much our politians flip-flop, within days even!) Now we are talking about how to fix our economy, (did you know in america, 90-97% of our economy is held by the top 2-3%?) Republicans are only saying we need to cut spending only, and democrats (pres. obama's and pres. clinton's party) are saying we need to use a balence of "revenue increases" and spending cuts.(did you know also in america, if you are in that top 2-3% you get very large tax cuts, Bush tax cuts anyone? Theres even a tax break if you own a corperate jet, like GE paid nothing on thier tax's in 2009) This debate over taxes for the rich got so bad minnisotas government shut down over it. Also this is just about our Debt, not about how to grow the economy, thats similair but even more twisted. here are some websites to be informed about the HISTORICAL part of america's politics.

http://www.politifact.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_reform_in_the_United_States
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/ <--- pretty non-bias
Also watch Daily Show and Colbert Report after being informed

 

[ReincarnatedFTP]

Also,
How many Americans think 9/11 was a government conspiracy?
How many Americans think vaccines cause autism?
How many Americans think the moon landing was a hoax?
How many think global warming is a hoax?
How many think gay is a choice?
How many believe Big Foot, the Loch Ness Monster, and alien abductions are real?
How many think blacks are inferior, Jews are inferior, women are inferior, Hispanics are inferior?
How many are fundamentally religious?

9/11 wasn't a conspiracy
Vaccines don't cause autism
The moon landing did happen
Global warming is real
Being gay is a matter of opinion

My point exactly.
Thank you for a little bit of hope.

I blame Edward Bernay and the way he perfected public relations manipulation.

 

[LCP]

I think the American approach to healing the human body can be best conveyed in a single image. Or, more appropriately, a single man:

For those who don't know, Dr. Bob Kelso is the tightfisted Chief of Medicine of Sacred Heart, the hospital that Scrubs is set in. Think Mr. Krabs if he was a doctor, and also Satan.

Of course, batting for the other team is Dr. Perry Cox. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr_Cox] And even then he's frequently shown to be a massive bastard.

Anyway, I live in the UK where you can either have crappy healthcare that the tax money pays for, or good healthcare that you pay for. I like it this way.

Pretty much...

However Everyone's at fault. Doctors, Insurance companies, and the people are at fault for tolerating this stupidity